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[Rinji the Bearded]

greengoron89 wrote...

He chose a ****** poor way to start it. Rather than go after the immediate and obvious threat in the Templars, he took the coward's way out and killed priests and worshipers instead.

What a hero.

History, depending on who wins, could paint him as one easily.  Many acts were committed during the American Revolutionary War, for example, that could be considered terroristic acts.  Yet our history books paint those people as "patriots."  And there may be many people in Thedas who consider Anders to be a patriot, a martyr who sparked the flames of change. 

Anders's actions were premeditated though.  The Chantry was a target he selected out of consideration, not because he was scared of the Templars.  If he had taken action against the Templars, he would have been written off immediately as a murderer and no one would have questioned it.  In choosing the Chantry as a target, however, he has forced a conflict to come to a head because he attacked an institution.

Modifié par RinjiRenee, 08 octobre 2013 - 04:49 .

[Lord Raijin]

ScarMK wrote...
I can't remember, but didn't one of the devs (I'm thinking Gaider) confirm that Anders is a terrorist?  Or was that in regards to what he did?  I know one of them touched upon this subject.

Can you provide me the URL to David post indicating that Anders was an evil terrorist?

Arcane Warrior Mage Hawke wrote...

So innocent priests and
worshippers deserve to be murdered because of the suffering of mages?

And you mage supporters wonder why some people think you're all nuts.

How exactly are the priests considered to be "Innocent"? The Chantry (The priests) indoctrinates the gullible public to their teachings and their rules. If you're a mage and do not want to obey the Chantries teachings and rules you are branded as an apostate, and are either killed on sight or recaptured and sent back to the Circle.

Oh and the chantry was closed at the time so no "innocent" worshippers was inside the Chantry.

[Shadow Fox]

greengoron89 wrote...

He chose a ****** poor way to start it. Rather than go after the immediate and obvious threat in the Templars, he took the coward's way out and killed priests and worshipers instead.

What a hero.

Not to mention stupid given that it'll only make people more hateful of mages.

[schalafi]

Whether you loved Anders, or hated him, I still think he was one of the best characters created in a game. What other npc caused such a discussion of right vs. wrong? The fact that this topic has gone on for 9 pages says something about the feelings for the character of Anders. An insiginifcant npc wouldn't have caused such heated arguments. Someone once said "Like me or hate me, but don't ignore me". I find that really defines Ander's character in DA2

[Xilizhra]

So having more people of color and gay characters in video games is more worthy of discussion and attention than the suffering and deaths of millions of people.

Gotcha.

If you want to make a thread saying that you want more suffering in DA so as to attract awareness of suffering elsewhere IRL, feel free.

[Siven80]

If he is , i will kill him again.

Then remember the good character he was in awakening before he descended into a horrid mess in DA2.

[Shadow Fox]

Lord Raijin wrote...

ScarMK wrote...
I can't remember, but didn't one of the devs (I'm thinking Gaider) confirm that Anders is a terrorist?  Or was that in regards to what he did?  I know one of them touched upon this subject.

Can you provide me the URL to David post indicating that Anders was an evil terrorist?

Arcane Warrior Mage Hawke wrote...

So innocent priests and
worshippers deserve to be murdered because of the suffering of mages?

And you mage supporters wonder why some people think you're all nuts.

How exactly are the priests considered to be "Innocent"? The Chantry (The priests) indoctrinates the gullible public to their teachings and their rules. If you're a mage and do not want to obey the Chantries teachings and rules you are branded as an apostate, and are either killed on sight or recaptured and sent back to the Circle.

Oh and the chantry was closed at the time so no "innocent" worshippers was inside the Chantry.

You do realize that most priests have nothing to do with how the Circles are run right?

[Rinji the Bearded]

Lord Raijin wrote...

How exactly are the priests considered to be "Innocent"? The Chantry (The priests) indoctrinates the gullible public to their teachings and their rules. If you're a mage and do not want to obey the Chantries teachings and rules you are branded as an apostate, and are either killed on sight or recaptured and sent back to the Circle.

Oh and the chantry was closed at the time so no "innocent" worshippers was inside the Chantry.

No one is saying that some Chantry policies aren't suspect.  But the fact of the matter is that those Sisters and Elthina and whoever else was inside the Chantry (and when did it ever say that it was closed?) were only indirect targets and not directly responsible for the subjugation of mages.  He killed them because he was making a statement, and it was a terroristic act intended to ignite conflict.  AND IT WORKED OH BOY

Also, before anyone goes on about how full or not full the Chantry was:

What is the point of blowing up an empty building?

Modifié par RinjiRenee, 08 octobre 2013 - 04:58 .

[Xilizhra]

RinjiRenee wrote...

Lord Raijin wrote...

How exactly are the priests considered to be "Innocent"? The Chantry (The priests) indoctrinates the gullible public to their teachings and their rules. If you're a mage and do not want to obey the Chantries teachings and rules you are branded as an apostate, and are either killed on sight or recaptured and sent back to the Circle.

Oh and the chantry was closed at the time so no "innocent" worshippers was inside the Chantry.

No one is saying that some Chantry policies are suspect.  But the fact of the matter is that those Sisters and Elthina and whoever else was inside the Chantry (and when did it ever say that it was closed?) were only indirect targets and not directly responsible for the subjugation of mages.  He killed them because he was making a statement, and it was a terroristic act intended to ignite conflict.  AND IT WORKED OH BOY

I'd say Elthina was directly responsible. Whether or not anyone else was killed is conjectural.

[Heidenreich]

OH LOOK, it's the Anders thread all over again.

Should I sit and try to explain all the reasons every Anders hater is wrong? How Awakening Anders hated Templar just as much as Justice/Anders? How The REASON he attacked the chantry and not the templars is because the CHANTRY HAS (Well up until Asunder any way) DIRECT CONTROL OVER THE TEMPLARS and by them POINTEDLY NOT DOING ANYTHING they were as good as agreeing with them?

Probably not. Arguing with the wind gets you nothing but a sore throat.

That being said, ON TOPIC (as in, will he play a part in DA:I), I'd wager to say -- since Gaider himself said if Anders is dead if you killed him -- not if you killed him. If he's alive (and romanced him) I'd bet they'll be a cameo, but you won't be able to kill him.

If he's dead, then he's dead.

If he's alive, he probably isn't running around in Orlais.

[maliluka]

There is a fine line between love and hate, at least so they say. If you allowed to let Anders live it would be interesting should he show up in DAI, but will it be Anders or Anders plus one as Varric would say. And which Anders personality would we be getting this time around?

[frankf43]

He's dead in my game so I don't see him coming back.

I supported the mages at the end but could not excuse his actions. There is no good reason for terrorism.

Modifié par frankf43, 08 octobre 2013 - 05:07 .

[Lord Raijin]

Arcane Warrior Mage Hawke wrote...

You do realize that most priests have nothing to do with how the Circles are run right?

I never said that they did have influence on how the Circles are run. I said that their responsible for brainwashing the public.

Modifié par Lord Raijin, 08 octobre 2013 - 05:05 .

[ScarMK]

Lord Raijin wrote...

Can you provide me the URL to David post indicating that Anders was an evil terrorist?

I'm asking if anyone else remembers if he did or not.  I don't have the sources bookmarked and I'm certainly not digging through the BSN to find them.  So consider my post as nothing.

[Br3admax]

BSN 101: It's wrong IRL, but it's okay in the name of mage freedom. Killing people in the name of mage freedom is fine. Killing people in the name of IRL freedom is wrong.

[Shadow Fox]

Heidenreich wrote...

OH LOOK, it's the Anders thread all over again.

Should I sit and try to explain all the reasons every Anders hater is wrong? How Awakening Anders hated Templar just as much as Justice/Anders? How The REASON he attacked the chantry and not the templars is because the CHANTRY HAS (Well up until Asunder any way) DIRECT CONTROL OVER THE TEMPLARS and by them POINTEDLY NOT DOING ANYTHING they were as good as agreeing with them?

Probably not. Arguing with the wind gets you nothing but a sore throat.

That being said, ON TOPIC (as in, will he play a part in DA:I), I'd wager to say -- since Gaider himself said if Anders is dead if you killed him -- not if you killed him. If he's alive (and romanced him) I'd bet they'll be a cameo, but you won't be able to kill him.

If he's dead, then he's dead.

If he's alive, he probably isn't running around in Orlais.

Only the Grand Cleric has some degree of control over the Templars the average priest or revered mother can't do ****.

[Shadow Fox]

Lord Raijin wrote...

Arcane Warrior Mage Hawke wrote...

You do realize that most priests have nothing to do with how the Circles are run right?

I never said that they did have influence on how the Circles are run. I said that their responsible for brainwashing the public.

Please tell me you didn't equate religion to brainwashing and use that as a justifacation for murder.

[Rinji the Bearded]

Just because I call Anders a terrorist doesn't mean I hate him, BTW. I love him as a character.

But he's still a murderer.

Modifié par RinjiRenee, 08 octobre 2013 - 05:11 .

[Jaison1986]

You gotta love this reasoning.

Religion = freedom to control, opress and kill anyone that you feel like it while getting away scot free.

[Lord Raijin]

RinjiRenee wrote...

No one is saying that some Chantry policies aren't suspect.  But the fact of the matter is that those Sisters and Elthina and whoever else was inside the Chantry (and when did it ever say that it was closed?) were only indirect targets and not directly responsible for the subjugation of mages.  He killed them because he was making a statement, and it was a terroristic act intended to ignite conflict.  AND IT WORKED OH BOY

Also, before anyone goes on about how full or not full the Chantry was:

What is the point of blowing up an empty building?

When I try to get inside the Chantry late at night I'm unable to because it's lock therefour it clearly indicates that the Chantry is closed at nights

The Chantry is just as guilty if not more in being responsible for taking innocent lives so how is Anders classified as a terrorist when the Chantry matches the definition of one.

If Anders truly wanted to kill a bunch of innocent people..... why didn't he blow up the Chantry during the day time when people are inside worshipping?

[Br3admax]

You guys make it very hard for me to be pro-mage.

[Shadow Fox]

Br3ad wrote...

You guys make it very hard for me to be pro-mage.

When I first got here I assumed the radicals and crazies would be pro-templar.

[ScarMK]

Arcane Warrior Mage Hawke wrote...

Br3ad wrote...

You guys make it very hard for me to be pro-mage.

When I first got here I assumed the radicals and crazies would be pro-templar.

I think it's funny how I see radical pro-templars maybe once a week.  While everyday or two I see pro mage radicals.

[Lord Raijin]

Grand Cleric Elthina was an arrogant old hag that thought that she was untouchable. Anders showed her

[Xilizhra]

Arcane Warrior Mage Hawke wrote...

Br3ad wrote...

You guys make it very hard for me to be pro-mage.

When I first got here I assumed the radicals and crazies would be pro-templar.

Given its greater removal from modern ethics, the templar position has fewer supporters overall and even fewer who follow it to the full logical conclusion.

I think it's funny how I see radical pro-templars maybe once a week.  While everyday or two I see pro mage radicals.

I think we're succeeding in slowly driving out many of the radical pro-templars.

Modifié par Xilizhra, 08 octobre 2013 - 05:26 .