1868 réponses à ce sujet

[Wesley Wyndam Price]

Sir Ulrich Von Lichenstien wrote...

The Angry One wrote...

Considering the spam clogging this thread I'm hardly likely to read or respond to every post.

*sighs* The spam that you are contributing to with your repeated comments? yes?

Ok just wanted to clarify that thanks.

*leaves the topic again because fed up of people who are so hypocritical that they can't even see that they are a hypocrite*

Thank you

.....and with that said I exit the thread too.

[Packetdancer]

Those of us who bought points ahead of time basically paid $5 for what is effectively a preorder. I don't know about where you guys all live, but my local Starbucks charges more than that for half of the drinks on their menu. And I'll probably get more lasting enjoyment out of RtO than out of a given single latté.



(Come to think of it, Starbucks could be considered sort of the coffee equivalent of Darkspawn. They infect an area, spreading rapidly... ahem. I digress.)



I mean, let's keep a little perspective: $5 isn't the end of the world. If you'd paid $500 to preorder some new device that got delayed, I could understand some outrage. But they've been pretty up-front with us now about what happened, why the delay, and what they're doing to address that in the future.



So sit back and relax, maybe with a caffeinated drink of some form from your local Omnipresent Overpriced Possibly-Evil Coffee Chain. We've voiced our concerns, they've owned up to the mistake and told us how they intend to address it. I'm fairly sure they'll get it out as soon as they can; it's not like they /don't/ want people buying it.

[addiction21]

CoS Sarah Jinstar wrote...



How is quoting your exact words, twisting your words? I was actually asking you a serious question out of curiosity of how many reports that it works fine would it take? You guys complain about people speculating that the DLC isn't the issue, then in the same breath you speculate yourselves that its not the final version or its unfinished or people are just entitlement ****s. When really thats not the case. Just seems kinda holier than thou and hypocritical imo.

Just because you qoute my words means nothing.

CoS Sarah Jinstar wrote...

 Or do certain people just ignore post that have first hand experience with RTO for the sake of saying "you're wrong! you don't deserve any info suffer infidel!" 

Seriously its really getting old. 

I say something then you twist it and state that I am doing something that I am not and that what I said meant something entirely different.
As further proof I know I am speculating but I am not drawing any hard conclusions or basing my opnion of what is happening on those speculations. No one including myself here has any solid real evidence of what has gone on or what is happening behind the scenes. As I said flimsy circumstational and speculative evidence. That is no evidence at all and one should never take it as the whole truth.
"I saw half the local highschool football team going into your significant others home. He/she must be cheating on you"
The first part is real evidence I saw that. The bolded part is circumstational. I have no idea what is going on behind those closed doors. For all I know your significant other could be a tutuor but I have drawn my own conclusion to what has happened from prior evidence that in no way inflects on what has actualy happened.
People see something or read a statement from BW and then guess as to what has actualy happened with no actual evidence.
There is a big difference between people who are discussing what could be going on based on what we have seen and those that have made hard conclusions and filed them under "fact".
I am done repeating myself after this sarah. I am not or have been complaing about people asking for more informtaion or specualtiong so if that has been unclear I apologize.
My problem lies with how and why they are coming to their conclusions and the methods they post in.  I have not just outright called anyone stupid, troll, fanboy, etc... to dismiss their opnion/argument and then walked away. Maybe some might think they are implied, so whatever I cannot change that but I provide reasons as to what I am saying.
(I know I am not as clear, consise, and eloquent as others and get misinterperted. So I am sorry and will just be shutting up now)
Now just leave me alone I would like to go back to making easy one sentance off topic jokes...

[bconk55]

The Angry One wrote...

Of course you people can incessantly whine and moan about the people who dare to complain about this situation all you want, right?
The hypocrisy is so thick here I could slice it with a knife.

Is it wrong that I get annoyed by people who sling "hypocrisy" around? I guess I'm like Merin in that sense (and his annoyance over "irony").

Ignoring for the fact that no one is saying you CAN'T whine, only that it is tedious or pointless or unfounded...whatever...let's remember one thing: if I tell you you shouldn't run with scissors and then I trot off with a stapler in my hand, I'm not being hypocritical. I said you shouldn't run WITH SCISSORS, not that you shouldn't run with anything, or that you shouldn't run at all.

[deuce982]

Keep up the good work Bioware.

I hope it comes out within the next few days. I'd like to finally finish my first play through of DA before Mass Effect 2 comes out. I know how slow M$ certification team is...so it could be another two weeks waiting.

Right now, I'm currently crippled as all my specilization classes are locked unfortunately. Its somewhat game breaking for me, especially for my Ranger. Which sucks really bad without the pets lol.

[CoS Sarah Jinstar]

Packetdancer wrote...

Those of us who bought points ahead of time basically paid $5 for what is effectively a preorder. I don't know about where you guys all live, but my local Starbucks charges more than that for half of the drinks on their menu. And I'll probably get more lasting enjoyment out of RtO than out of a given single latté.

(Come to think of it, Starbucks could be considered sort of the coffee equivalent of Darkspawn. They infect an area, spreading rapidly... ahem. I digress.)

I mean, let's keep a little perspective: $5 isn't the end of the world. If you'd paid $500 to preorder some new device that got delayed, I could understand some outrage. But they've been pretty up-front with us now about what happened, why the delay, and what they're doing to address that in the future.

So sit back and relax, maybe with a caffeinated drink of some form from your local Omnipresent Overpriced Possibly-Evil Coffee Chain. We've voiced our concerns, they've owned up to the mistake and told us how they intend to address it. I'm fairly sure they'll get it out as soon as they can; it's not like they /don't/ want people buying it.

I try and stay away from Starbucks after seeing the effects of an accidently spilled regular cup of their coffee actually peel paint off a garage shop floor. Perfer Dunkin myself.

[addiction21]

CoS Sarah Jinstar wrote...


I try and stay away from Starbucks after seeing the effects of an accidently spilled regular cup of their coffee actually peel paint off a garage shop floor. Perfer Dunkin myself.

omg omg off topic RAWRRRRR!!!   Oh and both suck since neither have waffles

[CoS Sarah Jinstar]

addiction21 wrote...
Now just leave me alone I would like to go back to making easy one sentance off topic jokes...

You realize there's an off topic forum for that sort of thing. Come to think of it, I think a mod mentioned that to you already a couple times.

[bconk55]

Mechnic wrote...

So lets get this straight...I gave 5 bucks to BW/EA for a product that was promised in December? Right? Now how many other people did the same thing? To be frugal lets say 1million did...thats 5 million dollars thay got with NO interest!!!! They got a 5MILLION dollar loan interest free!!!! You don't get it do ya?

What?

[Alphakiller]

addiction21 wrote...

CoS Sarah Jinstar wrote...


I try and stay away from Starbucks after seeing the effects of an accidently spilled regular cup of their coffee actually peel paint off a garage shop floor. Perfer Dunkin myself.

omg omg off topic RAWRRRRR!!!   Oh and both suck since neither have waffles

I has a waffle iron... all waffle needs are fulfilled in my very own home.

[bzombo]

Wesley Wyndam Price wrote...

This thread has a high level of smug pollution.

ha! george clooney must have infected others.

Modifié par bzombo, 19 janvier 2010 - 08:32 .

[Darkknighthsd]

what i dont understand is why they even sell these game when there not finished, its not just bioware, all game comp are doing this now. the selling games as soon as it alittle playable, then after its on the market, do they try and fix it. why not fix this and all the bugs before its sold. its not like they dont have testers or counsoles, pc-- getting tired of paying 50$ for a unfinished product, and stores wont give money back once a game has been bought. kinda like eating raw cookies, tastes good, but its not done...............

[addiction21]

CoS Sarah Jinstar wrote...

addiction21 wrote...
Now just leave me alone I would like to go back to making easy one sentance off topic jokes...

You realize there's an off topic forum for that sort of thing. Come to think of it, I think a mod mentioned that to you already a couple times.

CoS Sarah Jinstar wrote...


I try and stay away from Starbucks after seeing the effects of an accidently spilled regular cup of their coffee actually peel paint off a garage shop floor. Perfer Dunkin myself.

Am I allowed to call that hypocrisy? Or irony?

[bzombo]

bconk55 wrote...

Mechnic wrote...

So lets get this straight...I gave 5 bucks to BW/EA for a product that was promised in December? Right? Now how many other people did the same thing? To be frugal lets say 1million did...thats 5 million dollars thay got with NO interest!!!! They got a 5MILLION dollar loan interest free!!!! You don't get it do ya?

What?

same here. not sure how assuming 1 million people bought points for rto is being frugal, but whatever.

[CoS Sarah Jinstar]

addiction21 wrote...

CoS Sarah Jinstar wrote...

addiction21 wrote...
Now just leave me alone I would like to go back to making easy one sentance off topic jokes...

You realize there's an off topic forum for that sort of thing. Come to think of it, I think a mod mentioned that to you already a couple times.

CoS Sarah Jinstar wrote...


I try and stay away from Starbucks after seeing the effects of an accidently spilled regular cup of their coffee actually peel paint off a garage shop floor. Perfer Dunkin myself.

Am I allowed to call that hypocrisy? Or irony?

Both if you'd like.

Modifié par CoS Sarah Jinstar, 19 janvier 2010 - 08:37 .

[Cayden711]

I respect victor lol and I belive bioware is trying there hardest. -claps-

[bconk55]

Darkknighthsd wrote...

what i dont understand is why they even sell these game when there not finished, its not just bioware, all game comp are doing this now. the selling games as soon as it alittle playable, then after its on the market, do they try and fix it. why not fix this and all the bugs before its sold. its not like they dont have testers or counsoles, pc-- getting tired of paying 50$ for a unfinished product, and stores wont give money back once a game has been bought. kinda like eating raw cookies, tastes good, but its not done...............

It's something that has always been a bit of an issue with PC gaming. One saving grace of console gaming used to be fairly polished releases, but with the addition of online connectivity, that seems to be taking a nose dive as well.

[MerinTB]

Rommel49 wrote...
Yes, I did read the original discourse

But either ignored or misintepreted it, it would appear.

(painful as it was)

See that dig?  That's an insult, and insults are meant to belittle.  Belittling someone in a debate is meant to dismiss.  Dismissing someone is ignoring their argument.  That is an ad hominem regardless of what else you say.

I could say "2+2 is 4.  2x2 is 4.  Math is pretty easy.  But for Joe Smoe math must be difficult since he's a retard."  The first two points are true.  The second is an opinion. The third is an ad hominem, regardless of what the first 3 points were.  The ad hominem doesn't make the first 3 points invalid, but it does weaken the argument overall by resorting to the logical fallacy.

Thing is, as I said, the fallacy doesn't apply to every criticism, etc. of a person.

Right.  We are in agreement.  I said it ON PAGE 5 - "an ad hominem isn't simply criticizing someone.  It's a logical fallacy because it derails or disrupts a discussion or debate without providing anything positive."
But dismissing someone with a label IS an ad hominem.  And "
but fanboyness is a form of
blindness, so paint me unsurprised if you're unable to see it" is directly an attempt to dismiss someone with a label, thus rendering their arguments pointless.

Using insults as rhetorical flourishes and the like doesn't qualify.

While just using insults is not ad hominem, and we agree on that, we'll have to disagree on insults ever being "rhetorical flourishes."  They are mean-spirited and counter-productive in a meaningful debate.  They add nothing but animosity and resentment.

This is why Style over Substance fits. Abriael's original point was essentially true and in actuality, it was never even really countered (it's just that the last sentence grabbed the most attention). If his argument contained nothing but the insult, then you'd have a point.

I'm sorry, but I disagree.  Since it was never my intention to debate the point he was making but instead point out that his insulting people and dismissing them with a label meant to demean and disregard said "fanboys", there is no Style over Substance.  As I said, and you willfully ignored, "
you said I was arguing for style over substance
when I was actually arguing for substance over style."

You continue from the straw man that I was attempting to dispute the poster's argument.  Almost your entire rebuttal returns to this.  But I wasn't.  I was trying to point out, at first with sarcastic humor and then with more serious discussion, that the dismissive name-calling is counter-productive.  When my attempting to make that point itself became counter-productive (as this discussion has crossed over into by now) I stopped pushing the point.

To quote you from page 5 "name-calling is a sign of a weak argument, or at the very least a weak arguer", you didn't even address the main thrust of his point; now that's the sign of a weak argument or debater. Honestly, you're seriously arguing that the presentation of an argument or point (with bonus points given for no insults, name-calling, etc. apparently) is indicative of its quality and dismissing arguments on that basis alone; that's the definition of a Style over substance fallacy.

Again, it was never my intent to dismiss his argument.  Only to point out the fallacy he was using and how it weakened his argument.
Pointing out someone's use of abusive langauge and logical fallacy is not "style over substance", it's about substance.  Your claim that insults can be "rhetorical flourishes" is the definition of style over substance - rhetoric itself is style over substance.  I was looking at the logical fallacies, which are NEVER productive in a discussion, and calling them out.
Presentation of an argument suggests I'm looking for word choice, paragraph length, opening and closing, that kind of thing.  I wasn't - I was looking at arguments that are logical fallacies.
And I really believe that it should be self-evident that "but fanboyness is a form of blindness, so paint me unsurprised if you're unable to see it" is clearly an attempt to dismiss a group of people as "fanboys" and therefor "blind" to the truth.  That's not a style issue, Rommel49, no matter how you paint it.

---

But this, too, has delved into being counter-productive. I've made my case.  Back to letting the thread (hopefully) get back on course.

Modifié par MerinTB, 19 janvier 2010 - 08:43 .

[Leonhartx]

Abriael_CG wrote...

So basically, you're saying that PC users have to wait further for RTO? We get 4 days of absolutely no communication, and then a big wall of text about the 360 (whose players are ALREADY enjoying the DLC we didn't even SEE), and no mention how when the hell we'll get the content many of us already paid for due to your misleading communication?
Paint me EXTREMELY disappointed.

Just release this damn DLC and do away with it. We all know that the PC one is ready to ship, and has been for days. PC users take a backseat to console users too often already.

If this is true, then I don't know why everyone who plays PC version isn't angry.

I mean I saw a lot of butt kissing on the first few pages and it just bothered me so much I just skipped like 20 pages.

Modifié par Leonhartx, 19 janvier 2010 - 08:44 .

[Mechnic]

Feraele wrote...

Mechnic wrote...

Feraele wrote...

And so Mechnic...you think that you will NEVER EVER be able to spend those points that it? That Bioware is a highway robber and that ..you're just out of luck??

Come on use your common sense.

You have the same armour so lets have
 some juggernaut enjoyment.  We can throw the differences aside and satisfy each other in an more intimate way. You do look very nice in that armour   Me thinks that us as a team can wipe out the darkspawn and finish this game completely....never having to return to Ostegar!!!

Well you know...my husband isn't known to like to share..you might have to ask him

Hold-on aren't you an "freed" woman? Why do you have to ask your husbands permission? Your posts in this forum do not show that you are controlled by your husband...on the contrary you seem to be very independant. So let's not put the blame on your husband but focus on what you are representing and what you are wishing for. You have been very assertive in your comments but yet you are very drawn back when someone calls you on it. So that tells me that you are very conservitve but want to explore different things and you are afraid of the response you would get from your peers. You should really listen to your inner self and go with that because that is basically what we are all built in our genes to do.