237 réponses à ce sujet

[David7204]

Such tactics are generally a cheap and easy way to feign maturity.

Unfortunately, just about any kind of subversive art, including fiction, gets lauded by some people merely on the grounds of being subversive.

Modifié par David7204, 28 août 2013 - 03:00 .

[DaringMoosejaw]

MisterJB wrote...

If we're talking about a scene where everyone you've loved dies, DAO had a few of those. The Human Noble Origins features two in, almost, quick sucession first in Highever and then in Ostagar.

If, on the other hand, we're talking about a direct consequences from the actions of the players; which would be my preferred method of implementing such a scene; I would at first be sadenned and then happy that Bioware actually managed to pull something like this off.

You've got a point, I didn't even consider that. I guess Fergus is our Blackfish in the scenario, however.

[Bfler]

ThePuppetWithNoStrings wrote...

I'm laughing just thinking of how this forum would blow up if they killed all your companions off at the end of the game. .

Obsidian did it in the original NWN 2. And as result they had to put things right in the Mask of the Betrayer expanison.

[Texhnolyze101]

ianvillan wrote...

As long as the one getting killed was Hawke then I would be happy.

Hawke plus the rest of DA2 crappy cast i would be so down to see such a thing.

[MisterJB]

iakus wrote...

No

I'm really sick of the "dark =deep" fad

The Red Wedding is anything but dark for the sake of being dark. It was a realistic consequence caused by the mistakes of Robb Stark.
Ultimately, fiction is about inciting an emotional response from the viewer/reader/player. And, unlike with ME3's ending which only led to people being confused and angry, the Red Wedding worked so well that it has become one of the defining moments of modern literature. I've never seen a fan of ASOIF claiming that s/he was unnafected by the Red Wedding. When the show was announced, one of the first things mentioned was how they would do the Red Wedding. The antecipation for it was palpable and since its debut on TV, look at how many reaction videos spawned on youtube.
The Red Wedding was an amazing piece of writing that, unlike ME3's ending, accomplished precisely what set out to accomplish. The emotional reactions of the readers and watchers were exactly what Mr. Martin was hoping for.

Which reminds, I hope Bioware never again does something like "Yes Cailan, a glorious day for us all"
Thanks, now I know he is an antagonist and is going to do something.

Modifié par MisterJB, 28 août 2013 - 03:06 .

[Wulfram]

MisterJB wrote...

The Red Wedding is anything but dark for the sake of being dark. It was a realistic consequence caused by the mistakes of Robb Stark.

Not really.  I mean, Robb was realistically screwed, but the actual way it played out required suicidal stupidity on the part of the Freys.

[DarkKnightHolmes]

They already made that. It's called "Battle of Ostagar".

Modifié par DarkKnightHolmes, 28 août 2013 - 03:08 .

[MisterJB]

DaringMoosejaw wrote...
You've got a point, I didn't even consider that. I guess Fergus is our Blackfish in the scenario, however.

The BlackFish was never at the Red Wedding, he remained in Riverrun with Robb's wife who was not a foreigner but rather a noblewoman from the Westerlands who never got pregnant because her mother was giving her contraceptives by order of Tywin who had planned the whole things from the start...

Sorry, book reader reaction.

[Iakus]

MisterJB wrote...

iakus wrote...

No

I'm really sick of the "dark =deep" fad

The Red Wedding is anything but dark for the sake of being dark. It was a realistic consequence caused by the mistakes of Robb Stark.
Ultimately, fiction is about inciting an emotional response from the viewer/reader/player. And, unlike with ME3's ending which only led to people being confused and angry, the Red Wedding worked so well that it has become one of the defining moments of modern literature. I've never seen a fan of ASOIF claiming that s/he was unnafected by the Red Wedding. When the show was announced, one of the first things mentioned was how they would do the Red Wedding. The antecipation for it was palpable and since its debut on TV, look at how many reaction videos spawned on youtube.
The Red Wedding was an amazing piece of writing that, unlike ME3's ending, accomplished precisely what set out to accomplish. The emotional reactions of the readers and watchers were exactly what Mr. Martin was hoping for.

As a consequence for being an idiot, sure.

But forcing it "Because Awesome" hell, no 

[Sanunes]

iakus wrote...

No

I'm really sick of the "dark =deep" fad

Me too.  

I was actually surprised they put the Red Wedding into Game of Thrones series, something like that is okay to read about, but when added into a visual medium that required people to come back weekly or purchase additional content such as DLC killing off a character just to be "edgy" is a bad move for that attachment has people coming back.

[Vilegrim]

Sure, with an option to be the Freys, if we play it right, or the Starks...if we play it that way.

[Dutchess]

They probably thought they were already doing something like that with Leandra, and the Hawke sibling(s). Considering how that went... I think it would be better for them to focus on something else.

[Star fury]

MisterJB wrote...

If we're talking about a scene where everyone you've loved dies, DAO had a few of those. The Human Noble Origins features two in, almost, quick sucession first in Highever and then in Ostagar.

If, on the other hand, we're talking about a direct consequences from the actions of the players; which would be my preferred method of implementing such a scene; I would at first be sadenned and then happy that Bioware actually managed to pull something like this off.

Bioware tried to do something like that in Leandra's death scene in DA2. I was mostly disgusted with the appearance of FrankenMom, next playthrough it was funny. Somehow I don't it was effect that Bioware wanted.

P.S. Great, ninja'd by seconds.

Modifié par Star fury, 28 août 2013 - 03:15 .

[MisterJB]

Wulfram wrote...
Not really.  I mean, Robb was realistically screwed, but the actual way it played out required suicidal stupidity on the part of the Freys.

Are you referring to the fact they broke one the sacred laws that hold Westeros together and now everyone hates them for it?

[metatheurgist]

So...rocks could fall and every dies? Oh wait, they already did that one in NWN2.

[Star fury]

Wulfram wrote...

MisterJB wrote...

The Red Wedding is anything but dark for the sake of being dark. It was a realistic consequence caused by the mistakes of Robb Stark.

Not really.  I mean, Robb was realistically screwed, but the actual way it played out required suicidal stupidity on the part of the Freys.

I doubt you read the book. Also try to google "Robert the Bruce John Comyn".

[The Night Mammoth]

David7204 wrote...

Such tactics are generally a cheap and easy way to feign maturity.

Unfortunately, just about any kind of subversive art, including fiction, gets lauded by some people merely on the grounds of being subversive.

The Red Wedding is anything but. The build-up takes hundreds of pages, numerous events and decisions, and its consequences are still being felt more than two books later. It's probably about one of the best things in fiction I've ever experienced. 

Unfortunately, I very much doubt BioWare has the ability, or the right medium, to pull something like it off. 

[Vilegrim]

MisterJB wrote...

Wulfram wrote...
Not really.  I mean, Robb was realistically screwed, but the actual way it played out required suicidal stupidity on the part of the Freys.

Are you referring to the fact they broke one the sacred laws that hold Westeros together and now everyone hates them for it?

I'd imagine so, but the really stupid thing was the way they acted afterwards, they aren't a major house and back chatting the Lannisters (pretty much the only people who could protect them in anyway) AND doing everything to alienate what few allies they have left...yes that was the real idiocy.

[David7204]

The OP specifically asked for no foreshadowing at all.

[The Night Mammoth]

David7204 wrote...

The OP specifically asked for no foreshadowing at all.

Where? 

[David7204]

The part where it says 'Just Cuz'? Although reading it again, the grammar and the meaning is a bit tough to make out.

[mupp3tz]

In general, I WOULD like something as "ballsy" as GoT, but I don't think it would work with DA. Perhaps on a different IP as I think many people would find it too much and there'd be lots of complaints about them trying to be edgy and ruining the franchise.

[GreyLycanTrope]

I'd be a bit shocking to say the least, the characters are usually the best part of these games, to kill them off randomly for shock value seems like a way to shoot themselves in the foot. It only worked in GoT because the universe honestly has enough characters to spare without sacrificing the audiences attachment to the world.

It might work if it's an optional outcome, or the worst case scenario if you make some bad decisions, but railroading the player into it would be a very poor idea.

Modifié par Greylycantrope, 28 août 2013 - 03:46 .

[The Night Mammoth]

That's hardly specifically asking for no foreshadowing at all.