91 réponses à ce sujet

[dreamgazer]

MassivelyEffective0730 wrote...

"People moved on with their lives" in the context I'm seeing simply means that the majority of people who played the games didn't have the level of investment in the series to really give a damn about much... They'd buy the game and move on.

I wouldn't go quite that far, but yeah.  I know it's hard to see outside the BSN bubble, but there are people who were invested in the series that really were "meh" about the ending, moved on, and will (probably) purchase the next game.  Less invested, yeah, but still invested. 

[MassivelyEffective0730]

EntropicAngel wrote...

shingara wrote...

 Edit, and btw did anyone else miss that clarity and closure cos i must have lost it under the bed.

Nope, it was in my Mass Effect 3 game.

I beat the Reapers. I gave my life. Clarity+closure right there.

I completely missed the clarity and closure. There was none to be had.

[MassivelyEffective0730]

dreamgazer wrote...

MassivelyEffective0730 wrote...

"People moved on with their lives" in the context I'm seeing simply means that the majority of people who played the games didn't have the level of investment in the series to really give a damn about much... They'd buy the game and move on.

I wouldn't go quite that far, but yeah.  I know it's hard to see outside the BSN bubble, but there are people who were invested in the series that really were "meh" about the ending, moved on, and will (probably) purchase the next game.  Less invested, yeah, but still invested. 

And I personally believe, deluded or not, that those are the people BW will be marketing the game towards.

[o Ventus]

MassivelyEffective0730 wrote...

And I personally believe, deluded or not, that those are the people BW will be marketing the game towards.

Yeah. All the "new people" they were catering to with the prerelease marketing. ME3 is a good place for beginners to start, after all.

[Mr. Gogeta34]

MassivelyEffective0730 wrote...

The quote people are referring to here is being taken out of context I think.

"People moved on with their lives" in the context I'm seeing simply means that the majority of people who played the games didn't have the level of investment in the series to really give a damn about much... They'd buy the game and move on.

Agreed to a point.  "Moving on" means they were invested and it bothered them, but they eventually found other things to do instead of complaining about a game.

[CronoDragoon]

Closure for me simply means the plot has been tied together and resolved, and you have a reasonable idea about the future of the characters - reasonable idea being something like "not stranded on a jungle planet."

[MassivelyEffective0730]

EntropicAngel wrote...

MassivelyEffective0730 wrote...

I completely missed the clarity and closure. There was none to be had.

It all really depends on what clarity and closure means to one.

"The Reapers are gone" is plenty of closure, clarity, for me. It clearly isn't for many.

I was really actually hoping and expecting a lot more. A lot more payout for my investment. A personalized ending that really showed not only how each plot/theme/story ended based on decisions with those choices, but how those choices were interconnected with each other. How different decisions played together to make different possibilities past the ending.

[MassivelyEffective0730]

Mr. Gogeta34 wrote...

MassivelyEffective0730 wrote...

The quote people are referring to here is being taken out of context I think.

"People moved on with their lives" in the context I'm seeing simply means that the majority of people who played the games didn't have the level of investment in the series to really give a damn about much... They'd buy the game and move on.

Agreed to a point.  "Moving on" means they were invested and it bothered them, but they eventually found other things to do instead of complaining about a game.

That's the arrogance and snideness that I'm intrinsically feeling. I don't know if it was intentional or not, but regardless of what I said, I get the vibe that that is one of the more subliminal meanings of the statement. 

And I do resent it.

[MassivelyEffective0730]

If there's one thing I want from BW, it'd be a little sit down chat where they discuss what they were trying to do with the ending and with the game overall. What their intent was and why they felt it was something that worked for the story. Just clear some air there.

[Kel Riever]

The thing is...'working hard' (and just another reference to 'loving what you do') does NOT mean you did a good job. I won't say that means a person didn't try, but to argue the results because one worked hard is just as much of a way to miss the point as any other kind of denial.

Whatever. The problem to me is that the fandom of the average employee seems to me to override an important level of self critique. That is aside from whatever necessary comments have to be made to save face, marketing, etc. But this is a band-aid and damn if it isn't the slowest band-aid rip off I have ever seen.

Besides of which there is the sum total point that has nothing to do with making errors and everything to do with fixing them which not only hasn't been done, but sounds like it continues to be sworn off. That's why this answer takes 10 or so minutes to say...because it basically isn't straight. I mean, I am not saying that the people talking are not trying, but I am saying that when you try to be political, and deny errors, and straw man it, and say other things like 'we worked really hard' than talk about the result...it is a giant convoluted mess that fails to answer the important questions.

Now should I draw lines of conclusion between that and the inability to 'fix' the endings with even more bad explanations? Hmmnnn.....

Good luck to these guys. I'm still not buying but they're going to need someone to.

[MassivelyEffective0730]

EntropicAngel wrote...

Kel Riever, several of the questions for the endings WERE answered in the EC. Things like the squadmates leaving on the beam run, the landing in the jungle, the relay explosion, really the whole entire tone of the ending.

I personally didn't like all of them--the squadmates running away when Shepard is hit by the beam is completely self-explanatory to me, same for the difference between an asteroid creaming a relay and a controlled, designed explosion--but you can't deny they gave explanations for those.

I won't say they half-assed those explanations, but I will say they really dug deep into the hat for the ones they decided to use.

I guess from a perspective standpoint, the explanations we got were, in many cases, just as bad as no explanation at all.

[Kel Riever]

EntropicAngel wrote...

Kel Riever, several of the questions for the endings WERE answered in the EC. Things like the squadmates leaving on the beam run, the landing in the jungle, the relay explosion, really the whole entire tone of the ending.

I personally didn't like all of them--the squadmates running away when Shepard is hit by the beam is completely self-explanatory to me, same for the difference between an asteroid creaming a relay and a controlled, designed explosion--but you can't deny they gave explanations for those.

Maybe a difference of opinion there and I'm willing to accept that.  Here's the thing...I waited for the EC before I finished the game.  And then I went back and saw the old endings.  So what didn't happen for me and did happen for some people is stuff got answered.  I didn't find the EC answered enough of the story, but sure, if I was wondering what exactly happened after the Normandy landed because I only had the original ending in my mind that got answered.

Its just that I found that even with all the explanation, that they were not answering the questions I had regardless of EC or original endings.  Example, code being the reason EDI and the geth had to be destroyed.  Or exactly why can't organics and synthetics get along again?  That's the kind of stuff that never got handled.  It wasn't, in other words, 'what happened after the Normandy crashed' for me.

[shingara]

EntropicAngel wrote...

shingara wrote...

 Edit, and btw did anyone else miss that clarity and closure cos i must have lost it under the bed.

Nope, it was in my Mass Effect 3 game.

I beat the Reapers. I gave my life. Clarity+closure right there.

 You know thats funny, cos i killed the reapers, i lived, edi lived and all was good, him over there sent everyone green, mice started talking to him and the reapers help redecorate, and her over there took over the reapers, rebuilt the mass relays then thought hell to it, im controlling the universe raa.

 So who is right ?

[wrdnshprd]

StreetMagic wrote...

dreamgazer wrote...

The reaction from the audience after she said that actually says a lot: laughter and applause.

I don't know if it says a lot. Who goes to these type of functions? I've been a gamer for almost 30 years, but never had the privilege to be at anything like that. Maybe I would if I lived closer or someone invited me, but in any case, it seems like a lot of these shows are full of insiders and major enthusiasts.

edit: Wait, I thought it was a general convention. It's the Gaymer one. I think you'd find even more enthusiastic Bioware support there than most places. Bioware's pretty inclusive and has a lot of loyal fans because of that.

its just a panel like at any other convention.. guess what, if you are going to a bioware panel at a convention.. WHICH IS OPEN TO ANYONE IN ATTENDANCE.. you are most likely a fan of bioware and their games.  is it really that out of reach that you are going to be "enthusiests"?  if you were at a convention, would YOU attend a panel where you had a dislike for a company or no interest in their game that they are presenting?  just a thought.

[Mr. Gogeta34]

Personally I'm just glad Bioware now views the response as overwhelmingly (or at least largely) negative.

[Dieb]

The part I didn't understand is the "different interpretations".

The endings honestly never struck me as leaving much room for interpretation, or encouraging the player to take the majority of events in any other way than just plain literally. You see what happens, you like it or you just don't. Maybe I am just being too pedantic about the difference in factual events and imagining future events that are not shown -thus may or may not happen- so anybody care to elaborate a bit on that?

P.S.: Also the "bar fight" metaphor captures my feelings quite accurately in most situations.

Modifié par Baelrahn, 14 août 2013 - 09:59 .