485 réponses à ce sujet

[Omega Torsk]

Bourne Endeavor wrote...

And yet there is well regarded comic on DeviantArt that has never even shown Shepard, yet is hailed as a far superior alterative than what BioWare offered.

Had BioWare opted for a Galaxy United conclusion similar to that comic, where London is essentially one long payoff of every species united having their moment to shine and only focused on Shepard's individual conflict with Harbinger or TIM. I can virtually guarantee the fanbase would have cited BioWare a god of the industry.

Sure, the perception of Shepard as a living legend are paramount in the fanbase. However, that is not the reason the endings were lambasted.

What comic was this? I'm interested in seeing what you're referencing.

[Redbelle]

Omega Torsk wrote...

Bourne Endeavor wrote...

And yet there is well regarded comic on DeviantArt that has never even shown Shepard, yet is hailed as a far superior alterative than what BioWare offered.

Had BioWare opted for a Galaxy United conclusion similar to that comic, where London is essentially one long payoff of every species united having their moment to shine and only focused on Shepard's individual conflict with Harbinger or TIM. I can virtually guarantee the fanbase would have cited BioWare a god of the industry.

Sure, the perception of Shepard as a living legend are paramount in the fanbase. However, that is not the reason the endings were lambasted.

What comic was this? I'm interested in seeing what you're referencing.

Isn't that the one that started as a joke, but turned into a succession of character moment's and seeing every race fighting the war.....

The one which started off with the twist of Marauder Shield's true identity that was, frankly, a better plot twist than Starbrat's reveal. In that it linked ME3 to ME1

[Galbrant]

Nah I still think those endings are garbage and a glaring stain on a decent series filled with rich characters and lore. I can't even play the earlier installments because of those insipid endings. It strip any motivations I had to enjoy playing Shepard's story.

[drayfish]

The Mad Hanar wrote...

They were unexpected. Our solutions to everything would be to blow things up and shoot people, but the game ended with Shepard choosing how to commit suicide*. It's not really a bad concept, it's just a very unexpected one.

Sort of like if you got mustard on your burger instead of ketchup. Yeah, it would be unexpected and unwanted, but it would still be an edible burger.


*Except for one ending. That one is left to the imagination.

'Waaaaait a minute...  I ordered ketchup on my burger.  But this tastes like...  Like...

'Yep. 

'This tastes like a nihilistic, racially intolerant war attrocity instead.

'Urgh.  And there's a pickle.'

Modifié par drayfish, 17 août 2013 - 12:18 .

[TheProtheans]

The Mad Hanar wrote...

They were unexpected. Our solutions to everything would be to blow things up and shoot people, but the game ended with Shepard choosing how to commit suicide*. It's not really a bad concept, it's just a very unexpected one.

Sort of like if you got mustard on your burger instead of ketchup. Yeah, it would be unexpected and unwanted, but it would still be an edible burger.


*Except for one ending. That one is left to the imagination.

Nope.
When time pasts I think of better reasons of why something didn't work.
When time pasts for you, you think of "better" excuses of why it can work.

I say "better" because a burger comparison doesn't deserve it without quotations. 
I imagine you have that same outlook in real life, I'd suggest you change that view.

Modifié par TheProtheans, 17 août 2013 - 12:36 .

[Tonymac]

Time does not heal all wounds, per se.

No amount of time will make a bad story great. Time does not fix bad writing.

All time will do is remove us further from the characters we know and loved in our own view of Mass Effect.

The passage of time will make us more like the developers and writers - it will make us not care anymore about mass effect, the characters, the stories, or the emotions.

The game was ruined by Bioware because they love the dollar more than the art that they once were so good at. Too many great people left the company, and we were left with Mac, Casey and their ineptitude. They are so full of themselves they lost the big picture, and ruined what would have been the achievement of a career. Mass Effect is now the story of how badly things can get messed up when people of no skill or merit are in charge. A fall from grace, if you will.

[Xilizhra]

I more or less agree with the OP's presence. Albeit post-EC, which was sort of necessary to make them work.

'This tastes like a nihilistic, racially intolerant war attrocity instead.

I don't think I've ever gotten a clear answer to this: were you just as up in arms over Arrival? Because the principle is exactly the same.

[CaIIisto]

Original endings - loathed
Extended cut endings - Loathed marginally less

[LoyFang]

Just noticed how burgers go well with everything!

[Cornughon]

The Original/Vanilla endings WERE bad, they left too much open for speculation, which is inconsistent with the Mass Effect series, which were pretty straight-forward in that relation.
But (in my opinion) they fixed that part in the extended cut, which leaves less open for speculation, and gave an ending which is more 'fitting' in the lines laid out by the trilogy (less vague, more explenatory).

However the current endings (I'd like to think to myself that the original endings never existed and the EC was there all along) still raise a lot of questions, and is quite absolute in many ways, making it hard (for Bioware) to come up with a proper story for a (chronological) sequel, which somehow has to combine the three (five if you count the low-ems variations) vastly different outcomes in one game. Not to mention your resolve in the Genophage and the Geth-Quarian conflict...

EDIT: And what is it with you Americans and Hamburgers?

Modifié par Cornughon, 17 août 2013 - 02:42 .

[KaiserShep]

Bourne Endeavor wrote...
I have no idea what they were thinking with the Quarian/Geth conflict that runs completely contradictory to everything the Catalyst says. If anything, peace should never have been an option to emphasis this supposed inevitable conflict.

This is one of the things that bugs me the most. I have this new character spouting off its assertions, being used as a device to present this premise, but the story, up until this point, completely negates it. Of course, I can simply reject this and conclude that the Catalyst is full of sh*t and destroy both it and its reapers for good. I can accept the sacrifice of EDI and the geth, as much as I would prefer them to live, but the fact that you never actually see their demise is another failing, because now it's meaningless and arbitrary. This is supposed to be a huge galaxy changing moment, and it's horribly incomplete in its presentation. There's no good reason why this isn't shown, and only leads to people creating their own head-canon that the geth survive and EDI can be rebuilt.

But the biggest problem with the ending is the serious lack of involvement with the final battle. The fleets arrive to Earth, and no matter who you gathered, the battle has very little variance. It would've been very satisfying to see the Batarians at the controls of a ship joining the fight, and the Hanar/Drell, and Aria's mercenary force. I wanted to see Rachni soldiers fighting the monsters on the ground, and the Blue Suns and Eclipse mechs marching against the reapers. You get this idea that there's a united galaxy, but once the Normandy descends to earth, that idea starts to dissolve. It doesn't help that there's some serious cutscene incompetence with the other forces, using puny weapons to fire at the destroyers. What happened to heavy weapons and missiles? Why doesn't your high EMS determine whether or not you get to see another destroyer bite the dust? 

Minor annoyance is being ground support for a Mako. Shepard is so close, and yet so far from its controls. Having the abilty to drive it one last time to fight your way through no man's land would have satisfied me a great deal.

Lack of closure for the destroy ending is also problematic, as the memorial scene doesn't actually make a whole lot of sense. I think this is due to the fact that the Normandy crash landing scene can't be removed entirely from the game, so the writers/devs had to work around a lot of this for the extended cut, along with the fact that the "Shepard Lives" reveal comes at the very end before the credit sequence. Leaving things to the imagination is fine, but leaving too much can be a pretty bad decision.

Modifié par KaiserShep, 17 août 2013 - 03:23 .

[GreyLycanTrope]

The Mad Hanar wrote...

I also think it comes down to how much you cared and how much you expected. If you were looking forward to that burger from the shop that makes them just the way you like them, then you might be a little disappointed. You might even be angry with the new waiter that managed to mess up your order. But if it's just a burger to you, then it's just a minor inconvenience. I went into the ending with no expectations and no idea how I wanted the series to end. Mass Effect was always one great series among the others I have played. So I guess it's easier to just roll with what the devs want.

Though in a fandom, a very laid back perspective doesn't really seem like a valid one.

My expectations were as follows, end the Reapers in some contrived fashion, what choices you made along the way count towards an eplogue, final choice is between siding with the Alliance or Cerberus. I was hungry, I made plans to specifically eat that burger. It's certainly easier to roll with what the devs want but then you don't always get your money's worth. Just eating up everything they give you is a terrible policy for a consumer to be frank.

You're also quite Mad Hanar, mad I say!

Modifié par Greylycantrope, 17 août 2013 - 04:06 .

[spirosz]

Xilizhra wrote...

I more or less agree with the OP's presence. Albeit post-EC, which was sort of necessary to make them work.

'This tastes like a nihilistic, racially intolerant war attrocity instead.

I don't think I've ever gotten a clear answer to this: were you just as up in arms over Arrival? Because the principle is exactly the same.

At least I could "warn them" 

"Hey, before I force this green lettuce on you, just kidding!" 

[MegaSovereign]

You can't hide from Synthesis.

Your ascension is inevitable.

[spirosz]

MegaSovereign wrote...

You can't hide from Synthesis.

Your ascension is inevitable.

Reaper, pls. 

[voteDC]

The Mad Hanar wrote...

Sort of like if you got mustard on your burger instead of ketchup. Yeah, it would be unexpected and unwanted, but it would still be an edible burger.

Not if you are allerigic to mustard.

My biggest issue with the ending is how it pretty much ignored the characters that we'd spent three games getting to know and love.

The Extended Cut took a good stab at fixing that and for the most part succeeded.

I still think Dragon Age: Origins has had the best ending to a Bioware game and it managed that with simple text screens.

[Obadiah]

Redbelle wrote...

Omega Torsk wrote...

Bourne Endeavor wrote...

And yet there is well regarded comic on DeviantArt that has never even shown Shepard, yet is hailed as a far superior alterative than what BioWare offered.

Had BioWare opted for a Galaxy United conclusion similar to that comic, where London is essentially one long payoff of every species united having their moment to shine and only focused on Shepard's individual conflict with Harbinger or TIM. I can virtually guarantee the fanbase would have cited BioWare a god of the industry.

Sure, the perception of Shepard as a living legend are paramount in the fanbase. However, that is not the reason the endings were lambasted.

What comic was this? I'm interested in seeing what you're referencing.

Isn't that the one that started as a joke, but turned into a succession of character moment's and seeing every race fighting the war.....

The one which started off with the twist of Marauder Shield's true identity that was, frankly, a better plot twist than Starbrat's reveal. In that it linked ME3 to ME1

Thanks for reminding me about that. Totally forgot about Koobismo. Check out their website www.koobismo.com for the comics and other ME related awesome fan creations.

[Xilizhra]

Oh, goddess, I hate Marauder Shields and everything to do with it. For several reasons, but a big one is that Saren's body completely disintegrated in ME1 and could not possibly return as a marauder.

[badmojo88]

To me it came across as a bad spin on the Babylon 5 shadow wars ending "choose these choices! but only the ones we tell you too" which really didnt fit what we all loved about mass effect, as in bab 5 they remarked "maybe the right choice is to not choose at all?" but the me3 endings forced they choice making most if not all the prior choices moot. some in bioware thought this would spark controversy, all it did was inspire alot of /ragequit - borderlands 2 has inspired vastly more controversy by far with the "is krieg tiny tina's father?" thing and one of the two characters doesnt even really speak ffs lol - it really wasnt a matter of art or even EA pushing because they could have added more since then, it was just bad, the extended cut being slightly less so. the fan made ending was superior by far and yet people are still going through the 5 stages of death with the ME3 ending....id say this thread has some "bargaining" mixed in lol just sayin

[AresKeith]

Xilizhra wrote...

Oh, goddess, I hate Marauder Shields and everything to do with it. For several reasons, but a big one is that Saren's body completely disintegrated in ME1 and could not possibly return as a marauder.

So you can't take a joke then?

[Xilizhra]

Not a joke that purports to be better than the actual ending. There's a certain self-righteousness there that drives me crazy.

[Obadiah]

AresKeith wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...

Oh, goddess, I hate Marauder Shields and everything to do with it. For several reasons, but a big one is that Saren's body completely disintegrated in ME1 and could not possibly return as a marauder.

So you can't take a joke then?

...also, Saren isn't the one who comes back as Marauder Shields.

Modifié par Obadiah, 17 août 2013 - 04:50 .

[AresKeith]

Xilizhra wrote...

Not a joke that purports to be better than the actual ending. There's a certain self-righteousness there that drives me crazy.

Oh, the irony