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[Secretlyapotato]

When they say it's much harder to conceive it's not like, a 1-10% chance or something is it? Especially regarding female wardens. I know two Grey Wardens can't have kids, and male wardens (even dwarves) can have a non-god baby with Morrigan, but.......

Just confused about how unrealistic my headcannon elf babies with Zevran are. :3 Especially since she's gone more than 2 years with the taint.

Modifié par Secretlyapotato, 02 septembre 2013 - 05:55 .

[Jeffonl1]

Fiona was a Grey Warden (elven mage from Orlais) but had a child with King Maric Theirin (possibly Alistair). It's very unlikely that any Warden will reproduce, and if two Wardens have a child together, it's a near miracle.

Morrigan claimed the grey warden's child would inherit the taint...

So it looks like even if there was child there is only a chance the child would tainted.  But if Alistair was Fiona's child then he is proof either that 1) Morrigan lied (surprise!) 2) there is only a chance a child gets the taint 3) this was a special child 4) it was just the Grey Wardens Child that would inherit the taint 5) he was doomed anyway so joining the order was nice (and the joining unnecessary)

As for the taint itself, it looks insanity is evitable for most (The Calling) and probably a physical transformation into a 'Ghoul'.   But it seems there are exceptions.  Like Fiona, who left the order... and said:
she "might be the first warden who does not have to go on the Calling".

Modifié par Jeffonl1, 02 septembre 2013 - 06:39 .

[sylvanaerie]

A warden can have a child with a non-tainted person. So Zevran+Warden is possible, just harder. If you want to headcanon that your warden has a baby with him, it's within the bounds of possibility. Since it's in your mind anyway, and doesn't really affect the game, it really doesn't matter too terribly much. Fiona certainly ended up preggers. The PTB at Bioware said 2 wardens can't by NORMAL means. I take this to mean unnatural means (like Avernus' research) might make it possible. Though I would debate the merits of 2 active wardens having children. Not so much because of the issue of the child being tainted, but because the darkspawn seek out wardens and wardens are drawn to seek out the darkspawn.

From what I understand even if a warden does have a child, the taint doesn't pass the placenta (as it is designed to be a barrier to infections, viruses, poisons etc). Though it's not fool proof, of course. So any child born to a warden has a chance to be taint-free. Morrigan's ritual is designed to use the taint in the child to pull the Archdemon soul into it, so she's bypassing the usual protections. But she will also tell you she wasn't making another darkspawn or archdemon but a child who will have the soul of an Old God and would be free of corruption. Of course, she could be lying, but I don't think so. I doubt she'd be going through all this just to unleash another Blight on Thedas. Stranger things have happened though.

So, yea, harder than with two non-tainted but not impossible to have children, though I should think it would be a rare enough thing that the warden isn't having more than one pregnancy. And no telling how the taint in her will affect (the pregnancy and it's progression). And there is the issue that she probably won't live to see it to adulthood.

[caradoc2000]

It is the genophage of DA universe.

[WraithTDK]

Just to clarify:

1. In the history of the Wardens, there has been ONE offspring - Allistair. Until him, it was thought to be impossible.

2. Fiona was unique. For reasons so far unexplained, she was found to be HEALED of the taint. Odds are, this is why she was able to conceive - it is the taint that prevents wardens from doing so.

In short, the odds of a warden producing a child are about on par with a man with a vasectomy, wearing a newly minted trojan, producing a child with a woman on birth control who has had tubal ligation (had her tubes tied).

[Secretlyapotato]

WraithTDK wrote...

In short, the odds of a warden producing a child are about on par with a man with a vasectomy, wearing a newly minted trojan, producing a child with a woman on birth control who has had tubal ligation (had her tubes tied).

That's closer to impossible than "harder to conceive", which hasn't been what the writers have suggested in the case of a warden and non-warden pairing.

[WraithTDK]

The way I remember it was that it was thought to be impossible for for them to conceive, regardless of whom they were paired with, until Fiona did so; and as I said, Fiona was somehow cured of the taint, making her entirely unique.

Modifié par WraithTDK, 03 septembre 2013 - 08:21 .

[wiccame]

Jeffonl1 wrote...

Fiona was a Grey Warden (elven mage from Orlais) but had a child with King Maric Theirin (possibly Alistair). It's very unlikely that any Warden will reproduce, and if two Wardens have a child together, it's a near miracle.

Morrigan claimed the grey warden's child would inherit the taint...

So it looks like even if there was child there is only a chance the child would tainted.  But if Alistair was Fiona's child then he is proof either that 1) Morrigan lied (surprise!) 2) there is only a chance a child gets the taint 3) this was a special child 4) it was just the Grey Wardens Child that would inherit the taint 5) he was doomed anyway so joining the order was nice (and the joining unnecessary)

As for the taint itself, it looks insanity is evitable for most (The Calling) and probably a physical transformation into a 'Ghoul'.   But it seems there are exceptions.  Like Fiona, who left the order... and said:
she "might be the first warden who does not have to go on the Calling".

I took that to mean that it was the ritual that would ensure the child would have the taint, not that it was an absolute naturally.

[Angrywolves]

I doubt the child inherits the taint.
It would die too quickly .
I asume Flemeth wouldn't want that.

[DeathScepter]

Believe it or not, I do remember that Nathaniel Howe's direct anestor was a Grey Warden. And Rendon Howe hated him for that.

[Riverdaleswhiteflash]

I was under the impression this was after, not before, Rendon was born.

[sylvanaerie]

It was. According to Nathaniel, his grandfather went to join the grey wardens. I'm assuming he went to Orlais since this would have been before Maric's time, and they never heard from him again. Rendon assumed he abandoned the family, but Nathaniel observes that, knowing what happens during the joining (with Mhairi, Daveth etc) that he in all likelihood died.

In my opinion, even if you die trying to become a Grey Warden, you should still be considered a GW. It's just the taint got you immediately instead of taking 20-30 years.

[Yorenec]

Yes it's pretty bad.

According to Gaider(the post is somewhere buried on these forums), Wardens can have children with non-Wardens, albeit a pretty low chance.

Two Wardens having children through natural means is impossible, again this comes directly from Gaider, but through unnatural means is a different story. In the Dragon Age universe, there is ALWAYS a way to skirt around the rules. Personally I like to headcanon the gift that Morrigan left at the end of Witch Hunt was a way for Alistair and Queen Cousland to get around this particular rule.

Modifié par Yorenec, 09 septembre 2013 - 02:55 .

[DeathScepter]

Riverdaleswhiteflash wrote...

I was under the impression this was after, not before, Rendon was born.

it is an unknown. What I have heard that the 30 year rule for Grey Wardens is flexible in how healthy the Grey Warden keeps him or herself. The Blood Mage Warden use an unnatural method of keeping himself alive. So there are methods of staying alive for a longer time than 30 years. As for other possible Methods, I have NO clue. It is possible Yes; Impossible no.

[LobselVith8]

Jeffonl1 wrote...

Fiona was a Grey Warden (elven mage from Orlais) but had a child with King Maric Theirin (possibly Alistair). It's very unlikely that any Warden will reproduce, and if two Wardens have a child together, it's a near miracle.

Fiona isn't alone in that regard; Morrigan can get pregnant by The Warden, even without the Dark Ritual being enacted.

Jeffonl1 wrote...

Morrigan claimed the grey warden's child would inherit the taint...

So it looks like even if there was child there is only a chance the child would tainted.  But if Alistair was Fiona's child then he is proof either that 1) Morrigan lied (surprise!) 2) there is only a chance a child gets the taint 3) this was a special child 4) it was just the Grey Wardens Child that would inherit the taint 5) he was doomed anyway so joining the order was nice (and the joining unnecessary)

I believe Gaider addressed that it was simply at that stage of Morrigan being pregnant that the unborn child would have the taint, not that the taint would be with the child irrevocably.

Jeffonl1 wrote...

As for the taint itself, it looks insanity is evitable for most (The Calling) and probably a physical transformation into a 'Ghoul'.   But it seems there are exceptions.  Like Fiona, who left the order... and said:
she "might be the first warden who does not have to go on the Calling". 

I suppose a mage Warden could delay the corruption of the taint with blood magic, as Avernus did for centuries, since the taint seems to make one immortal (like the darkspawn seem to be).

[Angrywolves]

I doubt the child would have the taint.
It wouldn't live very long if it did and would be useless for any OGB schemes Flemeth or Morrigan.
More than likely Flemeth cast a spell on Morrigan or gave her what amounts to a fertility drug.
I can't see Flemeth relying on a chance pregnancy.