301 réponses à ce sujet

[Blackrising]

DA2 had its flaws, but it's still so much better than any other modern RPGs I've played. (The fact that it doesn't punish me by excluding me from options for playing a queer female bumped it up to first place on my favourite games list.)
ME3...was problematic. The ending was not just frustrating, but downright depressing. I couldn't finish my Shepard's story in a way that was any kind of satisfying and now whenever I think of my Shepard, I get teary-eyed and sad in the worst way possible. I haven't picked up any of the ME games since then, even though I really love the first two games.

Does that mean Bioware has lost any of my trust?
Hell no.
I'm still gonna buy every game they make because they're good at what they do. No one does RPG quite like Bioware.

[Pauravi]

I don't know why people are having a problem with ME3; I thought it was brilliant. Is it just butthurt over the ending? I mean, I didn't like the ending either, but the entire rest of the game itself was fantastic and full of all the wonderful, endearing, badass, and emotional moments with the crew that drew me into the Mass Effect world.  I also thought that the weapons/armor and customization was by far the best of all 3 games. My biggest problem with it is that they failed to tie up the stories of all the crew members that I cared so much about (oh yeah, and not showing Tali without her helmet -- as in, with polygons). But the fact that I DID care about them so much says a lot about ME3 and about the series in general.

As for DA2, the fact that people are ready to "quit" BioWare over it is laughable to me. It had shortcomings for sure, and it wasn't great when measured against the yardstick of other BioWare games. But compared to 90% of other games that are released, it was still very good.

In fact, when I look at DA2, I see a game that BioWare was able to rescue from EA's demanding time constraints precisely because of its strengths as a studio. That game absolutely lived on the story and especially it's characters since they had no time to develop almost anything else but the barest of settings.


Anyway, to answer the question: No.  I'm still very much on board with BioWare, and DA:I and The Witcher 3 are my two absolute most anticipated games for next year.  I almost literally can't wait.

Modifié par Pauravi, 04 septembre 2013 - 10:06 .

[BENIIICHAT]

No, as long as they give me a M/M romance on their game

In fact, If I think DAI is good enough, I will buy it on Day1 (More difficult to me for Preprder) And I think their previous like Jade Empire / Star Wars KOTOR1-2 / Mass Effect (especially 3 b/c I can get m/m romance) / Dragona Age series. Is all good game for me. And sure all game have some issue that make me annoy (especially DA2) But all of them still worth to pay.


Just don't force me to connect Internet many/all  time to play your game. Then you will fine by me.

Modifié par BENIIICHAT, 04 septembre 2013 - 09:18 .

[The Elder King]

Morocco Mole wrote...

I'm still surprised people will defend DA2

People have different opinions and tastes. If you read articles in gaming sites about different games, you'll see that every game has is fans and his critics.

[Pauravi]

Morocco Mole wrote...

I'm still surprised people will defend DA2

I'm still surprised people have such a vehemently negative reaction to it.
I think in part it must be all the negative nancies reinforcing each other into a frothy fury for the past 2.5 years.  Calling it out as garbage has become basically a clichè way to criticize BioWare. Aside from the re-used locations (and small scope of the setting in general), I find most of the complaints about it wholly unconcerning.

Modifié par Pauravi, 04 septembre 2013 - 09:22 .

[Blackrising]

Pauravi wrote...

Morocco Mole wrote...

I'm still surprised people will defend DA2

I'm still surprised people have such a vehemently negative reaction to it.
I think in part it must be all the negative nancies reinforcing each other into a frothy fury for the past 2.5 years.  Calling it out as garbage has become basically a clichè way to criticize BioWare. Aside from the re-used locations (and small scope of the setting in general), I find most of the complaints about it wholly unconcerning.

Don't mind Morocco. Being negative is just his thing.

[Biotic Sage]

Pauravi wrote...

Morocco Mole wrote...

I'm still surprised people will defend DA2

I'm still surprised people have such a vehemently negative reaction to it.
I think in part it must be all the negative nancies reinforcing each other into a frothy fury for the past 2.5 years.  Calling it out as garbage has become basically a clichè way to criticize BioWare. Aside from the re-used locations (and small scope of the setting in general), I find most of the complaints about it wholly unconcerning.

It seems to me that the hate that snowballed out of control over ME3 and DA2 will melt down quite a bit when another game in each of the series releases.  Then people can look at things in perspective, instead of viewing ME3 or DA2 as the "ALL OR NOTHING!" final destination of the series.  People are already starting to have this shift when it comes to DA2, because now they can better appreciate a more spacially confined story since there is the promise of DA:I being a free roaming romp through all of Thedas.  They take it for what it is instead of what they wanted or expected it to be.

Mind you, the criticisms about recycled environments and lack of customization are still just as valid.  But those 0/10's on Metacritic start to look more and more petty, unfair, and trollish.

Modifié par Biotic Sage, 04 septembre 2013 - 09:27 .

[Qyla]

Nope . I'm looking forward to the new IP too. And anyways any bioware game are the better rpgs game I ever played, because you REALLY roleplay.

[Biotic Sage]

Morocco Mole wrote... 

But the biggest offense is that the game is just. not. fun. to play. Even ME3, a game that has flaws of its own, at least managed to have decent gameplay. Unlike DA2 where I think half of the game length is walking back and forth via copy/paste area and fighting mobs of easy enemies that constantly spawn from thin-air as I walk from one quest to another.

The game wholly deserves its reputation as a godawful game and is right up there with Sonic Chronicles as the worst thing Bioware has ever done.

If the biggest offense is a subjective complaint, then I can easily argue the other side as well.  I agree with the specifics you mentioned being some not-very-fun aspects of the game (copy/paste areas, mobs spawning from thin-air).  However, I can turn around and mention plenty of things I found rewarding and fun. 
The skill trees were much better than Origins. 
The combat was a little too fast for my taste, but much more fluid and enjoyable
The tactics options were improved
The potions paradigm was greatly improved
I very much enjoyed Aveline, Isabela, Merill, and especially Varric as companions.
Voice acting overall was very good
The time jumps didn't live up to their potential, but it was still interesting to see the city and people develop over the years

[Pauravi]

Morocco Mole wrote...

The game wholly deserves its reputation as a godawful game and is right up there with Sonic Chronicles as the worst thing Bioware has ever done.

Well, that's your opinion, anyway.

I liked a lot of the party (except Fenris who didn't stand out to me), and even the ones I hated (mostly just Anders) I still appreciated both for the interesting-but-tragic arc his story took since Awakenings, and because he actually made me angry.  Love and hate are both indications of good writing.

I also think the entertwining storylines worked.  Although they could have been more developed with more time (as most things in DA2 could have), I think they fit together well and I think your "lolstupid" characterization of the plot is more of a strawman than anything that actually existed in the game.

As for gameplay, I thought that DA2 had better gameplay than DAO.  Say what you want about it, but all the significant tactical elements that were important to me were there, like being able to pause and queue actions.  The only difference is that it moved more quickly and was more responsive -- a welcome change from the slow-as-molasses mess of DAO whose lethargy was just as unrealistic as DA2's speed.

[dracuella]

Biotic Sage wrote...

Allan Schumacher wrote...

Just as an aside on a purely personal level, I enjoyed reading this thread to see that there's still a group of people that, even if they weren't satisfied with DA2 or ME3 or whatever, still took the time to share that you enjoy our games and that we strike a chord with you in unique ways.

In general I think the tone of the BSN has improved a bit since DAI was first officially announced and at other beats like the E3 teaser reveal. I guess I'm still somewhat touched by going to PAX because it was just straight up gorram exciting to see all the enthusiasm at the big panel and at the BioWare base in general. So Thanks!

I'm sure it can get depressing for you guys, but consider that a lot of us left the forums and most media concerned with Bioware for a long time just because of how toxic things had become.  But we were still out there enjoying your games!  I was replaying KOTOR and am currently replaying DA2.

It became rather tedious to try to "discuss" with a certain group of people (the hater bandwagon) yelling really loudly about the same things over and over again.

I would like to add that wherever I've met the DA2 hate spree, I've tried asking people why they used the words they did (hate, worst game ever, crap etc. etc. - you get the picture) in order to see past the raging and find out what they thought was so horrible about the game. Of course there were those that could not be reasoned with but once you got down below the angry surfaces, most I've spoken with did truly like the game despite their outbursts. Some were displeased with the new fight system, some with Kirkwall's layout. Many disliked the map reuse and the new fight animations while others found that the many 'fetch-my-towel' quests (not my words) diluted the feeling of immersion.

In my experience, it all boiled down to this: they were disappointed that IT WASN'T PERFECT. They'd previously been given games which they loved immensely and with this in mind had set the bar for DA2 very high. So when it fell short to what they expected, they reacted. Poorly.

Please note that this does NOT in any way justify the angry lashings out or the personal attacks; those are inexcusable and should be condemned the minute they appear. More than once, I've felt indignant and outraged that they could even think of saying what they did.

So yeah, when it seems all you hear is criticism, I hope you remember that the ones who yell the loudest, dont necessarily speak for the most of us. We're just too polite and well-mannered to yell back

[DaringMoosejaw]

Morocco Mole wrote...

Not really. I just think DA2 is a very, very bad game that needed several more months of dev time so it wasn't a blatantly obvious alpha that EA tried to sell for sixty dollars. Even ignoring the lazy cut and paste job involving the environments. It still had a badly written plot that tried to cram three different plots into it (qunari, Hawke's family, mage/templar) none of which got much development and the latter was such a contrived mess of strawmen arguments and lolevil figures that I'm surprised so many people take it seriously.

Most of the party is not likeable, and half of them fall into every cliche bioware romance type you can imagine.

But the biggest offense is that the game is just. not. fun. to play. Even ME3, a game that has flaws of its own, at least managed to have decent gameplay. Unlike DA2 where I think half of the game length is walking back and forth via copy/paste area and fighting mobs of easy enemies that constantly spawn from thin-air as I walk from one quest to another.

It also looks like a budget PS2 title.

The game wholly deserves its reputation as a godawful game and is right up there with Sonic Chronicles as the worst thing Bioware has ever done.

I think you're greatly exaggerating what a 'very, very bad game' is and your standards are all willy nilly. Brink is a 'very, very bad game'. Ride to Hell: Retribution is a 'very, very bad game'. DA2 was, the most reasonable criticism I can really respect without thinking that someone is engaging in hyperbole because they had high expectations, a mediocre Bioware game, which makes it an average-to-decent game. 

The proof is when you make silly statements like 'it looks like a budget PS2 title'. Show me some screenshots, because that is a logically bankrupt assertion.

Modifié par DaringMoosejaw, 04 septembre 2013 - 10:05 .

[dracuella]

DaringMoosejaw wrote...

Morocco Mole wrote...

Not really. I just think DA2 is a very, very bad game that needed several more months of dev time so it wasn't a blatantly obvious alpha that EA tried to sell for sixty dollars. Even ignoring the lazy cut and paste job involving the environments. It still had a badly written plot that tried to cram three different plots into it (qunari, Hawke's family, mage/templar) none of which got much development and the latter was such a contrived mess of strawmen arguments and lolevil figures that I'm surprised so many people take it seriously.

Most of the party is not likeable, and half of them fall into every cliche bioware romance type you can imagine.

But the biggest offense is that the game is just. not. fun. to play. Even ME3, a game that has flaws of its own, at least managed to have decent gameplay. Unlike DA2 where I think half of the game length is walking back and forth via copy/paste area and fighting mobs of easy enemies that constantly spawn from thin-air as I walk from one quest to another.

It also looks like a budget PS2 title.

The game wholly deserves its reputation as a godawful game and is right up there with Sonic Chronicles as the worst thing Bioware has ever done.

I think you're greatly exaggerating what a 'very, very bad game' is and your standards are all willy nilly. Brink is a 'very, very bad game'. Ride to Hell: Retribution is a 'very, very bad game'. DA2 was, the most reasonable criticism I can really respect without thinking that someone is engaging in hyperbole because they had high expectations, a mediocre Bioware game, which makes it an average-to-decent game. 

The proof is when you make silly statements like 'it looks like a budget PS2 title'. Show me some screenshots, because that is a logically bankrupt assertion.

I need a *thumbsup* button for posts I like and agree with. And for post that contain the words willy nilly.

[Xhon12]

No.

And I'm sick of people bringing all the **** on Bioware because they didn't like two games. How is it strange that Bioware staff quits if the forums are full of people making a ****storm on them? (Not refering to the OP)

[GodWood]

DaringMoosejaw wrote...
The proof is when you make silly statements like 'it looks like a budget PS2 title'. Show me some screenshots, because that is a logically bankrupt assertion.

[Seboist]

After BW's past three strikes (ME2,DA2 and ME3) they'll have to really go all out to convince me they're back in the game.

[devSin]

Using the console peasants as evidence of how the game looks is like using the little Jack models running around on Earth in ME3 or the silly cutout people in the clubs and hub areas in both ME2 and ME3 to say that the ME games look like trash.

You can certainly point to it, but at least be honest about it. Those people look like crap because of crap memory limitations.

Modifié par devSin, 04 septembre 2013 - 10:25 .

[GodWood]

devSin wrote...
Using the console peasants as evidence of how the game looks is like using the little Jack models running around on Earth in ME3 or the silly cutout people in the clubs and hub areas in both ME2 and ME3 to say that the ME games look like trash.

You can certainly point to it, but at least be honest about it. Those people look like crap because of crap memory limitations.

[DaringMoosejaw]

GodWood wrote...

DaringMoosejaw wrote...
The proof is when you make silly statements like 'it looks like a budget PS2 title'. Show me some screenshots, because that is a logically bankrupt assertion.

Now where's that budget PS2 title that has better cut-out background characters? You can also easily notice all the very good background textures, so this picture is just making it obvious that you're cherry-picking a deliberately poor model out of the entire game.

Modifié par DaringMoosejaw, 04 septembre 2013 - 10:29 .

[DaringMoosejaw]

Morocco Mole wrote...

If you want to ignore the elf you can just look at the boring, brown background textures. The game is just ugly.

All opinion. Where's your budget PS2 comparison? Critique the art direction all you'd like, that's all your opinion, but the textures are most certainly better quality than anything you can drum up.

[Plaintiff]

"It's utterly damning that background NPCs with literally zero lines are not as well rendered as party members and other major characters, because lord knows that's where all the player's attention should be all the time."