194 réponses à ce sujet

[megawug]

What RedJohn is saying is that at 20 or 30 FPS, GI is better, since enemies don't shoot back. At 60+ FPS, AIU is better, since enemies hit too quickly to be avoided.

[lightswitch]

Not sure why you were expecting a polite response when the only contribution you made to the discussion was to state that my opinion was valueless. I don't know how you play, I'm sure you're great, I was just arguing a point. FWIW I'm not claiming to be better than anyone. I don't take BSN seriously. I don't think anyone should. We're discussing a video game.

[RedJohn]

Back on topic. AIU thrives in the middle of a spawn. Explain to me how accuracy bonuses are so critical that they make up for significantly less damage output.

Give me a shotgun, three bosses, tell me to kill them as fast as possible and give me the choice between an AIU and a GI, and I'll take the AIU almost every time. Only possible exceptions being the Piranha and the GPS. Maybe the Raider as well, but I doubt it.

Still bro, you are narrowing the possibilities to a simple close quarters combat, while I agree with you that AIU has the advantage in close quarters for her ability to LOL at incoming damage and her higher damage output.

And to be clear, her damage output isn't also a real advantage most of the cases against the GI, because both of them would kill any unit with a single headshot, so in that case doesn't matter if AIU do 99999999999 of damage and GI only 5K when both of them blow the head of the guy with 4K, because we know both of them would blow up the heads of any mook.

And even against bosses the difference shouldn't be so big either in a 1 Vs 1, I personally wouldn't trade that damage difference for the RoF and accuracy bonus.

While it's true that you can only take real advantage of the RoF with few shotguns I believe the accuracy bonus is real important for what I said above, doesn't matter how fast you run, it won't be faster than a shot, in that case GI would be more versatile because it could adapt to different situations faster than AIU.

And while AIU has an advantage in damage output per shot ( it's not so really big either. ) the GI still more efective at mid-long range and has almost a similar performance at low range of AIU.

megawug wrote...

What RedJohn is saying is that at 20 or 30 FPS, GI is better, since enemies don't shoot back. At 60+ FPS, AIU is better, since enemies hit too quickly to be avoided.

lol
I play at 60 FPS, yo.


Besides, what you said is that you can't handle GI at 60 FPS? 

Modifié par RedJohn, 23 août 2013 - 06:05 .

[Supreme Leech]

me0120 wrote...

XFG-65 wrote...

me0120, what are triple hits?

With 2m+ penetration if you hit an Atlas in the right spot of the canopy it will literally hit up to three times, all of which are affected by defense modifiers. That paired with double hits on Phantoms and Banshees, one hit being free of defense based modifiers and the second being affected by defense based modifiers and headshots. You can do a ton of damage to Phantoms like this. Even on host.

Sorry to sound dumb, but I'm still a little unclear. Which spot do you have to hit on the canopy of the atlas to achieve this triple hit? Does triple hit mean that one claymore shot will do the same damage as 3 claymore shots if you hit the right spot? And for the phantoms and banshees, where do you have to hit them to get the double hits? I frequently seem to be doing little damage to phantoms from direct claymore shots, I don't really aim for any particular body part or anything.

[me0120]

XFG-65 wrote...

me0120 wrote...

XFG-65 wrote...

me0120, what are triple hits?

With 2m+ penetration if you hit an Atlas in the right spot of the canopy it will literally hit up to three times, all of which are affected by defense modifiers. That paired with double hits on Phantoms and Banshees, one hit being free of defense based modifiers and the second being affected by defense based modifiers and headshots. You can do a ton of damage to Phantoms like this. Even on host.

Sorry to sound dumb, but I'm still a little unclear. Which spot do you have to hit on the canopy of the atlas to achieve this triple hit? Does triple hit mean that one claymore shot will do the same damage as 3 claymore shots if you hit the right spot? And for the phantoms and banshees, where do you have to hit them to get the double hits? I frequently seem to be doing little damage to phantoms from direct claymore shots, I don't really aim for any particular body part or anything.

To me the Atlas triple hit is sporadic. I tend to aim for the lower center of the canopy since I get the most consistent results there. And yes, it is the same as hitting with an Atlas thrice (this is the best arguement for AP > Inc. against armory btw).

For Phantoms and Banshees you get one hit against the bubble and the second hit against the body. Basically always aim for the body. If you want to do damage to on-host Phantoms with a Claymore you should either get a headshot or force her into a non DR action such as taking cover, or doing a melee. With the GI you can use Proxy Mine to make her set up a bubble and get an easy 2x hit + headshot.

[capn233]

XFG-65 wrote...

me0120 wrote...

XFG-65 wrote...

me0120, what are triple hits?

With 2m+ penetration if you hit an Atlas in the right spot of the canopy it will literally hit up to three times, all of which are affected by defense modifiers. That paired with double hits on Phantoms and Banshees, one hit being free of defense based modifiers and the second being affected by defense based modifiers and headshots. You can do a ton of damage to Phantoms like this. Even on host.

Sorry to sound dumb, but I'm still a little unclear. Which spot do you have to hit on the canopy of the atlas to achieve this triple hit? Does triple hit mean that one claymore shot will do the same damage as 3 claymore shots if you hit the right spot? And for the phantoms and banshees, where do you have to hit them to get the double hits? I frequently seem to be doing little damage to phantoms from direct claymore shots, I don't really aim for any particular body part or anything.

Take a look here.

[RedJohn]

@XFG-65, dude is never dumb to ask a question

Also, no, is not like you shot 3 times with claymore because shotguns have a bullet spread and not all bullets hit in the same place.

[Supreme Leech]

Well, seems like there is very little that I know about this game. Thanks for the explanations. And that link was really useful, I never knew any of that stuff, all those weak points and stuff.

[me0120]

RedJohn wrote...

@XFG-65, dude is never dumb to ask a question

Also, no, is not like you shot 3 times with claymore because shotguns have a bullet spread and not all bullets hit in the same place.

For every pellet that is affected by the triple hit allowance it is like the pellet hit three times. Is that good enough?

[Alijah Green]

Accuracy gives you the benefits of missing more targets then hitting them just ask the Crusader I am sure he will tell you about all the hate he has received over the year

[RedJohn]

me0120 wrote...

RedJohn wrote...

@XFG-65, dude is never dumb to ask a question

Also, no, is not like you shot 3 times with claymore because shotguns have a bullet spread and not all bullets hit in the same place.

For every pellet that is affected by the triple hit allowance it is like the pellet hit three times. Is that good enough?

Yes, the bullet hit 3 times, and of course is good, but on claymore you won't feel it that much, if you want to see a big difference you should take Crussader.

Alijah Green wrote...

Accuracy gives you the benefits of missing more targets then hitting them just ask the Crusader I am sure he will tell you about all the hate he has received over the year

No man don't compare them because it's not the same.

The crussader is bugged, the shot lands where you were aiming 0.2 seconds before shoting, that's why people miss a lot with it, because it's bugged, not because it doesn't have spread.

[Alijah Green]

I understand the triple hit but most player aren't aware of the fact or can't shot

edit
speaking of the Crusader that would make the AIU the clear winner in that regard 

Modifié par Alijah Green, 23 août 2013 - 06:45 .

[Dunvi]

Alijah Green wrote...

Accuracy gives you the benefits of missing more targets then hitting them just ask the Crusader I am sure he will tell you about all the hate he has received over the year

aka i'm a scrub and can't aim

[me0120]

Crusader is actually my favorite Anti-Dragoon gun. Popcorn, popcorn everywhere!

[Tallgeese_VII]

They are simply different and both are OP enough to make your opinion meaningless.

[RedJohn]

I like to use crussader...

On drell vanguard.

Come at me BSN.

[Salarian Jesus]

FatherOfPearl wrote...

...thank you for stating the obvious.

Another quality RedJohn thread!

[RedJohn]

Well, if it was so obvious we wouldn't have a nice debate here, don't you think?

btw, time to sleep for me, see you tomorrow.

[capn233]

Crusader you say... what if I told you everything you thought you knew about the Crusader was a lie?

[me0120]

capn233 wrote...

Crusader you say... what if I told you everything you thought you knew about the Crusader was a lie?

I don't even know where to begin.

[Dr. Tim Whatley]

me0120 wrote...

capn233 wrote...

Only one way to settle this...

Lightswitch and RJ duel it out over a game, whoever loses leaves BSN forever...whoever wins leaves BSN forever.

...?

Great idea me.

[Alijah Green]

capn233 wrote...

Crusader you say... what if I told you everything you thought you knew about the Crusader was a lie?

it's BSN 

[DHKany]

Beerfish wrote...

GI has snap freeze spam and great surviveability?

lrn2wallhax

[Creator Limbs]

Repair Matrix does not make the AIU have great survivability. Playing her capably does. Surviving means not dying.

[Tokenusername]

prostheticlimbs wrote...

Repair Matrix does not make the AIU have great survivability. Playing her capably does. Surviving means not dying.

Being a noob also means forgetting that RM does like 3 other things besides res you.