102 réponses à ce sujet

[Shadow Fox]

DKJaigen wrote...

MisterJB wrote...

Allan Schumacher wrote...

Maybe I'm just misreading things on the internet, but is this discussion really as hostile (between some posters, anyways) as I read it to be?

This is actually pretty tame. I mean, I've been called a rapist for choosing to side with the Templars at the end of DA2.

No your dip**** that defends rape.

*grabs popcorn and prepares to watch the bloodshed*

[DKJaigen]

Allan Schumacher wrote...

Maybe I'm just misreading things on the internet, but is this discussion really as hostile (between some posters, anyways) as I read it to be?

Where have you been mate? we are dealing with 2 factions that believe in their own right since DAO. I ditched this when it became clear it serves no end and we talk in circles.

[Shadow Fox]

Marten Stroud wrote...

Because many of the Circle mages aren't as powerful as people think.

Two circles being overrun with demons says otherwise just saying.

[Cainhurst Crow]

simfamSP wrote...

To me, they're both in the wrong, they're both acting like spoilt-brats, holding their breath until one or the other gives up and says "you're right." Another good example is the tyrannical parent, who keeps their child away from anything for "their own good" until one day, that child grows up to become rebellious, and ultimatley a lot worse off than he/she would if they were given the same freedom and trust others would.

I can agree with this, I really don't like either side, despite what some may think. Templars and mages can both go screw really, and I feel the chantry does let the templars go on too loose a leash. There's no standards involved with the templars, they all just do their own thing under the bare basics of what is to be expected. Some like fereldan's circle isn't bad, the templars seemed very fair there, not abusive, not cruel. Than you get kirkwall, which makes them all seem like complete and total heartless monsters whose few good members get weeded out before it's all over.

I just get sick and tired of so much "pro-mage" speak on here as if somehow, the fact that they have all this power would be a-okay to have no restrictions or means of law enforcement for them because they are kept in the circle towers. I would like a reformed circle, but for the majority of the reforms to be focused on the freedom of authority the templars have in the tower, and enforce a screening process in which the mental state of templars are taken into account along with the physical. Maybe a few more freedoms here and there, but not enough so that mages would have supremely lax restrictions as occurs in places like rivian or tevinter. There has to be some control involved, you can't get around that. They are basically, to use the closest analogy we have in this world because magic doesn't exist, people who have guns permanently atteched to their bodies, and can't be disarmed without amputation or lobotimy. The circles seem like the best middle ground option avaliable between making mages special class citizens with more rights than others, and oppressing them brutally, at least that is how I feel the circles are suppose to be. I don't view them as inherant prison death camps as some others on here probably do.

[Cainhurst Crow]

Realmzmaster wrote...

Karlone123 wrote...

Star fury wrote...

Maria Caliban wrote...
Non-mages can have magical abilities. Did you not notice the Warrior specialization where you can absorb the life force of your enemies?

Mages cast spells by channeling energies from the Fade. We know every living creature is in contact with the Fade. Mages take lyrium to increase their mana. Tempars need lyrium to utilize their abilities*.

There even seem to be magical animals.

* And before anyone mentiones Alistiar, he's a Theirin. They've revealed his bloodline is super magical and revives dragons or something. That's the reason he didn't need lyrium.

Does the same go for the Warden and Hawke?

That falls under story lore and gameplay segregation. If Bioware did not allow gamers to have access to the Templar specialization they would whine about being able to learn from the other companions but not Alistair. Some actions are taken for the sake of gameplay even if they are lore bending or breaking.

I thought being a reaver required either a demonic pact or a ritual involving dragons blood. Not something just anyone could do.

[Star fury]

MisterJB wrote...

This is actually pretty tame. I mean, I've been called a rapist for choosing to side with the Templars at the end of DA2.

Mages can be rapists too, Fenris easily confirms that. Just saying.

[Hellion Rex]

I am pro mage and anti-Circle all the way, but I do agree that many Circle mages aren't that strong when fighting alone. When fighting together, like against a Right of Annulment, then they most certainly grow stronger. The average mage, I would argue, is not that strong. Beyond that, there are most certainly very powerful mages like Anders, Wynne, Fiona, Rhys, the Warden, and Hawke, etc. But those exceptionally strong ones are few and far between.

[Hellion Rex]

Star fury wrote...

MisterJB wrote...

This is actually pretty tame. I mean, I've been called a rapist for choosing to side with the Templars at the end of DA2.

Mages can be rapists too, Fenris easily confirms that. Just saying.

You have a good point. But I'm betting that rape by mage is more common in the Imperium, where mages clearly hold the power in that society. Not to say that a mage couldn't do the same in the Fereldan Circle, or Orlais.

[Hellion Rex]

Marten Stroud wrote...

Arcane Warrior Mage Hawke wrote...

Marten Stroud wrote...

Because many of the Circle mages aren't as powerful as people think.

Two circles being overrun with demons says otherwise just saying.

But how many mages within those Circles were responsible for the problem?

There are certainly very powerful mages, but that doesn't make them corruptible.

There are corruptible mages, but that doesn't make them powerful.

It seems most mages are either decent people or just weak.

Otherwise, the templars would have lost this war long ago.

While I agree with you, the reverse could be true in that most mages never get a chance to test their powers, tp see what their limits are, especially under the supervision of Templars. While some are undoubtedly weak, I would say that mages merely have untapped potential.

[Androme]

Remember that Templars are specialized in dealing with Mages. They're equal matches, if not more powerful than Mages.

[Daerog]

Androme wrote...

Remember that Templars are specialized in dealing with Mages. They're equal matches, if not more powerful than Mages.

Depends on mage, depends on Templar. Blood magic seems to complicate matters for some reason. Jowain was able to knock out a group of Templars with a flick of his wrist, and he was a pretty poor mage to begin with.

[thebatmanreborn]

I suppose it makes more sense than Batman being able to take down the entire Justice League...by himself. He has no powers but he can beat anyone, anywhere if given time. He does it by deducing weakness and then exposing it. Maybe that's what templars do. They hang out with mages all the time. they pinpoint weaknesses and expose them to their advantage.

[MaraGriffyn]

Allan Schumacher wrote...

Maybe I'm just misreading things on the internet, but is this discussion really as hostile (between some posters, anyways) as I read it to be?

People get *very* angry about fictional magic social justice on the internet.

[Cainhurst Crow]

thebatmanreborn wrote...

I suppose it makes more sense than Batman being able to take down the entire Justice League...by himself. He has no powers but he can beat anyone, anywhere if given time. He does it by deducing weakness and then exposing it. Maybe that's what templars do. They hang out with mages all the time. they pinpoint weaknesses and expose them to their advantage.

That honestly sounds a bit more like mary sue writing than anything else. The batman part, and a bit of the templar part as well. Considering they'd need a way to get close enough to exploit those weaknesses, and there are multiple spells to stop precisely that from happening.

But that's just my personal opinion on the matter.

[VampireSoap]

DaerogTheDhampir wrote...

Androme wrote...

Remember that Templars are specialized in dealing with Mages. They're equal matches, if not more powerful than Mages.

Depends on mage, depends on Templar. Blood magic seems to complicate matters for some reason. Jowain was able to knock out a group of Templars with a flick of his wrist, and he was a pretty poor mage to begin with.

LOL! He's like the worst mage in the whole game

[Ausstig]

[quote]General Malor wrote...
[/quote]I think this falls down to a question of human rights, or basic rights for all races of Thedas, and it should start from there.

A general has just as much power to wipe out a village as a mage. A king can oppress people his people and force them to live as he sees fir if he's influential enough.

It's a debate regarding people vs power. Is it the power's fault or the persons? It's the same issue of blood magic.

[/quote]


Thedas has no human rights, it is a medevial society, they are doing well to mostly get rid of slavery. 

You need to view not in the context of 21st century views, but medevial views. 

[Shadow Fox]

Except in Medieval times women weren't allowed to bear arms or join the army.And in most nations homosexuality was considered an unforgivable sin.

[eye basher]

A templar is like Mr Sinister in marvel doesn't matter how powerful a mutant you are because he can turn off your powers.

[Renmiri1]

Yet earlier still homosexuality was common, in Rome and Egypt. I think the difference was the dominant religion at the time, in medieval Europe it was Catholicism and both Rome and Egypt were pantheists (had multiple gods).

Andraste's religion doesn't seem to worried about regulating morals, it is a lot more worried about magic and demons. I imagine their society is also less fixated on who sleeps with whom and more on who does blood magic.

[VampireSoap]

eye basher wrote...

A templar is like Mr Sinister in marvel doesn't matter how powerful a mutant you are because he can turn off your powers.

Hey! That's a cheap comparison! You've played DAO, right? You can't permanently disable a mage's power, you can't even make sure you strike first. The mages can sense you before you can see them with your mortal eyes. They can fry you with lightning coming out of their freaking fingertips as soon as you open the door...

[Realmzmaster]

Darth Brotarian wrote...

Realmzmaster wrote...

Karlone123 wrote...

Star fury wrote...

Maria Caliban wrote...
Non-mages can have magical abilities. Did you not notice the Warrior specialization where you can absorb the life force of your enemies?

Mages cast spells by channeling energies from the Fade. We know every living creature is in contact with the Fade. Mages take lyrium to increase their mana. Tempars need lyrium to utilize their abilities*.

There even seem to be magical animals.

* And before anyone mentiones Alistiar, he's a Theirin. They've revealed his bloodline is super magical and revives dragons or something. That's the reason he didn't need lyrium.

Does the same go for the Warden and Hawke?

That falls under story lore and gameplay segregation. If Bioware did not allow gamers to have access to the Templar specialization they would whine about being able to learn from the other companions but not Alistair. Some actions are taken for the sake of gameplay even if they are lore bending or breaking.

I thought being a reaver required either a demonic pact or a ritual involving dragons blood. Not something just anyone could do.

The reaver specialization is unlocked whn the warden accepts the deal from Kolgrim. It involves drinking the blood of Dragonlings and learning about the specialization from Kolgrim.

[kinderschlager]

Allan Schumacher wrote...

Maybe I'm just misreading things on the internet, but is this discussion really as hostile (between some posters, anyways) as I read it to be?

pro-mage vs pro-templar players. what did you expect?