162 réponses à ce sujet

[Zanallen]

sandalisthemaker wrote...

I'll just repeat it again.
They could include people with Asian features in future games if they so please. They don't owe you or anyone else an explanation.

Albino is not a race. It is a genetic condition.

On that logic, Bioware could add miniature, flying pink elephants to the game and call them griffons. It is perfectly within their rights to do so. It would still be odd and class with the established lore and would merge better with some sort of explanation. Personally, I would be all for a new land discovered across the ocean populated by samurai-esque warriors. But I would also like some sort of explanation rather than just having them show up out of the blue.

[Volus Warlord]

It'd make for some interesting options with the CC.

Blasian rogue ftw.

[Fast Jimmy]

sandalisthemaker wrote...

Fast Jimmy wrote...

Fortlowe wrote...

I don't understand why in a realm where lady knights, oxmen, magic, homosexuality, dragons and elves are all taken as a given in the landscape, people of color have to be explained to be present. I completely resent the notion and find it a vile stance to take.

Skyrim is a realm where lady knights, lizardmen, magic, homosexuality, dragons and elves are all taken as a given in the landscape and people of color are totally fine there. Mainly because they established the lore to make it so.

Ultima had all of the above as well and it made total sense that people of color occupied Britania. 

Fallout had giant scorpions, super mutants and lazer pistols and people of color worked there fine as well, too.

I'm sorry you find that offensive, but I wouldn't want them to add machine guns or planes in the DA lore without at least some plausible explanation of why the game explained the scenario as one way and then changed it inexplicably the next.

The Elder Scrolls games have had their lore changed around and altered at whim plenty of times. Especially regarding the different races.  
Imperials went from a hodgepodge group with Nordic flavor, to their current Roman vibe for example.

I didn't say that TES games were flawless (or even good) with maintaining their own lore. But their lore does allow for people of color.

As does DA's, I might add. Again, the descriptions of the people of Rivain could easily account for Middle-Eastern or African real-life correlations. But in no description do any of the nationalities fit into what one would call "Asian" in their descript.

[wwwwowwww]

I hope the skin tones are flushed out a bit better, seemed like last games the darker you got the more absurd looking they got.

With this I'd like a zoom feature on character build also, so I can zoom in more when dealing in particular with the eyes.

[sandalisthemaker]

Zanallen wrote...

sandalisthemaker wrote...

I'll just repeat it again.
They could include people with Asian features in future games if they so please. They don't owe you or anyone else an explanation.

Albino is not a race. It is a genetic condition.

On that logic, Bioware could add miniature, flying pink elephants to the game and call them griffons. It is perfectly within their rights to do so. It would still be odd and class with the established lore and would merge better with some sort of explanation. Personally, I would be all for a new land discovered across the ocean populated by samurai-esque warriors. But I would also like some sort of explanation rather than just having them show up out of the blue.

There is a human element here that posts such as yours disregard. White people are included as the default. The idea that minority-looking characters, whatever that minority may be, can't be seen in a game without some sort of explanation for their existence is rather troubling.

Modifié par sandalisthemaker, 15 août 2013 - 01:59 .

[Nefla]

There's nothing in the lore that says there are no Asian people in Thedas. Just because different ethnicities weren't correctly modeled in previous games (there were many different skin/eye/hair colors the character models just weren't racially distinct) doesn't mean they can't exist and can't be accurately rendered in DA:I or future games.

[sandalisthemaker]

krul2k wrote...

siiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiigh here wee go the minority flag, honestly where does it stop

Minority representation may not be important to you, but that doesn't mean it isn't important to others.

[Volus Warlord]

krul2k wrote...

siiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiigh here wee go the minority flag, honestly where does it stop

I think it's about options in the CC more than "waa oppressed minority" 

[Fast Jimmy]

sandalisthemaker wrote...

Zanallen wrote...

sandalisthemaker wrote...

I'll just repeat it again.
They could include people with Asian features in future games if they so please. They don't owe you or anyone else an explanation.

Albino is not a race. It is a genetic condition.

On that logic, Bioware could add miniature, flying pink elephants to the game and call them griffons. It is perfectly within their rights to do so. It would still be odd and class with the established lore and would merge better with some sort of explanation. Personally, I would be all for a new land discovered across the ocean populated by samurai-esque warriors. But I would also like some sort of explanation rather than just having them show up out of the blue.

There is a human element here that posts such as yours disregard. White people are included as the default. The idea that minority-looking characters can't be seen in a game without some sort of explanation for their existance is rather troubling.

If the explanation was given in the first place, it wouldn't need further explaining. Bioware did not do that. 

If the limitation was truly technical in nature, Bioware has had numerous other outlets that they have continued their story and lore in, such as books, comics and animes. To date, they have not found a way to introduce different races or ethnicities outside of, again, the Rivani (which, based on Isabella schizophrenic skin tone, is problematic in consistency as well). 

Is your problem with me, who is saying introduction of new races, whether they be Asian or Ant-men, should have an in-story reason? Or with Bioware, who has not opened the door for more racial diversity in their stories?

Modifié par Fast Jimmy, 15 août 2013 - 02:05 .

[Scarlet Rabbi]

sandalisthemaker wrote...

Fast Jimmy wrote...


To date, no established nationality has included any people with features that would be remotely described as Asian. Or Albino. Or what have you. So if they did want to introduce different nationality features, they should do so with a previously unknown nation.

I'll just repeat it again.
They could include people with Asian features in future games if they so please. They don't owe you or anyone else an explanation.

Albino is not a race. It is a genetic condition.

+1

[sandalisthemaker]

Fast Jimmy wrote...

sandalisthemaker wrote...

Zanallen wrote...

sandalisthemaker wrote...

I'll just repeat it again.
They could include people with Asian features in future games if they so please. They don't owe you or anyone else an explanation.

Albino is not a race. It is a genetic condition.

On that logic, Bioware could add miniature, flying pink elephants to the game and call them griffons. It is perfectly within their rights to do so. It would still be odd and class with the established lore and would merge better with some sort of explanation. Personally, I would be all for a new land discovered across the ocean populated by samurai-esque warriors. But I would also like some sort of explanation rather than just having them show up out of the blue.

There is a human element here that posts such as yours disregard. White people are included as the default. The idea that minority-looking characters can't be seen in a game without some sort of explanation for their existance is rather troubling.

If the explanation was given in the first place, it wouldn't need further explaining. Bioware did not do that. 

If the limitation was truly technical in nature, Bioware has had numerous other outlets that they have continued their story and lore in, such as books, comics and animes. To date, they have not found a way to introduce different races or ethnicities outside of, again, the Rivani (which, based on Isabella schizophrenic skin tone, is problematic in consistency as well). 

Is your problem with me, who is saying introduction of new races, whether they be Asian or Ant-men, should have an in-story reason? Or with Bioware, who has not opened the door for more racial diversity in their stories?

I have an issue with the idea that minoriy representation somehow needs an explanation.  Asians have been brought up specifically.  The idea that they *need* to come from somewhere 'far away and across the sea' in order to *Validate their existence* is troubling.

[sandalisthemaker]

J. Reezy wrote...

Volus Warlord wrote...

krul2k wrote...

siiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiigh here wee go the minority flag, honestly where does it stop

I think it's about options in the CC more than "waa oppressed minority" 

Exactly, but people had to turn it into a plea for social justice.

It needed to be done.
My sword of social justice has been unsheathed.

[Zanallen]

sandalisthemaker wrote...

There is a human element here that posts such as yours disregard. White people are included as the default. The idea that minority-looking characters, whatever that minority may be, can't be seen in a game without some sort of explanation for their existence is rather troubling.

I had no problem that there was only one white guy in all of the Jade Empire. The game is set in a factional analogue of ancient China. I wouldn't expect there to be a whole bunch of white, black, brown or purple guys running around. Just like I woudn't expect a bunch of white guys in a game set in an Aztec city. I like my games to make sense. If no asian people currently exist in Thedas, I think it would be weird for them to suddenly crop up with no explanation given. That being said, I am all for Bioware adding to the lore to include an asian culture or people with asian features.

[What a Succulent Ass]

J. Reezy wrote...

Exactly, but people had to turn it into a plea for social justice.

More like the thread is about the character creator, but people had to append essays and dissertations completely immaterial to the subject at hand. Come flying into a thread about humans talking about aerodynamic pink elephants. Ol' Lisa Frank-ass, Klasky-Csupo splaat looking-ass characters.

[Fast Jimmy]

sandalisthemaker wrote...

Fast Jimmy wrote...

sandalisthemaker wrote...

Zanallen wrote...

sandalisthemaker wrote...

I'll just repeat it again.
They could include people with Asian features in future games if they so please. They don't owe you or anyone else an explanation.

Albino is not a race. It is a genetic condition.

On that logic, Bioware could add miniature, flying pink elephants to the game and call them griffons. It is perfectly within their rights to do so. It would still be odd and class with the established lore and would merge better with some sort of explanation. Personally, I would be all for a new land discovered across the ocean populated by samurai-esque warriors. But I would also like some sort of explanation rather than just having them show up out of the blue.

There is a human element here that posts such as yours disregard. White people are included as the default. The idea that minority-looking characters can't be seen in a game without some sort of explanation for their existance is rather troubling.

If the explanation was given in the first place, it wouldn't need further explaining. Bioware did not do that. 

If the limitation was truly technical in nature, Bioware has had numerous other outlets that they have continued their story and lore in, such as books, comics and animes. To date, they have not found a way to introduce different races or ethnicities outside of, again, the Rivani (which, based on Isabella schizophrenic skin tone, is problematic in consistency as well). 

Is your problem with me, who is saying introduction of new races, whether they be Asian or Ant-men, should have an in-story reason? Or with Bioware, who has not opened the door for more racial diversity in their stories?

I have an issue with the idea that minoriy representation somehow needs an explanation.  Asians have been brought up specifically.  The idea that they *need* to come from somewhere 'far away and across the sea' in order to *Validate their existence* is troubling.

You are making a terrible assumption here. That minorities exist in our real life world is no good reason for them to exist in a fantasy world. There real life existence doesn't justify their existence in any form of media.

Jade Empire was an all-Asian cast. Because it was set in a world that mirrored ancient China (roughly) in its background. That included its culture, its architecture, its myths and the appearance of its people. When they brought the one white person into the game, they had to explain it then for narrative consistency. Because in that setting, white people were a minority.

I don't see why when the opposite is suggested (someone of completely different ethnicity showing up in a setting to be predominatnly white or, in the case of Rivain, darker toned) that asking for at least a plausible explanation for it is "troubling." I found no one finding Von Fontlebottom "troubling."

Modifié par Fast Jimmy, 15 août 2013 - 02:21 .

[sandalisthemaker]

krul2k wrote...

Out of interest why does there exclusion need to be validated? does every game that have humans present in them also need to have every race that is on planet Earth included

No. But most games don't anyway. 
http://tvtropes.org/.../HumansAreWhite

[Fast Jimmy]

sandalisthemaker wrote...

krul2k wrote...

Out of interest why does there exclusion need to be validated? does every game that have humans present in them also need to have every race that is on planet Earth included

No. But most games don't anyway. 
http://tvtropes.org/.../HumansAreWhite

Which is a shame. I'm being honest here - I don't think that's right.

But that ship has now sailed with DA. The lore has been laid out. Not to say things couldn't be done to explain changes in the appearance or ethnicities of NPCs down the road, but making such changes mid-story without acknowledging it is a poor move.

[Nefla]

krul2k wrote...

Out of interest why does there exclusion need to be validated? does every game that have humans present in them also need to have every race that is on planet Earth included

In North America, every race that is on this planet Earth IS included, it's what we see in our everyday lives. Yet in video games, movies, TV, etc...usually only white people are represented with the occasional token minority but they are usually stereotyped or under represented. When was the last time you saw a movie (not anime) that had an Asian protagonist? People want to be represented, they want to see people like themselves and feel like they matter, and when games and movies keep telling you you don't exist or you're a joke or something it can be disheartening especially for younger people that are still struggling with their identity. Just because something doesn't matter to you doesn't mean it doesn't matter.