1470 réponses à ce sujet

[Ravensword]

Grand Admiral Cheesecake wrote...

Ravensword wrote...

Dave of Canada wrote...

Zanallen wrote...

Why do people still get dragged into this discussion?

Because these people would see the game cater only to their needs because they see everyone else as wrong, I'll forever try to argue that we should always have the choice to see who we can side with and which opinions we're allowed to have portrayed in-game, even theirs.

It's scary that they want less options.

You're talking about a BW game here.

Eventually Bioware is just going to start making dating sims.

Then the fans really will have legitimate reasons for their waifu wars, until then chaos reigns.

Dating sims w/ pew pew.

Dave of Canada wrote...

Ravensword wrote...

You're talking about a BW game here.

You're right and that makes me sad. Mass Effect 3 was a step in creating a linear experience, I wouldn't be surprised if DA:I did the same and went with the most politically correct path to appease the majority.

Well, I'm hoping that they're adding more content since they extended development time by a year. They brought back the option to choose your race, so maybe they'll add more content for different choices. We can hope.

[leaguer of one]

The Hierophant wrote...

Oops my bad for just noticing.

leaguer of one wrote...

Then how come we found out that we can control the reapers. The only way TIM would be totaly wrong is if we find out it was impossible. We find that it's possible 2 times over.

Just because it's possible doesn't mean his actions are justified or that it won't backfire later considering that he's already indoctrinated.

Heck, the reaper were so afraid of cerberus accomplisment that they attacked cerberus to try and cover it up.
Cerberus may have been indoctrinated but they were never fully control by the reapers.

Limited control is a risk as the target can try to rebel, but full on mind control severely hampers the puppet's capabilities to the point that it's noticeable, but up until that point Cerberus' actions mostly benefited the Reapers.

So far I'd prefer it that the members of DAI's factions are not dumbed down to an army of zombies, for combat's sake.

1.I'm not trying to justify what he did. I'm just say at the very most it's morally wrong what he did . Not objectively wrong. Objectively he was on the correct path to dealing with the reapers in one way.

2.I'm not saying that I did not have help the reaper in some way. I'm sayong that it back fired on to the reapers.
And there was a point to Cerberus in ME3 more than just mindless fodder.

[leaguer of one]

addiction21 wrote...

I agree the Harrowing is cruel and it proves nothing. Many mages that have passed their harrowing have fallen prey to demons and the usual human failings.

Mages are just as fallible as any other person. The difference is that given the right emotional stress they can level neighborhoods when left unchecked.

The harrowing have a point it's to train mages to deal with demons. Some do fail latter but saying it's not valid is like saying driving test are not valid due to the fact there are bad drivers.

[Plaintiff]

leaguer of one wrote...

addiction21 wrote...

I agree the Harrowing is cruel and it proves nothing. Many mages that have passed their harrowing have fallen prey to demons and the usual human failings.

Mages are just as fallible as any other person. The difference is that given the right emotional stress they can level neighborhoods when left unchecked.

The harrowing have a point it's to train mages to deal with demons. Some do fail latter but saying it's not valid is like saying driving test are not valid due to the fact there are bad drivers.

We teach people to drive before we test them. We don't just stick them behind the wheel and say "Good luck! Try not to crash!"

[addiction21]

leaguer of one wrote...

addiction21 wrote...

I agree the Harrowing is cruel and it proves nothing. Many mages that have passed their harrowing have fallen prey to demons and the usual human failings.

Mages are just as fallible as any other person. The difference is that given the right emotional stress they can level neighborhoods when left unchecked.

The harrowing have a point it's to train mages to deal with demons. Some do fail latter but saying it's not valid is like saying driving test are not valid due to the fact there are bad drivers.

Really driving tests?  As far as I know no driving tests have you passing or being lobotomized.

You are right it proves nothing. A mage that passes their harrowing can still be a bad mage just like a bad driver can pass the drivers test. Of course you get as many attempts as you want for a drivers permit.

[Shadow Fox]

Plaintiff wrote...

leaguer of one wrote...

addiction21 wrote...

I agree the Harrowing is cruel and it proves nothing. Many mages that have passed their harrowing have fallen prey to demons and the usual human failings.

Mages are just as fallible as any other person. The difference is that given the right emotional stress they can level neighborhoods when left unchecked.

The harrowing have a point it's to train mages to deal with demons. Some do fail latter but saying it's not valid is like saying driving test are not valid due to the fact there are bad drivers.

We teach people to drive before we test them. We don't just stick them behind the wheel and say "Good luck! Try not to crash!"

Except mages are prepared you use what they taught you to survive.

[Star fury]

Plaintiff wrote...
We teach people to drive before we test them. We don't just stick them behind the wheel and say "Good luck! Try not to crash!"

We also don't throw a total novice in a Formula 1 race against Michael Schumacher. 

Harrowing is a failed attempt to make the game more dark and realistic, instead it's just stupid.  

[duckley]

Can anyone explain the notion that all Templars are abusive?

[leaguer of one]

Plaintiff wrote...

leaguer of one wrote...

addiction21 wrote...

I agree the Harrowing is cruel and it proves nothing. Many mages that have passed their harrowing have fallen prey to demons and the usual human failings.

Mages are just as fallible as any other person. The difference is that given the right emotional stress they can level neighborhoods when left unchecked.

The harrowing have a point it's to train mages to deal with demons. Some do fail latter but saying it's not valid is like saying driving test are not valid due to the fact there are bad drivers.

We teach people to drive before we test them. We don't just stick them behind the wheel and say "Good luck! Try not to crash!"

You're telling me that Mages don't teach mages about demons and how to deal with them?

All those books about it and classes about it don't teach any mage at all?

Please, they of cousre are taught first not thrown in with no care.

[leaguer of one]

Star fury wrote...

Plaintiff wrote...
We teach people to drive before we test them. We don't just stick them behind the wheel and say "Good luck! Try not to crash!"

We also don't throw a total novice in a Formula 1 race against Michael Schumacher. 

Harrowing is a failed attempt to make the game more dark and realistic, instead it's just stupid.  

Except mages do teach mages how to deal with demons.

[MisterJB]

addiction21 wrote...
Really driving tests?  As far as I know no driving tests have you passing or being lobotomized.

You are right it proves nothing. A mage that passes their harrowing can still be a bad mage just like a bad driver can pass the drivers test. Of course you get as many attempts as you want for a drivers permit.

Our cars also don't work on nuclear energy where a small bump into the sidewalk could lead to a city being replaced by a wasteland. Yet anyway.
After a quick google search, the highest body count I could find for a car-related accident was 42. Meredith's sister, a child, killed 73. Connor, an entire village. And those are just accidents, we're not even taking into account the simple temptation of using magic for your benefit at the expense of others which is not a factor with cars.

[leaguer of one]

addiction21 wrote...

leaguer of one wrote...

addiction21 wrote...

I agree the Harrowing is cruel and it proves nothing. Many mages that have passed their harrowing have fallen prey to demons and the usual human failings.

Mages are just as fallible as any other person. The difference is that given the right emotional stress they can level neighborhoods when left unchecked.

The harrowing have a point it's to train mages to deal with demons. Some do fail latter but saying it's not valid is like saying driving test are not valid due to the fact there are bad drivers.

Really driving tests?  As far as I know no driving tests have you passing or being lobotomized.

You are right it proves nothing. A mage that passes their harrowing can still be a bad mage just like a bad driver can pass the drivers test. Of course you get as many attempts as you want for a drivers permit.

But not being able to drive does not mean you turn into a monster and kill thousands of people. It's a nessiary test to reduce that chances of becoming an abomination.

Modifié par leaguer of one, 22 août 2013 - 06:50 .

[Shadow Fox]

Star fury wrote...

Plaintiff wrote...
We teach people to drive before we test them. We don't just stick them behind the wheel and say "Good luck! Try not to crash!"

We also don't throw a total novice in a Formula 1 race against Michael Schumacher. 

Harrowing is a failed attempt to make the game more dark and realistic, instead it's just stupid.  

See above.

[Star fury]

leaguer of one wrote...

Star fury wrote...

Plaintiff wrote...
We teach people to drive before we test them. We don't just stick them behind the wheel and say "Good luck! Try not to crash!"

We also don't throw a total novice in a Formula 1 race against Michael Schumacher. 

Harrowing is a failed attempt to make the game more dark and realistic, instead it's just stupid.  

Except mages do teach mages how to deal with demons.

Do you have examples? Templars just throw ignorant apprentice into the Fade without telling him anything useful and execute him/her when failing. They told you nothing in a mage origin. It's just stupid waste of rare talent, not even mentioning moral aspects.

[Cainhurst Crow]

Plaintiff wrote...

leaguer of one wrote...

addiction21 wrote...

I agree the Harrowing is cruel and it proves nothing. Many mages that have passed their harrowing have fallen prey to demons and the usual human failings.

Mages are just as fallible as any other person. The difference is that given the right emotional stress they can level neighborhoods when left unchecked.

The harrowing have a point it's to train mages to deal with demons. Some do fail latter but saying it's not valid is like saying driving test are not valid due to the fact there are bad drivers.

We teach people to drive before we test them. We don't just stick them behind the wheel and say "Good luck! Try not to crash!"

Mages teach the young mages to not accept deals in the fade and to resist temptation. That's the drivers training, if they can't utilize their skills, the demon possesses them and they fail the harrowing.

[leaguer of one]

Star fury wrote...

leaguer of one wrote...

Star fury wrote...

Plaintiff wrote...
We teach people to drive before we test them. We don't just stick them behind the wheel and say "Good luck! Try not to crash!"

We also don't throw a total novice in a Formula 1 race against Michael Schumacher. 

Harrowing is a failed attempt to make the game more dark and realistic, instead it's just stupid.  

Except mages do teach mages how to deal with demons.

Do you have examples? Templars just throw ignorant apprentice into the Fade without telling him anything useful and execute him/her when failing. They told you nothing in a mage origin. It's just stupid waste of rare talent, not even mentioning moral aspects.

Many. The books in circle. The preaching about the fade and Spirits by senior mages. The codex filled with explinations about it. 
Added,apprentices are only ignorante of what happens during a horrowing, not that they have to go through one.

[The Elder King]

Star fury wrote...




Do you have examples? Templars just throw ignorant apprentice into the Fade without telling him anything useful and execute him/her when failing. They told you nothing in a mage origin. It's just stupid waste of rare talent, not even mentioning moral aspects.

leaguer is talking about the fact that there are books about demons that explain what they could do, so the apprentices could read them in advance.
Though I'd guess that pitting a lone apprentice against a pride demons could be exaggerated. I read that Malcolm Hawke went with Bethany and Hawke during their "Harrowing". It's true that there are only two mages, but I'd say if the Harrowing has to remain, it'd be worth trying this method.
On a unrelated topic, I want one of the mages in my team to be like Malcolm Hawke.

[Cainhurst Crow]

duckley wrote...

Can anyone explain the notion that all Templars are abusive?

Nope. Mage meredith plantiff was ranting about it, but mostly he listed BS and uncanon reasons.

[Cainhurst Crow]

I would argue as well, the lesson that the templars and mages both pound into your head, that demons want to use your body as a gateway, and that you need to have a strong will and resist them, is preparation. You know what to look out for, things that want to get into your body.

Therefore, if anything tries to harm you or enter your body, say no. That's not that complicated to remember or preform.

[Shadow Fox]

Both Greagoir and Irving say you're ready, Irving tells you to remember what you've learned and Jowan who is older than the pc hasn't had his Harrowing yet.

[TTTX]

MisterJB wrote...
Our cars also don't work on nuclear energy where a small bump into the sidewalk could lead to a city being replaced by a wasteland. Yet anyway.
After a quick google search, the highest body count I could find for a car-related accident was 42. Meredith's sister, a child, killed 73. Connor, an entire village. And those are just accidents, we're not even taking into account the simple temptation of using magic for your benefit at the expense of others which is not a factor with cars.

Well with Meredith sister and Connor it wasn really their fault that they got possed, because it were their parents who refuesed to send them to the circle and get proper training against demons, which lead to the death and destrotion they caused.

Both Meredith and Isolde doesn't or can't seem to see that. 

[d-boy15]

duckley wrote...

Can anyone explain the notion that all Templars are abusive?

It's a bias opinion from hardcore pro-mage.

[Star fury]

hhh89 wrote...
leaguer is talking about the fact that there are books about demons that explain what they could do, so the apprentices could read them in advance.
Though I'd guess that pitting a lone apprentice against a pride demons could be exaggerated. I read that Malcolm Hawke went with Bethany and Hawke during their "Harrowing". It's true that there are only two mages, but I'd say if the Harrowing has to remain, it'd be worth trying this method.
On a unrelated topic, I want one of the mages in my team to be like Malcolm Hawke.

Exactly! At least one experienced mage must accompany an apprentice or a group of them into the Fade.  

[leaguer of one]

TTTX wrote...

MisterJB wrote...
Our cars also don't work on nuclear energy where a small bump into the sidewalk could lead to a city being replaced by a wasteland. Yet anyway.
After a quick google search, the highest body count I could find for a car-related accident was 42. Meredith's sister, a child, killed 73. Connor, an entire village. And those are just accidents, we're not even taking into account the simple temptation of using magic for your benefit at the expense of others which is not a factor with cars.

Well with Meredith sister and Connor it wasn really their fault that they got possed, because it were their parents who refuesed to send them to the circle and get proper training against demons, which lead to the death and destrotion they caused.

Both Meredith and Isolde doesn't or can't seem to see that. 

Which is way the foundation of the circle and harrowing is not a bad idea. The problem is what happens after the mages prove they can handle their magic.

[Cainhurst Crow]

TTTX wrote...

MisterJB wrote...
Our cars also don't work on nuclear energy where a small bump into the sidewalk could lead to a city being replaced by a wasteland. Yet anyway.
After a quick google search, the highest body count I could find for a car-related accident was 42. Meredith's sister, a child, killed 73. Connor, an entire village. And those are just accidents, we're not even taking into account the simple temptation of using magic for your benefit at the expense of others which is not a factor with cars.

Well with Meredith sister and Connor it wasn really their fault that they got possed, because it were their parents who refuesed to send them to the circle and get proper training against demons, which lead to the death and destrotion they caused.

Both Meredith and Isolde doesn't or can't seem to see that. 

So it's not their fault they lost control and went on a murdering rampage? Oh that makes everything better than doesn't it? A nice apology to bring back all the orphaned childrens families and the grieving parents dead children to life huh?

Yeah, just because they didn't mean to do it, doesn't mean it didn't happen, and that they shouldn't be blamed. Just like when a person arming a long range bomb misses the target and hits citizens, he shouldn't be off the hook for his blunder. "Just an accident" doesn't change the facts of what happened.

Modifié par Darth Brotarian, 22 août 2013 - 07:12 .