As a possibility like in DAO, sure
As a certainty or virtual certainty like in ME3? No way. This is supposed to be entertainment.
Fatal Ending - will you accept it?
Débuté par
Poliss
, sept. 02 2013 12:06
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#52
Posté 02 septembre 2013 - 02:08
Ieldra
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No. What I ask for is that no ending is perfect, unmarred not just by any tangible downside, but also by any kind of uncertainty about your decisions and their outcome. You could have a happy ending in DAO, but not a perfect one. There was the dark ritual and its outcome. With the dwarves there was the choice between a revolutionary tyrant and an upright but weak traditionalist. That's the kind of setup I like.crimzontearz wrote...
and yet people will ask just for that. To have a happy ending removed altogether throwing in accusations of it being childish and Disney and blah blah blah
#53
Posté 02 septembre 2013 - 02:11
cactusberry
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This. I want an ending to be happy about. There are less and less of those in the gaming world.iakus wrote...
As a possibility like in DAO, sure
As a certainty or virtual certainty like in ME3? No way. This is supposed to be entertainment.
#54
Posté 02 septembre 2013 - 02:16
fchopin
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I would not mind one of the endings to be like that but how would another game continue with an ending like that?
#55
Posté 02 septembre 2013 - 02:21
Ap0crypha
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If it's like ME2's suicide mission--take the long, hard road or watch people die--then yeah, I'd be cool with that.
If it's another RBG-choice ending, where none of your decisions matter, then no. But I don't think Bioware will make that same mistake again.
If it's another RBG-choice ending, where none of your decisions matter, then no. But I don't think Bioware will make that same mistake again.
#56
Posté 02 septembre 2013 - 02:28
crimzontearz
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you are not who I was referring to and your desire for the ending are not unpalatable for me. I thoroughly enjoyed DAO's ending and as long as my inquisitor + LI are fine after the ending I am golden with other conditions possibly marring this (loss of another NPC, god baby, race obliterated and so on). Also as a person who disliked Alistair after 2 playthroughs and would very well see the sacrifice of Loghain as a fitting end for him I can say that that type of ending was pretty much without downsides.Ieldra2 wrote...
No. What I ask for is that no ending is perfect, unmarred not just by any tangible downside, but also by any kind of uncertainty about your decisions and their outcome. You could have a happy ending in DAO, but not a perfect one. There was the dark ritual and its outcome. With the dwarves there was the choice between a revolutionary tyrant and an upright but weak traditionalist. That's the kind of setup I like.crimzontearz wrote...
and yet people will ask just for that. To have a happy ending removed altogether throwing in accusations of it being childish and Disney and blah blah blah
Also, I was referring to people arguing with me pre release of ME3 that there should not be a Shepard lives ending because it would (and I quote) render the other ending meaningless.
#57
Posté 02 septembre 2013 - 02:38
Dubozz
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If it's like me2 or dao im ok with that. if its like me3....well... another age of "controversy" and speculations (i.e. **** this).
#58
Posté 02 septembre 2013 - 02:40
Little Princess Peach
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I'm so sick and tired of biowares bittersweet endings give me somthing where at the end of the game I can say wow I did that and be proud of it
#59
Posté 02 septembre 2013 - 02:41
MKDAWUSS
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As long as I don't get a retcon resurrection in post-game DLC.
#60
Posté 02 septembre 2013 - 02:45
Maria Caliban
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It depends on how well they do it.
#61
Posté 02 septembre 2013 - 02:49
Ryzaki
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DAO like yes please.
ME3 and it's RGB no.
ME3 and it's RGB no.
#62
Posté 02 septembre 2013 - 02:54
Maria Caliban
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BioShock: Infinite did this well.
#63
Posté 02 septembre 2013 - 02:57
Andraste_Reborn
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Meh. It seems like BioWare have already explored this kind of scenario - I haven't actually played the Mass Effect games yet (shooters are not my thing, although I do plan to get to them eventually) but I gather that many people took issue with it there.
In this franchise, we've had one game that can end with the PC (or their best friend/lover if your character is close to Alistair) sacrificing themselves and another where Thedas is ripped apart by war no matter what Hawke does. I think both of those were good endings that got the balance about right.
I would welcome the option for the game to have a sad ending where there protagonist and/or a bunch of their friends and companions die. The franchise being what it is, I am not expecting any ending that is entirely made of sunshine and puppies, and I wouldn't want one. Any Dragon Age story should have its bitter-sweet elements, and victory shouldn't be without a cost - but nor should it inevitably end with 'rocks fall, everyone dies'. (Neverwinter Nights 2, I am looking at you.)
In this franchise, we've had one game that can end with the PC (or their best friend/lover if your character is close to Alistair) sacrificing themselves and another where Thedas is ripped apart by war no matter what Hawke does. I think both of those were good endings that got the balance about right.
I would welcome the option for the game to have a sad ending where there protagonist and/or a bunch of their friends and companions die. The franchise being what it is, I am not expecting any ending that is entirely made of sunshine and puppies, and I wouldn't want one. Any Dragon Age story should have its bitter-sweet elements, and victory shouldn't be without a cost - but nor should it inevitably end with 'rocks fall, everyone dies'. (Neverwinter Nights 2, I am looking at you.)
Modifié par Andrastee, 02 septembre 2013 - 02:58 .
#64
Posté 02 septembre 2013 - 03:19
Nefla
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I would hate another forced tragic ending. I am occasionally in the mood for tragedy in a game, so it would be nice to have it as one possible outcome but I work in customer service, I get enough soul killing angst on a daily basis. I don't need my escapist video game hobby to shove more depression down my throat.
#65
Posté 02 septembre 2013 - 03:48
jstme
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If it is written well,is not contrived,is fitting the themes of the game and the sacrifice is shown to be a worthy one with consequences - then optional death of main protagonist is perfectly fine. Optional death of squadmates and LI too.
If it is all forced and contrived and exists for sake of speculations from everyone and is followed only by vague metaphysical symbolic crap - then NO.
If it is all forced and contrived and exists for sake of speculations from everyone and is followed only by vague metaphysical symbolic crap - then NO.
#66
Posté 02 septembre 2013 - 05:01
Ozida
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As long as there are other options for different endings, including a happy-ending. This good old “it’s a war so everyone has to die” doesn’t work for me since ME3.
#67
Posté 02 septembre 2013 - 05:11
mupp3tz
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As others said, DAO or ME2 is a-okay. If it makes the Inquisitor look very stupid or foolish at the end, then no. It could also work well for the DA franchise since we don't have the same protagonist in every game.. so there is more room for them to work with.
#68
Posté 02 septembre 2013 - 05:13
Huge_Beaver
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There should be one, as long as there is a "happy" ending.
#69
Posté 02 septembre 2013 - 05:16
DarkKnightHolmes
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If the ending is more like DAO/ME2, I'll gladly have a fatal ending. If it's like ME3, then I'm running away.
#70
Posté 02 septembre 2013 - 05:23
RogueWriter3201
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Much like with Orgins, I feel the choice should be there. However, as we've seen with Mass Effect 3, many gamers should have the choice, if their willing to work for it and take the right course for it, have that Heroic ending in the truest sense of the word, especially if previous games in the series have allowed it, and not have it stripped away.
No matter how dark the narrative might become I don't play fantasy games to be immersed in "real world" realities; namely that I could die at any moment. I want to feel like I can achieve the impossible. So, yes, give me the nearest thing to the super-mega-happy ending but also give other types of gamers more robust and somber choices if they want it.
While some games have stood out for their dark narrative and depressing endings, BioWare's games have never been that, nor should they if you do not wish them to be. Simply telling the player, "Nope. You're gonna die or, if you want to live, you have to **** over a group of other people..." does not, in my opinion, equate good story/heroic storytelling.
No matter how dark the narrative might become I don't play fantasy games to be immersed in "real world" realities; namely that I could die at any moment. I want to feel like I can achieve the impossible. So, yes, give me the nearest thing to the super-mega-happy ending but also give other types of gamers more robust and somber choices if they want it.
While some games have stood out for their dark narrative and depressing endings, BioWare's games have never been that, nor should they if you do not wish them to be. Simply telling the player, "Nope. You're gonna die or, if you want to live, you have to **** over a group of other people..." does not, in my opinion, equate good story/heroic storytelling.
#71
Posté 02 septembre 2013 - 05:28
WildOrchid
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It all depends on the writing, really. If the ME3 endings were well written, I may have liked them.
But they felt so empty, so rushed..
To devs: don't rush the game, just enjoy making it. Besides, you have a whole year ahead.
But they felt so empty, so rushed..
To devs: don't rush the game, just enjoy making it. Besides, you have a whole year ahead.
#72
Posté 02 septembre 2013 - 05:56
Sir George Parr
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If it was like Origins and this was to be a potential outcome of the story, to sit alongside other equally valid outcomes, than thats not a problem, but if it was to be the only show in town then its a problem. As you could feel railroaded to a destination that you may not want to go. Any choices made in that game will be ultimately pointless as the outcome is the same regardless of what you do .
But the worst thing that could happen is to finish the story of a one off PC with a cliffhanger and tease a to be continued and then do nothing. That would be a bigger tragedy than any Fatal ending
But the worst thing that could happen is to finish the story of a one off PC with a cliffhanger and tease a to be continued and then do nothing. That would be a bigger tragedy than any Fatal ending
#73
Posté 02 septembre 2013 - 05:59
CheshireCat1701
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It depends on how it is done. I don't like forced grimdark because it's supposedly more "artistic." In fact, those types of endings have become nearly as clichéd as the traditional happy ending. I do think the happy ending should be hard won, but it should definitely be there as an option.
#74
Posté 02 septembre 2013 - 06:03
LTD
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Surely.
Bioware has multiple times spoken about how Dragon Age is always much about the world having and telling it's own story, rather than entire franchise getting stuck with one protagonist growing into some ridiculously colossal measurements over few games.
Much of this philosophy is already present in DA:O. World and the setting are both rich and lovingly build. Game goes to some lenghts in ensuring player realizes there is much and more in world taking place besides his pesky questing.
In such setting, Player Char dying for some more or less noble cause
sounds perfectly valid and proper. It is my favorite ending in DA:O. I'm very eager to do some more dying in DA:I. Assuming game isn't utter
**** ofc.
/ramdom on-topic inspired though
I wished DA franchise would always repeat the same exact timeline and tell story of Thedas as it were during Plague from some 6-7 vastly different POVs.
Bioware has multiple times spoken about how Dragon Age is always much about the world having and telling it's own story, rather than entire franchise getting stuck with one protagonist growing into some ridiculously colossal measurements over few games.
Much of this philosophy is already present in DA:O. World and the setting are both rich and lovingly build. Game goes to some lenghts in ensuring player realizes there is much and more in world taking place besides his pesky questing.
In such setting, Player Char dying for some more or less noble cause
sounds perfectly valid and proper. It is my favorite ending in DA:O. I'm very eager to do some more dying in DA:I. Assuming game isn't utter
**** ofc.
/ramdom on-topic inspired though
I wished DA franchise would always repeat the same exact timeline and tell story of Thedas as it were during Plague from some 6-7 vastly different POVs.
Modifié par LTD, 02 septembre 2013 - 06:14 .
#75
Posté 02 septembre 2013 - 06:10
Starscream723
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DA:O did it really well, because it was an option equally valid to all the others. My first playthrough, spoiler-free, I actually chose this option even though Alistair was right there and willing. Heroic sacrifice seemed the thing to do, a good culmination for my character's story. However, there were equally good alternatives for different characters with different motivations.
ME2 did it less well, because it was more a case of ranking the endings from "Everyone survives if you do X" through "Some people die if you partially do X" down to "Everybody dies if you don't do Y". The "death" ending is basically the normal ending, with added fail.
ME3 did it terribly, because you died regardless which can make players feel earlier choices are redundant. Also, although you died heroically - they were stupid methods. DA:O set out earlier that killing the Archdemon would kill a Warden. In ME3, Shepard potentially died from making something explode at point blank range when he could have shot it from across the room. It didn't help that the choices were presented at the last moment by an infuriating sudden plot development, and that (pre-EC) all other choices regarding the galaxy appeared irrelevant because you completely destroyed everybody's way of life.
So yes, I would accept a "player dies" ending, provided it was either one of many outcomes, OR a known certainty from early on - with the game spent making important lasting changes and decisions that will have an effect even after your death.
ME2 did it less well, because it was more a case of ranking the endings from "Everyone survives if you do X" through "Some people die if you partially do X" down to "Everybody dies if you don't do Y". The "death" ending is basically the normal ending, with added fail.
ME3 did it terribly, because you died regardless which can make players feel earlier choices are redundant. Also, although you died heroically - they were stupid methods. DA:O set out earlier that killing the Archdemon would kill a Warden. In ME3, Shepard potentially died from making something explode at point blank range when he could have shot it from across the room. It didn't help that the choices were presented at the last moment by an infuriating sudden plot development, and that (pre-EC) all other choices regarding the galaxy appeared irrelevant because you completely destroyed everybody's way of life.
So yes, I would accept a "player dies" ending, provided it was either one of many outcomes, OR a known certainty from early on - with the game spent making important lasting changes and decisions that will have an effect even after your death.
