Stella-Arc wrote...
I gave examples about the Connor quest because that is what most of the people were talking about on this thread. And no, it IS NOT metagaming. I decided, not knowing ANYTHING about the game, to do the Arl Eamon's quest last since it didn't interest me. By the time I got to it, I had already recruited the dalish, the dwarves, and the mages. It was quite simple by the time I reached it since all I had to do was go to the Tower (which I'm sure would only take a few hours since they are literally near the same lake (Redcliffe and the Tower) and ask Irving to help because I saved his ass and everyone else's, including the templars, so he owed me. Then BAM! I helped Connor. I did all this with no prior knowldedge. Are you going to accuse me of "metagaming" now?
And I do agree that the Harrowmont vs Bhelen is the best example but....did you TRULY knew that Harrowmont was the "worse" option while playing the game for the first time? I didn't know until the end when I saw the slides. With the Anvil, yes, it is pretty damn obvious that saving the anvil could potentially save the race however, the cost is losing your soul (quite literally...poor sods). Is it worth sacrificing those you are trying to save? However, this isn't a good example to choose any way because there is no possibility of an "option c". For Connor's case, there is. The problem with the quest wasn't availability of "option c" but the lack of realistic "consequences". If we went to the tower, maybe more pople died, or the demon becomes more powerful or, you get the idea. Having the option to go to the tower wasn't the problem just that there wasn't some sort of obstacle (such as having done the tower first could save the lives on the town, or having Wynne to subdue the child until you get back, ect).
The fact is, I had to fight an ENTIRE tower full of blood mages, abominations, possessed templars, demons and survive the fade (and side with the mages) to even GET Wynne as a companion. I think I EARNED having her on my team. So having her there and cast a "spell" on Connor is a good way since I worked my ass off for her to BE THERE.
All this, WITHOUT PRIOR KNOWLEDGE, is legitimate. You are the one who is "metagaming".
And Jowan isn't a bad person and using blood magic can bring up a DEBATE and is a CHOICE. It is worth sacrificing Isolde to save her son? Is it worth consorting with Demons despite it going against the very principles your character abides by (if she/he has any) or is it better to kill the son to save Redcliffe? Is blood magic even "evil"? While Merrill's whole quest was incredibly broken and made no sense, I understood the theme: Is it woth sacrificing everything you are, including your soul, if there is a chance to get back your history? With Connor, it depends on how you play. You can sacrifice Isolde or kill Connor. However, if there is a third option, wouldn't you take it? Wouldn't you take that RISK?
Okay, first off, you are wrong about your distance and time.
Dagna, the dwarf who wishes to join the Circle, says that travel from Orzammar to the Circle, two locations practically right next to each other on the Ferelden map, takes a few weeks. Travelling from the far side of Lake Calenhad to the Circle would easily take a month, while returning would take another. You are risking that for practically the bulk of a season, a possessed demon child who has butchered a castle and town will just twiddle his thumbs for weeks on end.
Second off, chill the heck out. I did not accuse you of meta-gaming... and even if I was, it is not a crime.
Replaying a game with knowledge of other outcomes is part of the fun in replaying a game. In terms of the Connor quest, this enjoyment is often reduced by finding out that there is a simple backdoor way to prevent anyone from dying or any negative thing from happening. There's a reason Gaider, the lead writer of the DA series, says he regrets having the quest play out that way - he says it gives the player far too little incentive to do anything else once they know how that option works.
And no, I didn't know that Harrowmont was going to be an inept, cruel leader. There are subtle hints (for instance, if you bring Zevran to meet him, Zevran calls both Harrowmont out as well as the Warden for even considering to support him) but it came as a surprise. Bhelen was pretty clear he was a reformer - a schemer, for sure, but still - someone who would build for a better future. In the end, I chose Harrowmont. I do not feel "punished" for doing so, but I do find some of Bhelen's endings much more satisfying. Having Harrowmont use the Anvil to wipe out all the castless in Dust Town is a very interesting development in the epilogues, though.
But it all boils down to the option you discussed with Wynne. It isn't a bad decision if you had to sacrifice something to get Wynne early, perhaps. Maybe by going to the Circle first, then Redcliffe to get the best endings there, things in Orzammar and the Brecillian Forest begin falling apart by the time you show up. But to just say "if you do the Circle first, then Redcliffe, you have the option of getting the magic best outcome" is, to me, a cheap way of doing things. It rewards those who, randomly, chose the Mages first, while penalizing those who didn't. If the game had telegraphed the consequences of picking the order a little better, this could have been acceptable. But otherwise, it becomes rote behavior to just play the Circle first to get Wynne and get the best outcomes. And that, I feel, is simply the original third option with some tap-dancing.
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freed the tower first.
