184 réponses à ce sujet

[Nightwriter]

Forget the word "art" and start thinking about the word "artful." Where do you most often hear it applied? To things which were created or executed with skill and grace.

I cannot say the ending of Mass Effect was executed with skill or grace. So if "art" means literally any work which was made for a creative purpose, then the ending was art, but it was not artful.

That statement makes me feel like we're getting a bit too definitionally complicated, so while I do believe videogames can count as art -- Planescape Torment is often called such, and for good reason, it appears -- I just settle for the simpler conclusion that Mass Effect's ending was not art because I acknowledge that I associate art with a degree of craftsmanship.

And regardles, anytime you hear the word "art" used in defense of something that is outrageously poor to you, the first instinct is usually to react with derision. So even if I do agree that videogames are a valid art medium, I'm not going to want to call ME3's conclusion "art" because I've been soured to the term as it's used in this context.

[spirosz]

^

[AlanC9]

Nightwriter raises a good question. What's the point here? Why do we care if ME3 is art or not?

[dreamgazer]

In truth, I really don't care about ME3's ending specifically in this discussion.

Usually these debates are more about the topic in general anyway, simply because "artistic integrity" was used in BioWare's statement instead of, say, creative integrity.

Modifié par dreamgazer, 07 septembre 2013 - 05:15 .

[Jorji Costava]

As a few others alluded to above, it's probably best not to conflate the "good art/bad art distinction" with the "art/non-art distinction." The "artistic integrity" defense appeals only to the latter sense of the term; by appealing to the concept of artistic integrity, the author is asserting that one has the right to make a creative work in the way in the way he or she deems fit, and has no obligations, legal or otherwise, to make things the way fans would prefer. That doesn't entail a right to have one's work be considered good or valuable, of course.

It's also worth noting that authors are hardly the only ones who ever make use of the concept of artistic integrity. Any time we criticize artists (especially musicians) for "selling out," for instance, we're criticizing them on the grounds that they're trying to appeal to the largest consumer base possible rather than making the work they truly want to make; in other words, we're saying that they're engaging in crass commercialism.

[Nightwriter]

AlanC9 wrote...

Nightwriter raises a good question. What's the point here? Why do we care if ME3 is art or not?

It's bound up in the debate about whether or not the endings were of quality.

It's also bound up in broader issues like "what is art?" or "do videogames count as art?"

/guessing

[Iakus]

Nightwriter wrote...

AlanC9 wrote...

Nightwriter raises a good question. What's the point here? Why do we care if ME3 is art or not?

It's bound up in the debate about whether or not the endings were of quality.

It's also bound up in broader issues like "what is art?" or "do videogames count as art?"

/guessing

Probably.

Calling the endings "art" implies a quality they don't deserve.

[Mycrus Ironfist]

never been back to the forumz since ME3 ending... nice to see that threads like these are still alive and well

[Burning Camels]

Other than simply paintings and drawings and the like, art, when it comes to video games, is an opinion. To me, the Mass Effect series was an art that I could immerse myself in completely, which is what made it so enjoyable.

There are people who focus more on other things and such about the series, maybe poking at the loopholes and the flaws, complaining about the endings, that kind of thing, and maybe they don't consider it art even though they like it.

Considering a video game or activity an art is an opinion. I happen to consider the series a wonderful piece of art.