194 réponses à ce sujet

[frostajulie]

I'd like it better if they just ignored our protagonists outside of their game and the LI as well TBH. New game new stuff nuff said

[draken-heart]

frostajulie wrote...

I'd like it better if they just ignored our protagonists outside of their game and the LI as well TBH. New game new stuff nuff said

The character never really "disappeared" . Bioware just says they did for the sake of story.

Is it really that hard for people to see that the whole "Disappearing" hero thing is just Bioware telling us that those heroes are no longer playable and thus might not ever be seen in-game again?

[draken-heart]

cjones91 wrote...

If that was me and I did'nt have no say whatsover on how my old stories were published and the person did so without my permission then I would be angry.To be honest I just want to know what happened to my Hawke and Wardens,I don't care if they come back or not I just want to know what happened to them.

In the end, Bioware is just telling you that their story is over, but not as harshly as you think it is. The whole "disappearing hero" thing is simply Bioware's way of putting the old characters to the side to make way for the new one.

[LinksOcarina]

cjones91 wrote...

I like to think of it as giving someone a blank book and telling them they can fill it with whatever they want.People tend to get pissed if you snatch that book away from them and overwrite it.

Except that your character is completely shaped by the experience given to you, and the dialouge presented for you.

It's really a hybridization of RPG styles in terms of protagonist characterization, basically taking the blank slate idea mixed with the fixed protagonist idea.

And yes, BioWare has been doing that since Baldur's Gate, which is something none of us can really deny. 

[Maconbar]

draken-heart wrote...

cjones91 wrote...

If that was me and I did'nt have no say whatsover on how my old stories were published and the person did so without my permission then I would be angry.To be honest I just want to know what happened to my Hawke and Wardens,I don't care if they come back or not I just want to know what happened to them.

In the end, Bioware is just telling you that their story is over, but not as harshly as you think it is. The whole "disappearing hero" thing is simply Bioware's way of putting the old characters to the side to make way for the new one.

or they disappeared for the same reason that Maric disappeared.

[RydeCrash]

I perceived Dragon Age as a story about Thedas and the key people who affected the events within it (Thedas). I have completed several play throughs of the DA series,The thought has crossed my mind of “Quantum Leap” I am experiencing a part of an Elf, Dwarf, or Human’s life event.

Forgoing the “Putting Right” plot line of that show, The Warden is a part of Thedas and he/she’s interaction with it and once “Witch Hunt” is complete you “Leap” into Hawke. A very different protagonist in a totally different course of events to undertake.

Would it be fun to see my Warden and Hawke (Each Version) graphically in the Frostbite Engine, You Bet!!! But if it’s done just for “Fan Service” with no logical story reason for their presence there, No Thanks. I am very comfortable with imagining my Casteless Male Dwarf Rogue in a drunken stupor raising hell, and Hawke on Isabel’s boat pillaging the high seas.

For many of us it becomes naturally easy to “Shepard” with a Bioware game. “Shepard” is “Mass Effect” Dragon Age is Thedas and key individuals in it.

(IMO)

Ryde…

[Versus Omnibus]

draken-heart wrote...

*Snip*

I would usually try to correct people when they get their information wrong, especially if it's about something I said. But since it seems like you didn't read any of the posts I made in this topic, I'm not even going to bother.

[draken-heart]

Versus Omnibus wrote...

draken-heart wrote...

*Snip*

I would usually try to correct people when they get their information wrong, especially if it's about something I said. But since it seems like you didn't read any of the posts I made in this topic, I'm not even going to bother.

It was more of a post about the general topic, and not about any one poster.

[Alejandrawrr]

 As much as I'd generally prefer the characters to just be finished in their respective game*, I feel like the writers dug a hole by having a few characters (particularly Leliana) make it seem like the Warden and Hawke were definitely involved in this game, and intended to be in advance. Now if they don't make a cameo at the very least the part of me that cares about these kinds of details and consistency will be a bit peeved.

* I'm not necessarily against the Warden or Hawke making future appearances as a main character if it is a continuation of their story (think what AC:Brotherhood and Revelations are to AC2), but definitely against them being thrown into a game that doesn't necessarily require them for the sake of fanservice. I think if they were to appear in DA:I, the best case scenario for me would be a Flemeth-like role (minor character with an unquestionably important contribution that is in-character), or at most a Tallis-like role (temporary companion for a specific DLC). This would be easier to pull of for Hawke than the Warden as Hawke has a voice, a pre-set personality based on our dialogue choices, and can't be dead IIRC. The Warden only has a voice set to work with.

Modifié par Alejandrawrr, 26 août 2013 - 11:24 .

[Versus Omnibus]

draken-heart wrote...

Versus Omnibus wrote...

draken-heart wrote...

*Snip*

I would usually try to correct people when they get their information wrong, especially if it's about something I said. But since it seems like you didn't read any of the posts I made in this topic, I'm not even going to bother.

It was more of a post about the general topic, and not about any one poster.

My apologies then. It seemed like your first post was more directed at me.

[draken-heart]

Versus Omnibus wrote...

draken-heart wrote...

Versus Omnibus wrote...

draken-heart wrote...

*Snip*

I would usually try to correct people when they get their information wrong, especially if it's about something I said. But since it seems like you didn't read any of the posts I made in this topic, I'm not even going to bother.

It was more of a post about the general topic, and not about any one poster.

My apologies then. It seemed like your first post was more directed at me.

I am going to level with you. I hate the idea of disappearing heroes too, but I know that the character, in and of itself, is bioware's, no matter what little version we have in our save files.

[Gold Dragon]

There are many loose ends with the Warden, Hawke, and more minor characters (Alistair, Morrigan "God-child/demon baby", etc), and not all will be in Inquisition.  I do remember hearing from a Dev that the "God-child/demon baby" won't be in this game, for example.  We were also bluntly told that Morrigan was in the Empress' court in Orlais (blunt telling if the Dark Ritual is refused, hinted at otherwise).


Alistair is in Ferelden unless  killed or banished.  In the latter, Teagan comes in DA 2 and tells him to return home.  His banishment was for as long as Anora lived, so what does that say about her?  Also, Alistair is said to have journeyed to Weishaupt (human Noble Female Origin, married & made king).  Reason why the King was in Kirkwall?


And that's just a few of them....

[Versus Omnibus]

draken-heart wrote...

Versus Omnibus wrote...

draken-heart wrote...

Versus Omnibus wrote...

draken-heart wrote...

*Snip*

I would usually try to correct people when they get their information wrong, especially if it's about something I said. But since it seems like you didn't read any of the posts I made in this topic, I'm not even going to bother.

It was more of a post about the general topic, and not about any one poster.

My apologies then. It seemed like your first post was more directed at me.

I am going to level with you. I hate the idea of disappearing heroes too, but I know that the character, in and of itself, is bioware's, no matter what little version we have in our save files.

I'm aware, and I've made peace with that. The disappearance of the two heroes just left me without closure, and I would like Bioware to finally close that chapter for me and not to repeat the same mistake with the Inquisitor.

[cindercatz]

Personally, it's not about closure, or having any desire to play the same character again, or wanting to continue to control the character (though it would be cool to be able to influence them). It's about story consistency and characters. DA is about Thedas, yes, and it's about the characters in it. The characters most important to me, due to personal prism, are my PCs and their LIs.

So if my PCs and their LIs should be involved in a story, yet they're conspicuously absent from that story, and there's no reason why (and on screen, because I design my characters to persist as their own entity, not to be my personal avatar), then the whole experience is undermined. The whole story I've been playing, the story about Thedas and the characters in it, gets riddled with holes and damaged, and my investment in my own characters and in all the alternate playthroughs to set up all these worldstates is deminished. Over multiple games, the result is that I start to feel like I'm wasting my time, because all these things I cared enough to set up in the first place aren't being taken advantage of. I was never a fan of the disappearing PC when we got one or two games in a series in the first place. Compound that now in a series that builds game over game for an extended lifetime, and it becomes a serious problem.

I don't need these characters to have tons of screen time or to randomly show up just to make an appearance. I just need them to be where they're supposed to be if those places and related characters and/or storylines are revisited at some point. That's why they're there, to take part and exist in the world. If you have them disappear like they've done now, then in order to salvage all those worldstates and all those playthroughs and all that investment in the characters, they need to do something with that, and I need to see them used in some capacity. I very much prefer they remain NPCs, and I don't have any need to see them in every sequel or anything like that. Just if they should be there, have them be there. If they would be involved, don't conveniently shunt them off to the side just because they used to be player characters and somebody's walking on eggshells.

In all honesty, if they show up at all and they speak (just because I haven't really got to hear my Wardens talk, so I'm looking forward to that), it will be very difficult to disappoint me. If they were to just randomly turn them into ghouls or something like that, of course that would be a bad thing. If they mysteriously disappear just because they were PCs and PCs just have to disappear, I'm guaranteed to be disappointed by that. At that point, the narrative breaks down. At that point, the outside world starts to invade the fiction of the game world and tear down the props. I don't want them to be the stars of the show. I just want them treated like any NPC, with our variables taken into account. Then my imports still matter and I can stay invested in the story.


I hope that explains the 'why' a little bit. It's all about continuity, story consistency, and characters.

[Sir George Parr]

draken-heart wrote...

frostajulie wrote...

I'd like it better if they just ignored our protagonists outside of their game and the LI as well TBH. New game new stuff nuff said

The character never really "disappeared" . Bioware just says they did for the sake of story.

Is it really that hard for people to see that the whole "Disappearing" hero thing is just Bioware telling us that those heroes are no longer playable and thus might not ever be seen in-game again?

The mistake is to have teased the idea of a storyline around the Disappearing heroes and that some plan was in place to resolve this intriguing mystery in the third installment. Not that it is a simple contrivance on their part to have these past PCs out of the picture so that a new PC can have a brief day in the sun although not as brief as the unfortunate Hawke, before the new PC mysteriously disappears. 

Personally i find the format boring. I'd like to not know how the game was going to end for the PC rather than know that from past experience with over a year before the game is released, that a disappearing act at the end is a safe bet. If its not done in the vanilla game its in a DLC. It would be refreshing to be surprised by the ending of the PCs story, instead of it being identical to the previous games<_<. 
The PC exists because they allow it and will disappear because they demand it.

Modifié par XM-417, 29 août 2013 - 09:02 .

[In Exile]

cindercatz wrote...

Personally, it's not about closure, or having any desire to play the same character again, or wanting to continue to control the character (though it would be cool to be able to influence them). It's about story consistency and characters. DA is about Thedas, yes, and it's about the characters in it. The characters most important to me, due to personal prism, are my PCs and their LIs.  

Your characters' consistency breaks mine. It's as simple as that. That's not to say Bioware should favour one or another. But I would prefer it if pro-apperance fans at least accept the reality that their request is antithetical to what other players would imagine while wanting the exact same thing. 

All that you're complaining about? Bioware already did that to my Wardens with DA:A. I'd prefer they leave things well enough alone so they stop breaking my characters. 

[Versus Omnibus]

In Exile wrote...

cindercatz wrote...

Personally, it's not about closure, or having any desire to play the same character again, or wanting to continue to control the character (though it would be cool to be able to influence them). It's about story consistency and characters. DA is about Thedas, yes, and it's about the characters in it. The characters most important to me, due to personal prism, are my PCs and their LIs.  

Your characters' consistency breaks mine. It's as simple as that. That's not to say Bioware should favour one or another. But I would prefer it if pro-apperance fans at least accept the reality that their request is antithetical to what other players would imagine while wanting the exact same thing. 

All that you're complaining about? Bioware already did that to my Wardens with DA:A. I'd prefer they leave things well enough alone so they stop breaking my characters. 

Which is why I'm just fine with a mention of what their doing. It can also be the most broad thing ever like, "The Warden is leading a company in the deep roads."

I don't need to see them just to get some closure.

[Eternal Phoenix]

No more disappearing heroes BIOWARE!

Whatever happened to, The Warden? He got a ice-pick, that made his ears burn!

Whatever happened to, The Hero of Neverwinter? The Champion of Kirkwall? And Commander Shepard?

Whatever happened to, the heroes?! Dur dur dun dun dun! Dur dur dun dun dun!

[cindercatz]

lol  nice

In Exile wrote...

Your characters' consistency breaks mine. It's as simple as that. That's not to say Bioware should favour one or another. But I would prefer it if pro-apperance fans at least accept the reality that their request is antithetical to what other players would imagine while wanting the exact same thing. 

All that you're complaining about? Bioware already did that to my Wardens with DA:A. I'd prefer they leave things well enough alone so they stop breaking my characters. 

We are at cross-purposes, sir. En garde!

Really, we're just on opposite ground. I understand.

[Chari]

Yeah. Just let us finish at least one hero's story. And not like you did in ME3...