133 réponses à ce sujet

[AustinPearce96]

Wulfram wrote...

Is book/comic "canon" the same as DA3 default "canon"?

I'm interested in this as well! Does anyone know?

[Nerevar-as]

David Gaider wrote...

The problem here is that people have a strange idea of what "canon" means-- almost a paranoia, really.

We have a default canon, which applies if you import nothing. So if someone comes to DAI with no import of previous games, they get a certain set of previous decisions being presumed-- and those tend to be ones that don't promise future content. The Warden of DAO is dead, because why would someone who's importing no save (and is possibly a brand new player) care about their Warden still being alive and involved in the plot? There is no OGB, because why would that person care about Morrigan having a child from some game they possibly never even played?

So what about the Orlesian who did Awakening and the DLCs? S/he should be filling part of the Origins Warden´s role, at least his/her official position within the order.

[Spectre slayer]

DAOfan23 wrote...

Wulfram wrote...

Is book/comic "canon" the same as DA3 default "canon"?

I'm interested in this as well! Does anyone know?

Their canon(default settings) would most likely their DAO, DA2 and both the comics and books which will shape the default world based on all of those events, also I posted something not to long ago which might be pretty close to what their canon might be.

Modifié par Spectre slayer, 22 août 2013 - 08:27 .

[jmk1999]

DAOfan23 wrote...

Wulfram wrote...

Is book/comic "canon" the same as DA3 default "canon"?

I'm interested in this as well! Does anyone know?

agreed... i've been curious. i think it's safe to say that, given the books, the warden does NOT romance leliana or alistair, since both are (seemingly) single, alistair is king, and leliana is a right hand to the divine... but... i have a feeling that the warden is still alive (at least in the books) since it's heavily hinted in asunder that the warden visited leliana stating to be a friend from ferelden. as for DA2, clearly isabela hasn't been romanced since she's pretty carefree and, assumingly, single in the comics. so that means that either hawke ran away with one of the others (probably not anders), or romanced no one (unlikely in a canon). either way, it seems that both the warden and hawke have disappeared, just as said at the end of DA2. it seems as though gaider has tried to at least keep it open to some interpretation, but just for fun i'm sure it would be nice to find out what the actual default canon would be. i'm assuming that all of the stories occure, regardless of which canon, it's just that they would probably play out in a slightly different manner. for example, leliana's friend from ferelden could be... say... alistair trying to keep hidden.

[Capt. dusty]

jmk1999 wrote...

DAOfan23 wrote...

Wulfram wrote...

Is book/comic "canon" the same as DA3 default "canon"?

I'm interested in this as well! Does anyone know?

agreed... i've been curious. i think it's safe to say that, given the books, the warden does NOT romance leliana or alistair, since both are (seemingly) single, alistair is king, and leliana is a right hand to the divine... but... i have a feeling that the warden is still alive (at least in the books) since it's heavily hinted in asunder that the warden visited leliana stating to be a friend from ferelden. as for DA2, clearly isabela hasn't been romanced since she's pretty carefree and, assumingly, single in the comics. so that means that either hawke ran away with one of the others (probably not anders), or romanced no one (unlikely in a canon). either way, it seems that both the warden and hawke have disappeared, just as said at the end of DA2. it seems as though gaider has tried to at least keep it open to some interpretation, but just for fun i'm sure it would be nice to find out what the actual default canon would be. i'm assuming that all of the stories occure, regardless of which canon, it's just that they would probably play out in a slightly different manner. for example, leliana's friend from ferelden could be... say... alistair trying to keep hidden.

The friend from Ferelden is Wynne.

[GSSAGE7]

I figure the only reason book/comic-canon says the Warden died, is just to explain why the Warden isn't, say, helping Alistair finding Maric.
I mean, being a corpse is a pretty good excuse. "Oh hey Wynne, I'd love to help you and Shale find your friend, but I'm busy being dead."

[FenrirBlackDragon]

David Gaider wrote...

The problem here is that people have a strange idea of what "canon" means-- almost a paranoia, really.

We have a default canon, which applies if you import nothing. So if someone comes to DAI with no import of previous games, they get a certain set of previous decisions being presumed-- and those tend to be ones that don't promise future content. The Warden of DAO is dead, because why would someone who's importing no save (and is possibly a brand new player) care about their Warden still being alive and involved in the plot? There is no OGB, because why would that person care about Morrigan having a child from some game they possibly never even played?

As for things which don't involve future content, like the sex and race of the Warden, yes-- those we just decided on at some point. So the default Warden who died was a female Dalish elf.

A default should not concern you in the slightest, however, if you intend on importing-- which I assume everyone who's hanging around on these forums a year before release likely is. How we'll do that importing is the subject of a future reveal, it's true, but I'm uncertain why a fan would be concerned about the default settings of a version of the story they'll never use.

And if your version of the definition of canon is "it overrides my previous story", then rest assured that will not happen. The story may not go exactly as you want/expect (as in Leliana being alive, if you killed her in DAO), but that's not the same as those previous actions being treated as if they never happened at all. If we ever decide to move Dragon Age over to one canonical story in-between games, I'm almost positive we would give lots of advance notice to allow fans time to rend garments, burn effigies, and send cupcakes. Until that point, just wait for news on the import feature.

Thanks for the clarification Mr. Gaider! Actually, I am happy that the default warden is female because I don't see enough female protagonists in games. But, for those of us who have imports, as far I I know for now we have nothing to worry about. Also, like others have suggested, certain decisions may not be relevant to certain games and big enough time jumps can justify not even mentioning previous games.
Good to know we'd have time to mourn if they decided on a definite canon. 
And for everything else... there is fanfiction.
 

By the way, did the default Warden and Hawke romance anyone? Just curious... (I am guessing from the lack of any mention of it in the martyr preset or in the books/comics this isn't the case, but I thought I should ask.)

Modifié par FenrirBlackDragon, 03 septembre 2013 - 07:25 .

[WraithTDK]

David Gaider wrote...

The problem here is that people have a strange idea of what "canon" means-- almost a paranoia, really.

We have a default canon, which applies if you import nothing. So if someone comes to DAI with no import of previous games, they get a certain set of previous decisions being presumed-- and those tend to be ones that don't promise future content. The Warden of DAO is dead, because why would someone who's importing no save (and is possibly a brand new player) care about their Warden still being alive and involved in the plot? There is no OGB, because why would that person care about Morrigan having a child from some game they possibly never even played?

As for things which don't involve future content, like the sex and race of the Warden, yes-- those we just decided on at some point. So the default Warden who died was a female Dalish elf.


A default should not concern you in the slightest, however, if you intend on importing-- which I assume everyone who's hanging around on these forums a year before release likely is. How we'll do that importing is the subject of a future reveal, it's true, but I'm uncertain why a fan would be concerned about the default settings of a version of the story they'll never use.


And if your version of the definition of canon is "it overrides my previous story", then rest assured that will not happen. The story may not go exactly as you want/expect (as in Leliana being alive, if you killed her in DAO), but that's not the same as those previous actions being treated as if they never happened at all. If we ever decide to move Dragon Age over to one canonical story in-between games, I'm almost positive we would give lots of advance notice to allow fans time to rend garments, burn effigies, and send cupcakes. Until that point, just wait for news on the import feature.

I suppose what gets a lot of people (me included) is that we feel extremely connected to this universe. I suppose that's a double-edged sword for a content creator - you get people like me who, rest assured, are going to buy darn near anything you put out in this franchise, often on more than once platform, even. On the other hand, we have this kind of...well, "emotional investment" sounds rather over-dramatic, but somewhat accurate when you factor in how much time many of us have spent writing back-stores, etc. (and no, we don't expect our personal stories to be honored), it is rather a personal investment. 

So the when something official is written that effectively says "this didn't happen" (yes, I read what you said about default choices not invalidating our choices; I'll get to that in a moment), it makes us feel like either our in-game version was tantamount to an irrelevant piece of fan-fiction, or else whatever the contradiction occurs in, is not really part of the universe we're so connected to. Certain things are very difficult to avoid - someone has to be in charge of Ferelden, so we accept that when you're writing books or comics, which can't really adapt to imported saves, you have to go with one. We can even overlook the occasional retcon, such as Lilliana living if we killed her, but the more it happens, the more we start feeling disconnected from the universe we fell in love with, because it begins to lose cohesion; and that's our ultimate fear, that we'll have to chose between four options:

• Accepting a fragmented, contradictory story
• Replaying everything from scratch
• Having to ignore an increasingly large amount of material
• Accepting the "default presets" as canon

None of these is particularly appealing; so many of us try keep a "canon run through" which avoids using choices that will clash with canonical stories.
With some things, it doesn't really matter. The dwarven King Aeducan always dies, regardless of what the player does; so referencing his death is completely harmless. Likewise, referencing who succeeded him in game in which a save has been imported; allowing the reference to name whomever the play chose; is harmless. Comics and novels, on the other hand, is where things get sticky. Ideally, I think the best solution is to simply avoid referencing any non-static story points as much as possible.

So far, I think Bioware's done a pretty good job with all this. Releasing comics with Alistaire as King understandably put a lot of people on edge; as it fosters a bit of that disconnect I mentioned earlier; but by and large, there does seem to be a fair amount of effort being put into not over-riding player choices. If I could make one other suggest going forward, it would be that each time a player choice is written in a game, consider if one of the options is going to be difficult to maintain in the future. For example, if a character has a lot of potential to return in further games and stories, I for one would rather not have the option to kill him/her.

Just my 2 cents.

Modifié par WraithTDK, 03 septembre 2013 - 08:04 .

[Mathias]

David Gaider wrote...
I'm almost positive we would give lots of advance notice to allow fans time to rend garments, burn effigies, and send cupcakes. Until that point, just wait for news on the import feature.

Is that bitterness I smell?