1470 réponses à ce sujet

[cjones91]

MisterJB wrote...

cjones91 wrote...

MisterJB wrote...

Barquiel wrote...
I guess religious fanatics who think having magic is a curse are simply not the best protectors...

Actually, ignoring for a second your implication, those would be far better protectors. I would feel much safer with more Alriks in the Templars than with Thrasks.
Sure, Alrik was a damn creep who was going to hurt, at least, one innocent mage and was taking advantage of Tranquils but at least there is no chance of him being corrupted by gold or of being fooled by an innocent face "No, sir templar, I'm an harmless mage.". Thrask couldn't even tell his co-conspirator was an Abomination and allowed the mages under his charge to use blood magic.

Speaking from a non-mage perspective, of course.

You would rather have a rapist as protectors?I don't even know what to say except that is just.....insane.

Shall I describe to you what armies have done to enemy civillian populations since time immemorial? And yet people rely on them for protection and when they come home to their wives and children, they are lauded as heroes.
It's really nothing outwordly.

Those soilders would have been punished today for war crimes,many of them do get punished for raping civilians so don't use that as a justifcation.

Modifié par cjones91, 23 août 2013 - 10:46 .

[Dermain]

Arcane Warrior Mage Hawke wrote...
My point is a child has to find materials to start a fire a mage doesn't.

Yes, because finding materials to start a fire is extremely hard. It's not like every household does not contain these materials at all.

[cjones91]

Myrkale wrote...

Arcane Warrior Mage Hawke wrote...
My point is a child has to find materials to start a fire a mage doesn't.

Yes, because finding materials to start a fire is extremely hard. It's not like every household does not contain these materials at all.

Yeah,all you need is a candle and a pile of wood then anyone can burn a village down.

[MisterJB]

cjones91 wrote...
Those soilders would have been punished today for war crimes,many of them do get punished for raping civilians so don't use that as a justifcation.

That...how to say this without getting the topic closed...depends largely on who is fighting who. Mass media has allowed a few attrocities to reach the public's eyes who might then protests to see something done about it. In certain areas of the world, though, not so much. Seriously, the last time I mentioned names, the topic was closed, just do some googling.
Suffice it to say, Thedas is not "today". And if people were quesy about having violent brutes protecting them, every army would be disbanded.

I'm not saying I support Alrik. Only that if I had to choose between him and Thrask, who allowed his mages to use blood magic and didn't notice his second in command was an Abomination, I'd rather have him watching over the mages.
There is a greater chance of the non-mages being safe that way.

Modifié par MisterJB, 23 août 2013 - 11:02 .

[In Exile]

dragonflight288 wrote...

In Exile wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...
We don't, however, make bigotry part of standard education for said guards and have them all be drug-addled soldiers of a grasping religious institution.

No, but in the real world it isn't uncommon for prison guards to have less than savory beliefs because of the demographics of the guard population and the demographics of the prison population. 

There are also serious power dynamic problems with just being a prison guard that arguably greatly increase the incidence of abuse. 

Add in that most templars genuinely believe that they have dominion over all mages by divine right, and therefore their treatment of mages is holy and cannot be questioned.

And that belief won't change if the Chantry isn't officially running the templars. Most humans are Andrastians. If you subject mages to the authority of human kingdoms, then you'll either just have the same people with new bosses or you'll have the same kinds of people learning their old tricks 
The circles won't work with a secular character. Partly because thedas isn't secular. 

[Xilizhra]

In Exile wrote...

dragonflight288 wrote...

In Exile wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...
We don't, however, make bigotry part of standard education for said guards and have them all be drug-addled soldiers of a grasping religious institution.

No, but in the real world it isn't uncommon for prison guards to have less than savory beliefs because of the demographics of the guard population and the demographics of the prison population. 

There are also serious power dynamic problems with just being a prison guard that arguably greatly increase the incidence of abuse. 

Add in that most templars genuinely believe that they have dominion over all mages by divine right, and therefore their treatment of mages is holy and cannot be questioned.

And that belief won't change if the Chantry isn't officially running the templars. Most humans are Andrastians. If you subject mages to the authority of human kingdoms, then you'll either just have the same people with new bosses or you'll have the same kinds of people learning their old tricks 
The circles won't work with a secular character. Partly because thedas isn't secular. 

That's why the Circles have to be independent and not beholden to any higher authority.

[Ausstig]

Xilizhra wrote...

That's why the Circles have to be independent and not beholden to any higher authority.

So they how would it be policed? Where would the oversight come from?

We all see what happens when Mages over see them selves, Tivinter. 

[Xilizhra]

Ausstig wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...

That's why the Circles have to be independent and not beholden to any higher authority.

So they how would it be policed? Where would the oversight come from?

We all see what happens when Mages over see them selves, Tivinter. 

And we all see what happens when mundanes oversee themselves, the Aztec empire. Oh, wait.

[cjones91]

Ausstig wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...

That's why the Circles have to be independent and not beholden to any higher authority.

So they how would it be policed? Where would the oversight come from?

We all see what happens when Mages over see them selves, Tivinter. 

Is that all?Do you really want me to point out how mundanes rule where they enslaved another race and treats them like scum?

[Grand Admiral Cheesecake]

Xilizhra wrote...

Ausstig wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...

That's why the Circles have to be independent and not beholden to any higher authority.

So they how would it be policed? Where would the oversight come from?

We all see what happens when Mages over see them selves, Tivinter. 

And we all see what happens when mundanes oversee themselves, the Aztec empire. Oh, wait.

https://encrypted-tb...nPh8DsSpJ8X6syw


Why the Aztecs?


Should have gone with god-tier Rome.

Man Profligates just don't understand.

[sandalisthemaker]

Grand Admiral Cheesecake wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...

And we all see what happens when mundanes oversee themselves, the Aztec empire. Oh, wait.

Why the Aztecs?


Should have gone with god-tier Rome.

Man Profligates just don't understand.

Perhaps as a way to show that mundanes can perform blood sacrifice too?

[Shadow Fox]

Yeah this is getting good.

[Shadow Fox]

Myrkale wrote...

Arcane Warrior Mage Hawke wrote...
My point is a child has to find materials to start a fire a mage doesn't.

Yes, because finding materials to start a fire is extremely hard. It's not like every household does not contain these materials at all.

Harder then just conjuring it with a thought yes.

[Xilizhra]

Morocco Mole wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...
It's not about protection, but domination. Little is more hypocritical than mages' alleged protectors actually throwing them to demons outright.

It's weird you say this considering what your choices are in Mass Effect. And who your avatar is. Just saying.

I think the avatar looks good and I mourn for Morinth's wasted potential. As for my choice in ME, it was some form of control, or genocide.

[AresKeith]

Xilizhra wrote...
It's not about protection, but domination. Little is more hypocritical than mages' alleged protectors actually throwing them to demons outright.

You mean something that can happen to Mages regardless of the Harrowing?

*gasp*

[Steelcan]

Xilizhra wrote...

Morocco Mole wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...
It's not about protection, but domination. Little is more hypocritical than mages' alleged protectors actually throwing them to demons outright.

It's weird you say this considering what your choices are in Mass Effect. And who your avatar is. Just saying.

I think the avatar looks good and I mourn for Morinth's wasted potential. As for my choice in ME, it was some form of control, or genocide.

"Never compromise, even in the face of armageddon"

[Xilizhra]

You mean something that can happen to Mages regardless of the Harrowing?

*gasp*

It's rather like training firefighters by dousing them in gasoline and setting them on fire.

"Never compromise, even in the face of armageddon"

I hate Rorschach.

[AresKeith]

Xilizhra wrote...

You mean something that can happen to Mages regardless of the Harrowing?

*gasp*

It's rather like training firefighters by dousing them in gasoline and setting them on fire.

Not even close

[Steelcan]

Xilizhra wrote...

"Never compromise, even in the face of armageddon"

I hate Rorschach.

Why am I not surprised?

[Xilizhra]

AresKeith wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...

You mean something that can happen to Mages regardless of the Harrowing?

*gasp*

It's rather like training firefighters by dousing them in gasoline and setting them on fire.

Not even close

Hey, it's something that can happen to them regardless!

All right, I'll be fair. Setting them on fire without the gasoline. That's a perfect analogy.

Modifié par Xilizhra, 24 août 2013 - 01:52 .

[Steelcan]

Cthulhu42 wrote...

Oh boy, this thread's turning into a Watchmen discussion. I am pleased.

For the record, I think Ozymandias was 100% right with everything he did, and Rorschach was an idiot to try and reveal what happened.

I agree completely.

But I still like the guy

[Xilizhra]

Cthulhu42 wrote...

Oh boy, this thread's turning into a Watchmen discussion. I am pleased.

For the record, I think Ozymandias was 100% right with everything he did, and Rorschach was an idiot to try and reveal what happened.

I don't know if Ozymandias was right or not; I can see why, but I wonder if he may have missed opportunities to kill fewer people. However, I do think that Rorschach was indeed an idiot and wholly in the wrong; regardless of what Ozymandias did, it's incredibly stupid to try to counteract its only good effect.