403 réponses à ce sujet

[Wintersembrace]

children cant consent full stop there kids and don't know any better despite how smart they think they might be any one that abuse the trust a child places in then should be beaten to an inch of there life then dumped on a dirt road left to what ever.....

[ITSSEXYTIME]

Social influence has a profound effect on whether psychological issues arise. The example of homosexual youth still stands, if you grow up learning something is "wrong" you will undoubtedly have issues.





You are correct that the idea of a child making an informed decision is a flimsy one. I would make the point however that we're not discussing a static age but rather the entirety of youth, a 5 year old is less likely to understand the concept as an 11 year old might be able to. There simply isn't enough evidence to objectively say that all, or even the majority of youth are incapable of understanding the significance and implications of a sexual relationship.

[ToastyToci]

 Probably not because lesbian scenes are hot but gay scenes are just gross.

[T1l]

Does anyone else find it disturbing that someone called "ITSSEXYTIME" (all in caps) is talking about paedophilia?

I don't know; call me crazy, but I find it a little... erm, inappropriate.



Seriously, what the hell happened to the Bioware forums? Where the hell are Chris Priestly and Stanley Woo? Christ - better yet, take a step back and think about the people who might possibly read this; the Bioware developers and writers themselves. What has their community become? What the hell, guys.

[Eternal Dust]

Seriously people. Drop the pedophilia discussion.

[ITSSEXYTIME]

Yeah admittedly this discussion does not belong here and i'll shoulder the blame for my part in continuing it. I did try to change the subject a few times but it didn't catch much attention.

[Collider]

ITSSEXYTIME wrote...
 I would make the point however that we're not discussing a static age but rather the entirety of youth

This is the entire point. As childhood constitutes so many years, we should assume that they are not mature enough. As for scientific evidence, it's pretty simple. The brain is STILL maturing during those years and still is lagging behind teenagers and adults. They haven't developed sexually completely or nearly completely yet. They likely haven't learned about it in school. Their parents have given them a condensed "birds and bees" story covered in sugar and honey.

There simply isn't enough evidence to objectively say that all, or even the majority of youth are incapable of understanding the significance and implications of a sexual relationship.

It is practically impossible to measure the maturity of ALL or even MOST children like that. Don't grasp at straws. The fact that the brain and body is still lagging far beyond is evidence enough. Exceptions do not make the rule.

[FollowTheGourd]

Let's just get back to who thinks the Mako didn't have enough rad flame decals on it, or whatever we were discussing here originally.

Modifié par FollowTheGourd, 19 janvier 2010 - 06:19 .

[ITSSEXYTIME]

Perhaps I'll try to revive the original topic with this:





How do people feel about the forced inclusion of heterosexual LI while homosexual LI are still "optional"? I think that any sort of relationship should only exist in the game if it makes sense for the character. Also has anyone else noticed that everyone in space is apparently single?

[OH-UP-THIS!]

ON TOPIC: thankfully only if female, FULLSTOP. all other opinions, speculations, whatever.......drop it.

[Eternal Dust]

ITSSEXYTIME wrote...
How do people feel about the forced inclusion of heterosexual LI while homosexual LI are still "optional"? I think that any sort of relationship should only exist in the game if it makes sense for the character. Also has anyone else noticed that everyone in space is apparently single?

Sometimes I think they'd be better off getting rid of all romances altogether.

[FollowTheGourd]

ITSSEXYTIME wrote...

Perhaps I'll try to revive the original topic with this:


How do people feel about the forced inclusion of heterosexual LI while homosexual LI are still "optional"? I think that any sort of relationship should only exist in the game if it makes sense for the character. Also has anyone else noticed that everyone in space is apparently single?

Who's to say they weren't so impressed by your character's spacefaring, collar-grabbing expertise that they all but forgot they were already seeing some one?

Plus with the inevitable airlock mishaps, it's only a matter of time until they're single again anyway.

Modifié par FollowTheGourd, 19 janvier 2010 - 06:32 .

[Deran2]

ITSSEXYTIME wrote...

Perhaps I'll try to revive the original topic with this:


How do people feel about the forced inclusion of heterosexual LI while homosexual LI are still "optional"? I think that any sort of relationship should only exist in the game if it makes sense for the character. Also has anyone else noticed that everyone in space is apparently single?

Honestly I'd rather not have to worry about romances at all. I want to learn about my party members without being forced to go down a romantic sub-plot to do so. Bioware has done a lot with romances in their games, but one area they're bad at is good ways of saying "no, sorry I'm not interested in you" or ways of simply talking to people that doesn't lead to romances and forcing you to be a dick and hurting people's feelings. There needs to be a clear way of talking to your party that doesn't trigger the romance sub-plot and doesn't force you to be mean to them to avoid that trigger.

[FollowTheGourd]

Deran2 wrote...
There needs to be a clear way of talking to your party that doesn't trigger the romance sub-plot and doesn't force you to be mean to them to avoid that trigger.

I thought they already had something like that in Dragon Age, where you could let a particular party member down easy and they take it well.

Modifié par FollowTheGourd, 19 janvier 2010 - 06:48 .

[GmanFresh]

well not really lesbian...asari...ehehe

[Deran2]

FollowTheGourd wrote...

Deran2 wrote...
There needs to be a clear way of talking to your party that doesn't trigger the romance sub-plot and doesn't force you to be mean to them to avoid that trigger.

I thought they already had something like that in Dragon Age, where you could let a particular party member down easy and they take it well.

To be honest I didn't get that far with any of the romanceable characters for my female mage. She doesn't like Alistair all that much, Zevern is simply a tool to be used, and Liliana left the party. I might explore if that is possible with a second character at some point.

[Zaxares]

ITSSEXYTIME wrote...
How do people feel about the forced inclusion of heterosexual LI while homosexual LI are still "optional"? I think that any sort of relationship should only exist in the game if it makes sense for the character. Also has anyone else noticed that everyone in space is apparently single?

I support the inclusion of both heterosexual and homosexual love interests, but all LI's should be entirely optional. Romance (or more accurately, the seeking, acceptance and/or rejection of it) can add a lot of dramatic tension and entertainment to a story.

I wouldn't say that everyone in space is single; just because people like Ambassador Udina or Emily Wong never mention anything about a spouse or partner doesn't mean they don't exist. That said... I think that most people with partners or families waiting for them back home would be a lot less willing to embark on military missions with a low chance of survival, which might explain why all of your squad mates are unattached.

Come to think of it... We really don't know anything about the courtship and mating behaviours and rituals of other species except the Asari and Salarians. (And from the way the Codex entry about the Salarians described it, love is an alien concept to a Salarian. Mating is something done purely to propagate the species, and it sounds like most male Salarians will never, EVER get to have sex.)

Modifié par Zaxares, 19 janvier 2010 - 07:17 .

[asaiasai]

Sorry for the wall of text but this issue is to complicated to settle in the favored standard 30 second sound bite.

First and foremost i challange any conservative to point me to any scientific fact to prove that homosexuality (male/male or female/female) is a choice made by the participants. The truth is no one knows what is the cause for people to be attracted to a member of thier own sex. What is attraction? What is the barometer people use to base thier attraction on? Is it some nebulous fictional evil entity? I think not the evil entity here is a closed mind and the ex used car/camel salesmen waving archaic tomes pontificating at great length concerning the "evils" of homosexuality. These slicksters preying on the ignorant are doing so for no other reason than there is power to be had.  (One must always be wary of those who claim "god has told me what to do", for most often this coincides with thier own desires) Susan B. Anthony. They are as irrelevant as the tomes they wave, but they can not be ignored, they are dangerous to all. Fanaticism's greatest danger is that it will never stop unless it is met with greater force that it possesses.

Logic is the first tool and the moderate should be swayed by that logic, and normally it would end there. The trouble is with that sway the fanatic looses power, rule number one concerning power is those that have it will never go quietly, even in the face of overwhelming logic, that is when tactics change. Faced with overwhelming logic, and the inevitable loss of thier own power the topic changes, hence pedophillia. This is an attempt to obsfucate the failure of thier argument by jumping to an extreme. I do not believe anyone here, and certainly myself, is advocating the relationships of an adult and a child. Nice try , major fail, now back on point.

The option for the player to romance any character in the game is is something i feel Bioware has dropped the ball on. I have said in several forums that i think the player should havean option to  build a lover or a fighter. The player should be able to by point assignment build a character that is able  to romance any character they want. Sure maybe life does not work that way but that argument is specious, mass effect drives and healing spells do not exist either but some folks are willing to accept one and disregard the other as uncomfortable. What this means is that the game can be anything WE the players tell the developers we want it to be. That WE can have any option we are willing to demand. Since the romances have no bearing on the plot, are just nothing more than a little bit of realism thrown in, i will even agree that they may be nothing more than a marketing ploy to sell more copies, generate extra publicity, etc.. but since Bioware has opened this can worms there is no closing it now.

Some misguided folks will argue that by allowing the player to have the option to romance any other NPC that Bioware is an advocate for one sexual orientation or another. Nothing is further from the truth, what this makes Bioware is a socially responsible company the recognizes the diversity of its audience, its customers, and strives to provide an immersive experience that makes no judgments right or wrong. Some would argue that there is a right or wrong and i say no, in this context there is no right, no wrong, and this being the case there is only player choice. The only true right (correct) here is player choice, how the player chooses to play thier character should be totally up to them. The player can choose to extort the weak and protect the strong or choose to protect the weak and extort the strong, this is how the game immerses the player into the realm. Allowing the player to choose thier romance partner is another immersion tool and will further tailor the gaming experience to the player. Using DAO as an example the player can not romance certain NPCs depending on player character sex, this is an oversite which as i am fully aware can not be changed at this point as both DAO and ME2 are in the "box".

Being as this is the case you could say, what is the point of the debate? I say the debate is not for these 2 great games, but for the future of the titles, ME3 and DAO(2). This debate is necessary as a fan of these games, i have a desire to make sure that the immersive quality of these games is not watered down at the behest of narrow minded people.  What i propose is a true test of wills, in the future maybe Bioware can have a poll where ONLY people who have purchased either DAO or ME2 can vote. To keep the ballot box from being stuffed the voting is tied to the registration of the game and the CD key with an official site to tally the votes. I would be very interested in the results of the vote concerning this topic. What is of paramount importance is that ONLY people who have purchased the games(s) should have a vote.  As a registered owner of the game i toss in my ante, as a player of the game i call. Let the community decide the romance options the game will allow, let the community decide what is important, we have had the debate, now lets have the vote, choice or no choice. The two options could be ; "choice" will open the game up to allow any romance option "no choice" will keep the game as it is now. 

Asai

Modifié par asaiasai, 19 janvier 2010 - 08:33 .

[MMonkeyking]

Guys ... try not to get too off topic

OP just asked a simple question

[Schneidend]

Deran2 wrote...
Honestly I'd rather not have to worry about romances at all. I want to learn about my party members without being forced to go down a romantic sub-plot to do so. Bioware has done a lot with romances in their games, but one area they're bad at is good ways of saying "no, sorry I'm not interested in you" or ways of simply talking to people that doesn't lead to romances and forcing you to be a dick and hurting people's feelings. There needs to be a clear way of talking to your party that doesn't trigger the romance sub-plot and doesn't force you to be mean to them to avoid that trigger.

In Dragon Age I'm pretty sure Zevran is the only one who'll hit on you without warning. With the other characters you need to actively pursue their interest.

I remember Zevran coming on to my avatar character in Haven. And, being from relatively conservative Ferelden society, he had no idea how to even begin to react. I'm glad Bioware included dialogue options with that tone.

Modifié par Schneidend, 19 janvier 2010 - 09:27 .

[Mordaedil]

Jesus Christ, this is still going on for 10 pages.



ITSSEXYTIME, in this case it is hate-speech, because Darth_Trethon isn't a newcomer to these parts and has been stating this opinion of his very inflammatory on the old and new forums for over 4 years now.



He's a ****ing troll dressed in a tutu and it's better to not give him the light of day for the **** he says.

[Schneidend]

Darth_Trethon wrote...

IF shepard is female then yes. There are NO same gender romances in ME2. This is the single best improvement made on the game from ME1 to ME2. Here's hoping that we never see another same gender romance in any videogame ever again. Maybe then we can finally all focus on fully outlawing same-gender relationships in all forms of entertainment and in the real world.

Let's outlaw soda, too. Banning things arbitrarily is awesome! Woo!

[Championette]

I cannot believe 14 pages were spent discussing whether someone like me has a right to have a relationship and be happy. Am I sick? Do I like little kids? Is it different liking little kids to liking adults? Do I procreate? When I do procreate do I create even more twisted beings? Do I create sickness in the world?

For some people the next bit won't matter and they won't care. But some others might hear this: when you talk about these things in a public space please remember that you are talking about real people's lives.

Modifié par Championette, 19 janvier 2010 - 09:53 .