68 réponses à ce sujet

[Rolling Flame]

Taleroth wrote...

Honestly that place is asking for trouble.

Ooh, ahh, abominations are dangerous! So let's gather up all the mages that are the greatest risk of becoming abominations and lock them in a place that aids the process.

Either the Templars are dumb as posts or abominations aren't half as dangerous as is claimed.

Or they have ways to deal with them inside the prison.

[brushyourteeth]

I would LOVE to go to Aeonar. Hearing about it was the point in the story at which I finally went "Wow. This Chantry thing is effed up."

Also seems like a really likely place for a tear in the Fade too.

[Potato Cat]

Taleroth wrote...

Honestly that place is asking for trouble.

Ooh, ahh, abominations are dangerous! So let's gather up all the mages that are the greatest risk of becoming abominations and lock them in a place that aids the process.

Either the Templars are dumb as posts or abominations aren't half as dangerous as is claimed.

I think the point is that they cannot legally make post-Harrowing mages Tranquil, but they can try and force them into becoming Abominations to kill them by taking them somewhere they don't want to be, with lots of really nice demon friends to choose from.

[Taleroth]

Rolling Flame wrote...

Taleroth wrote...

Honestly that place is asking for trouble.

Ooh, ahh, abominations are dangerous! So let's gather up all the mages that are the greatest risk of becoming abominations and lock them in a place that aids the process.

Either the Templars are dumb as posts or abominations aren't half as dangerous as is claimed.

Or they have ways to deal with them inside the prison.

Oh well, they have "ways." Where were these ways when the Circle of Ferelden or Kirkwall needed them?

Elfman wrote...

I think the point is that they cannot legally make post-Harrowing mages Tranquil, but they can try and force them into becoming Abominations to kill them by taking them somewhere they don't want to be, with lots of really nice demon friends to choose from.

[smilie]http://social.bioware.com/images/forum/emoticons/grin.png[/smilie]

That's great and all until one turns into a Pride demon and starts erecting Cullenfields.

You thought a regular prison riot was bad news...

Modifié par Taleroth, 30 août 2013 - 03:57 .

[DarthLaxian]

brushyourteeth wrote...

I would LOVE to go to Aeonar. Hearing about it was the point in the story at which I finally went "Wow. This Chantry thing is effed up."

Also seems like a really likely place for a tear in the Fade too.

that might be it:

we might start of as a prisoner there (we know that dissenters (not only mages!) are locked up there (they wanted to send Lilly there in DA:O and they did, too in the end))

greetings LAX

[Rolling Flame]

Taleroth wrote...

Rolling Flame wrote...

Taleroth wrote...

Honestly that place is asking for trouble.

Ooh, ahh, abominations are dangerous! So let's gather up all the mages that are the greatest risk of becoming abominations and lock them in a place that aids the process.

Either the Templars are dumb as posts or abominations aren't half as dangerous as is claimed.

Or they have ways to deal with them inside the prison.

Oh well, they have "ways." Where were these ways when the Circle of Ferelden or Kirkwall needed them?

Not in the Circles, because the Circles aren't supposed to be prisons.

The White Spire's dungeons had traps which would, at the flick of a switch, skewer anyone attempting to break out. I'd imagine Aeonar would have similar, if not more elaborate, defences. 

Modifié par Rolling Flame, 30 août 2013 - 04:06 .

[Lord Raijin]

Rolling Flame wrote...

Taleroth wrote...

Rolling Flame wrote...

Taleroth wrote...

Honestly that place is asking for trouble.

Ooh, ahh, abominations are dangerous! So let's gather up all the mages that are the greatest risk of becoming abominations and lock them in a place that aids the process.

Either the Templars are dumb as posts or abominations aren't half as dangerous as is claimed.

Or they have ways to deal with them inside the prison.

Oh well, they have "ways." Where were these ways when the Circle of Ferelden or Kirkwall needed them?

Not in the Circles, because the Circles aren't supposed to be prisons.

The White Spire's dungeons had traps which would, at the flick of a switch, skewer anyone attempting to break out. I'd imagine Aeonar would have similar, if not more elaborate, defences. 

Uh the Circles are in fact a mage prison... a low to medium security prison if you must rank it. You certainly can't walk out without being on an offical business.

Oh and I would love to see Aeonar in the game. I hope Bioware makes notes of it.

[dragonflight288]

Hmm..it would be interesting to see Aeonar. Especially since the standard practice for mage criminals is tranquilization or execution. Why would they have a prison with those punishments? Would it be specifically meant for non-mages to be sent to, like Lily?

It would be interesting to see.

[wcholcombe]

Lord Raijin wrote...

Rolling Flame wrote...

Taleroth wrote...

Rolling Flame wrote...

Taleroth wrote...

Honestly that place is asking for trouble.

Ooh, ahh, abominations are dangerous! So let's gather up all the mages that are the greatest risk of becoming abominations and lock them in a place that aids the process.

Either the Templars are dumb as posts or abominations aren't half as dangerous as is claimed.

Or they have ways to deal with them inside the prison.

Oh well, they have "ways." Where were these ways when the Circle of Ferelden or Kirkwall needed them?

Not in the Circles, because the Circles aren't supposed to be prisons.

The White Spire's dungeons had traps which would, at the flick of a switch, skewer anyone attempting to break out. I'd imagine Aeonar would have similar, if not more elaborate, defences. 

Uh the Circles are in fact a mage prison... a low to medium security prison if you must rank it. You certainly can't walk out without being on an offical business.

Oh and I would love to see Aeonar in the game. I hope Bioware makes notes of it.

Actually until recent issues, full mages in the circle enjoyed the ability to leave the circle with regularity.  The recent situations at the Circles isn't an indication of the longer term history of doing things.

[Darkclown1000]

Aeonar probably has anti magic runes on the walls like the door in the magi warden origin.

[Lord Raijin]

wcholcombe wrote...


Actually until recent issues, full mages in the circle enjoyed the ability to leave the circle with regularity.  The recent situations at the Circles isn't an indication of the longer term history of doing things.

Where did you hear this from? I was under the full impression that mages are not to be allowed out.

Modifié par Lord Raijin, 18 octobre 2013 - 12:19 .

[Hellion Rex]

Lord Raijin wrote...

wcholcombe wrote...


Actually until recent issues, full mages in the circle enjoyed the ability to leave the circle with regularity.  The recent situations at the Circles isn't an indication of the longer term history of doing things.

Where did you hear this from? I was under the full impression that mages are not to be allowed out.

They are not allowed out, not unless they have special permission and with a templar escort. The only true exception was Wynne, due to her help in the Blight.

[Medhia Nox]

My guess - is that Aeonar itself is ENCHANTED! with anti-magic runes.

Also - why send Lily there?

She's the rare past game character I'd love see return. As a hate filled, lyrium junkie Red Templar... and, the word JOWAN will be carved into her forehead.

Lily: "I never loved him. He controlled me with blood magic to help him escape! Arrrrgh - lady rage!"

[Laughing_Man]

So Aeonar is used in: "...making the guilty somewhat easier to tell from the innocent..."?

How exactly? By putting the the innocent in a place that will drive them insane until they turn into an abomination anyway? By "letting god sort them out"?
The idea of Aeonar is an example of everything that is wrong with the chantry-templars.

That said, I wouldn't be opposed to seeing this place in DA:I.
Large haunted castles are always a good location to explore...

[Angrywolves]

I hope so.
That place needs to be abolished.

[Magdalena11]

Lord Raijin wrote...

wcholcombe wrote...


Actually until recent issues, full mages in the circle enjoyed the ability to leave the circle with regularity.  The recent situations at the Circles isn't an indication of the longer term history of doing things.

Where did you hear this from? I was under the full impression that mages are not to be allowed out.

In Asunder, the same place we learn about the cells under the white spire.  Rhys has a mirror in his room Adrian bought him years ago while mages were still allowed out of the tower.  The white spire was only closed off a year previously, after the events in Kirkwall.

It would be cool to see it in game.  I always wondered about Aeonar as well.

[Lord Raijin]

Magdalena11 wrote...

Lord Raijin wrote...

wcholcombe wrote...


Actually until recent issues, full mages in the circle enjoyed the ability to leave the circle with regularity.  The recent situations at the Circles isn't an indication of the longer term history of doing things.

Where did you hear this from? I was under the full impression that mages are not to be allowed out.

In Asunder, the same place we learn about the cells under the white spire.  Rhys has a mirror in his room Adrian bought him years ago while mages were still allowed out of the tower.  The white spire was only closed off a year previously, after the events in Kirkwall.

It would be cool to see it in game.  I always wondered about Aeonar as well.

I see That is interesting to see. Damn! You guys are going to force me to stop reading Stolen throne and skip The Calling just to read Asunder. Seems like the book is far more interesting than the previous two.

[Medhia Nox]

@TheRedVipress: You're aware they don't just hold a lottery to put mages there right?

You want real world prisons abolished?

Think of it this way - it's an easier way of telling the criminal - from the criminally insane.

[Laughing_Man]

Medhia Nox wrote...

@TheRedVipress: You're aware they don't just hold a lottery to put mages there right?

You want real world prisons abolished?

Think of it this way - it's an easier way of telling the criminal - from the criminally insane.

So an evil blood-mage = criminal, and an innocent mage that was driven to insanity = criminally  insane?...
I'm impressed, every time you manage to surprise me with a new claim even more outragous than the last.

I just quoted the codex, it talked about seperating the *innocent* from the guilty.
That means someone who was thrown in because "you never know", "best to be safe", and my favorite "let god sort 'em out".

Does this make you uncomfortable enough to try and rephrase what was written?

And if this mage had the misfortune of being born with a talent that makes him closer to the fade, like a spirit healer? I would imagine that not only he would suffer endlessly in a place like this, but eventually will become an abomination regardless of his innocense or guilt.

Real world prisons are usually built to house those who were found guilty beyond reasonable doubt.

If I see something that looks like a duck, swims like a duck, and quacks like a duck, I'm going to call it a duck, not look for excuses to call it a swimming, quacking, horse.
You don't like mages? Good for you. 
You like the idea of an overzealous religious military organisation? Well, there's no accounting for taste, or lack of common sense. But don't try to pretend like their excrement smells of roses, that just makes you look like... someone who is not very smart.

Modifié par TheRedVipress, 18 octobre 2013 - 03:34 .

[AlexanderCousland]

Lord Raijin wrote...

Uh the Circles are in fact a mage prison... a low to medium security prison if you must rank it. You certainly can't walk out without being on an offical business.

Oh and I would love to see Aeonar in the game. I hope Bioware makes notes of it.

No. Some Mage's like the Circle and don't want to leave, furthermore, It Largely depends upon where the Circle is located and the Templars who operate said Circle in terms of how strict the Circle may or may not be.

[Medhia Nox]

@TheRedVipress: Wow, that's a lot of projection.

Lily was sent to Aeonar(and she's not even a mage, but maybe you're not outraged by a mundane being sent there), because she was GUILTY in collaboration with a blood mage - she'll be "innocent" if she proves to no longer be ensorcelled by blood magic.

Maybe you see their use of innocent might not mean... "They drag mages out of their beds at night just to see if they survive the Aeonar gauntlet."

Also - I'm not anti-mage. I think even Xilizhra can attest on some small level that this is true by now. I just don't fly off the handle in a mage rage at anything designed to keep mages in check. I think these systems have a purpose, and throwing a huge temper tantrum is only going to make it worse - not better.

I'll be playing a mage - just not a mage who drank the cool aid.

Modifié par Medhia Nox, 18 octobre 2013 - 04:04 .

[Laughing_Man]

@ Medhia Nox
We never really got an explanation as to why Lily, a non-mage, was supposed to be sent to a "mage-prison". I don't really see where you got the idea that Jowan controlled her with blood-magic.
Their story is the classic "forbidden-love" story, there's no need or reason to think that she was controlled. (aside from your desire to smear Jowan as someone who not only used blood magic for self-defense, but for rape.)
*She wouln't and couldn't have refused to ran with him if he controlled her.*

And as for implying that I don't care about her because she is not a mage, well, that's just stupid.
The only thing I ever claimed, was that you shouldn't treat innocent people or mages like the worse kind of criminals, no matter how good you think your reasons are.
Because it's both evil and stupid, and when it all blows up in your face, that is just you lying in the bed you made yourself.

I also claimed that some kind of law-enforcment agency should exist, and that this agency should work for the welfare of *good* mages as well as non-mages. (there are other models out there aside from templars. Take Dresden-Files's White Council for example, they are wizards who police other wizards rather viciously, but usually they are fair compared to DA templars.)

By innocent I meant - an apostate living somewhere minding his own business and not eating children, being dragged away to Aeonar by a few overzealous fanatics because he looks funny to them so they decide that he must be an abomination or a "maleficar".

And if you are "not" anti-mage, I don't know what else anti-mage could mean, aside for someone who calles for their death.
With friends like you, the mages won't have enemies.

Modifié par TheRedVipress, 18 octobre 2013 - 05:29 .

[wcholcombe]

Lord Raijin wrote...

Magdalena11 wrote...

Lord Raijin wrote...

wcholcombe wrote...


Actually until recent issues, full mages in the circle enjoyed the ability to leave the circle with regularity.  The recent situations at the Circles isn't an indication of the longer term history of doing things.

Where did you hear this from? I was under the full impression that mages are not to be allowed out.

In Asunder, the same place we learn about the cells under the white spire.  Rhys has a mirror in his room Adrian bought him years ago while mages were still allowed out of the tower.  The white spire was only closed off a year previously, after the events in Kirkwall.

It would be cool to see it in game.  I always wondered about Aeonar as well.

I see That is interesting to see. Damn! You guys are going to force me to stop reading Stolen throne and skip The Calling just to read Asunder. Seems like the book is far more interesting than the previous two.

Correct, also I believe Wynne(prior to being Archmage) was out of the tower when the Ferelden tower went all psycho.

Also, Mages in the towers are better fed and better educated than the general populace.  Life in a circle tower was actually fairly good as long as you obeyed the rules prior to Kirkwall.  Also, both the Knight Commander in Val Royeux and in Ferelden were considered to be fair minded by the mages, except for the extremist who went and got themselves possessed.  From reading assunder there are probably extremist mages the other way who think those two knight commanders were too soft on the mages.

As for the books, unless you haven't played Awakening yet, I would skip the calling and read Asunder first, it was a much more enjoyable book in my opinion.  If you are holding off on playing awakening than read calling first.

[DarthSideus2]

Renmiri1 wrote...

I'd love to have a side quest to rescue Anders and or Merril / Bethany / Hawke from Aeonar ^^

+10 

[Lord Raijin]

FreshIstay wrote...

Lord Raijin wrote...

Uh the Circles are in fact a mage prison... a low to medium security prison if you must rank it. You certainly can't walk out without being on an offical business.

Oh and I would love to see Aeonar in the game. I hope Bioware makes notes of it.

No. Some Mage's like the Circle and don't want to leave, furthermore, It Largely depends upon where the Circle is located and the Templars who operate said Circle in terms of how strict the Circle may or may not be.

The ones who do not want to leave are most likley indoctrinated by their templar jailers. The mages who were sent to the Circle as children were most likley not trained to deal with the outside as they reached adulthood.. The Circle is what they know of and I'm sure that the templars drilled it into their minds that the outside world is dangerous for them, which is why many do not want to leave. It's part of the indocrination of the Chantry. Some people like Anders and Jowan woke up and realize that their templar jailers were full of crap.

Prior to Asunder and Kirkwall the Circle were very much like a prison. It was even said so in Origins playing the mage story.