418 réponses à ce sujet

[David7204]

LiL Reapur wrote...

The Mad Hanar wrote...

Has it ever occured to you that people just blindly accepting a person coming back to life with no questions is just weird?

This

No. Because that isn't true at all. There's no reason to assume anyone 'blindly accepts' anything.

The question is not whether conversations happen.

The question is whether you show it to the player.

Yes, every character probably talks extensively with Shepard about Lazarus. But it happens off screen. There's no reason to show it to the player unless it adds something to the experience. And having dozens of characters repeat the same line of how incredible Lazarus is adds nothing to the experience.

Same thing for conversation about every other event of the series. Yes, they're probably talked about extensively. But having characters repeat what the player already saw or already knows is tedious and clumsy. You don't do it. It's just assumed to happen off screen.

Modifié par David7204, 20 août 2013 - 11:07 .

[adayaday]

David7204 wrote...

And what it would be character derailment for Shepard to consider Lazarus a 'spiritual,ethical,personal' event in the first place? Because it pretty much would be. I wouldn't. Your brain lost function. It was restored. There's nothing spiritual or ethical to it.

I didn't necessarily referd to Shepard,i am pretty sure that Thane and Ashley who are both spiritual and have a close relation with death would have alot of questin for Shepard about the afterlife.and even though it took more then half a year Shepard and Ashley both started asking those questions.

Shepard:Am i realy me?or just some high tech VI.
Ashley:What was it like being you know..

[AlexMBrennan]

There's no reason to show it to the player unless it adds something to the experience.

Given the posts here, I'd have thought that showing these conversations would have added "not making the player facedesk" to the experience.

[David7204]

That's not true at all either. So long as there's a reasonable, plausible explanation for something, the story isn't obligated to give an explicit explanation.

For example, Shepard breathing at the endgame of ME 3 on the Citadel. The story is not obligated to explain how, because a completely reasonable and plausible explanation is readily available. Some technology is in place to retain atmosphere.

We don't assume there's a vacuum just because the story doesn't explicitly say otherwise.

Modifié par David7204, 20 août 2013 - 11:10 .

[LiL Reapur]

David7204 wrote...

No. Because that isn't true at all. There's no reason to assume anyone 'blindly accepts' anything.

The question is not whether conversations happen.

The question is whether you show it to the player.

Yes, every character probably talks extensively with Shepard about Lazarus. But it happens off screen. There's no reason to show it to the player unless it adds something to the experience. And having dozens of characters repeat the same line of how incredible Lazarus is adds nothing to the experience.

Same thing for conversation about every other event of the series. Yes, they're probably talked about extensively. But having characters repeat what the player already saw or already knows is tedious and clumsy. You don't do it.

They could have explained the technology behind it on the citadel DLC since it was about stories from the past and what not while giving us the realization that Shepard has in fact been ressurrected.

[The Night Mammoth]

David7204 wrote...

That's not true at all either. So long as there's a reasonable, plausible explanation for something, the story isn't obligated to give an explicit explanation.

For example, Shepard breathing at the endgame of ME 3 on the Citadel. The story is not obligated to explain how, because a completely reasonable and plausible explanation is readily available. Some technology is in place to retain atmosphere.

We don't assume there's a vacuum just because the story doesn't explicitly say otherwise.

I know right, the completely reasonable and plausible explanation for the the Lazarus project is 'because it's the future'. Can't believe people don't accept that. 

Modifié par The Night Mammoth, 20 août 2013 - 11:12 .

[David7204]

Lazarus is given an explanation. So I don't know what you're on about.

[LiL Reapur]

The Night Mammoth wrote...

I know right, the completely reasonable and plausible explanation for the the Lazarus project is 'because it's the future'. Can't believe people don't accept that. 

I'm not mad about it being in the future, i get it. it's the future with amazing technology and i accept that 100%. BUT my arguement is that it wasn't addressed properly.......

[dreamgazer]

If technology is going to directly contradict known science, such as the jump-starting of a dead brain back to normal, then it needs to be discussed and addressed on-screen. I'm fine with just about everything else involved with Lazarus (on a physical level) except that.

And yes, the physical resurrection of an individual---the savior of the Citadel, no less---needed to be focused on more than it was.

[adayaday]

LiL Reapur wrote...

The Night Mammoth wrote...

I know right, the completely reasonable and plausible explanation for the the Lazarus project is 'because it's the future'. Can't believe people don't accept that. 

I'm not mad about it being in the future, i get it. it's the future with amazing technology and i accept that 100%. BUT my arguement is that it wasn't addressed properly.......

Sarcasam.

[David7204]

It is addressed on the screen. The first 30 minutes of gameplay have a very heavy focus on Lazarus.

Modifié par David7204, 20 août 2013 - 11:20 .

[David7204]

The Mad Hanar wrote...

David7204 wrote...

That's not true at all either. So long as there's a reasonable, plausible explanation for something, the story isn't obligated to give an explicit explanation.

For example, Shepard breathing at the endgame of ME 3 on the Citadel. The story is not obligated to explain how, because a completely reasonable and plausible explanation is readily available. Some technology is in place to retain atmosphere.

We don't assume there's a vacuum just because the story doesn't explicitly say otherwise.

There is evidence that Shepard survives the Destroy ending with a cutscene. There is absolutely no dialogue anywhere that would suggest that any of Shepard's friends were the least bit concerned that Shepard was brought back to life. Instead we get a passive "I thought you were dead" or "Why didn't you call me when you came back to life". Saying that any actual deep conversation happened between Shepard and his companions off screen is completely speculative, and it is a claim that holds no merit because there is no proof that it happened.

Liara's content in LotSB has a very strong focus on Shepard's death and resurrection.

[dreamgazer]

David7204 wrote...

It is addressed on the screen. The first 30 minutes of gameplay have a very heavy focus on Lazarus.

Can you post a link to where they discuss reviving and restoring the brain? 

It's more complicated than "clone it, wire it, and flip the switch". 

[LiL Reapur]

adayaday wrote...

LiL Reapur wrote...

The Night Mammoth wrote...

I know right, the completely reasonable and plausible explanation for the the Lazarus project is 'because it's the future'. Can't believe people don't accept that. 

I'm not mad about it being in the future, i get it. it's the future with amazing technology and i accept that 100%. BUT my arguement is that it wasn't addressed properly.......

Sarcasam.

Sorry then. Just drunk a red bull and i'm a little hyper.......

[The Night Mammoth]

David7204 wrote...

Lazarus is given an explanation. So I don't know what you're on about.

There's another explanation? I thought 'because science' would be a little simplistic for you. 

[David7204]

dreamgazer wrote...

David7204 wrote...

It is addressed on the screen. The first 30 minutes of gameplay have a very heavy focus on Lazarus.

Can you post a link to where they discuss reviving and restoring the brain? 

It's more complicated than "clone it, wire it, and flip the switch". 

The multiple audio logs from Miranda? The video at the intro showing the medical procedures? The sequence with Shepard waking up and Miranda sedating him?

[dreamgazer]

David7204 wrote...

dreamgazer wrote...

David7204 wrote...

It is addressed on the screen. The first 30 minutes of gameplay have a very heavy focus on Lazarus.

Can you post a link to where they discuss reviving and restoring the brain? 

It's more complicated than "clone it, wire it, and flip the switch". 

The multiple audio logs from Miranda? The video at the intro showing the medical procedures? The sequence with Shepard waking up and Miranda sedating him?

Cool! Post a link to the log about the brain and we'll be in business. 

Because that is a significant hurdle, David. 

[David7204]

I tell you what. If you can write some sample conversations between Shepard and other characters that address that, I might be convinced. What I don't want is pointless conversation that tells that player nothing and has no themes, and is only there to check off a box of 'character must comment about event.'

Show a conversation that goes somewhere meaningful.

Modifié par David7204, 20 août 2013 - 11:26 .

[LiL Reapur]

David7204 wrote...

 The video at the intro showing the medical procedures? The sequence with Shepard waking up and Miranda sedating him?

This? PFFFFFFFTTTTTTTT


http://t2.gstatic.co...QrnzsPiqjyQrkDm

[David7204]

dreamgazer wrote...

Cool! Post a link to the log about the brain and we'll be in business. 

Because that is a significant hurdle, David. 

What exactly are you looking for, dreamgazer? You're not going to get a full scientific explanation for anything in science fiction. If the authors could do that, they would be sprinting to a patent office, not writing stories.

[David7204]

The Mad Hanar wrote...

So you want me to write lines that would satisfy your personal tastes to convince you that Bioware could've addressed that general confusion that a person would have if their friend randomly came back from the dead?

Yes, I want you to convince me that this dialogue has a purpose aside from just checking off a box of 'character reacts to Lazarus.' Because we've already heard all of that before right at the beginning of the game. Convince me that something meaningful is coming from this. Like it did in LotSB.