23 réponses à ce sujet

[wowpwnslol]

It was mediocre before the nerf. Now it's useless. The CC part of it never worked on bosses and very rarely on elites - which meant it could only be used on normal mobs, which are never a threat anyway. It has a cooldown of 60 seconds, which means it cannot be spammed like other CC. Now with 10 second duration it's completely worthless, outclassed by pretty much every low tier CC spell, which can hold enemies for longer with shorter cooldown.

The "nerf" to crushing prison is basically Bioware's lazyness to differentiate spells cast by mobs and spells cast by players. Against players crushing prison was insane - because players have no resist/immunity to CC (like elites/bosses do) so it was very hard to survive. Against elites/bosses it was underpowered for tier 4 spell - and against normal mobs there were always better spells.

Another example of a useless spell is curse of mortality. It's devastating when monsters use it, but totally useless for your own mage to pick it up. (CC spell > CoM)

[ArathWoeeye]

I use it on mages. Not to mention you can do the aoe combo. I guess it doesn't feel as good as a 4th tier spell, but then again, cone of cold should probably be tier 5.

Spells do need some arrangements, that is, if higher tier should essentially mean more powerful spell.

[wowpwnslol]

ArathWoeeye wrote...

I use it on mages. Not to mention you can do the aoe combo. I guess it doesn't feel as good as a 4th tier spell, but then again, cone of cold should probably be tier 5.
Spells do need some arrangements, that is, if higher tier should essentially mean more powerful spell.

Swap crushing prison and force field around.

Swap Virulent Walking Bomb and Animate Dead around

[Sloth Of Doom]

CP is far from useless. It does good damage, is a good single-target CC and is used in two spell combos. You also seem to not understand how resistances work.



CoM is less useful since most enemies don;t hea, but if you hav it slapping it on a tougher mob never hurts for the extra damage, much like using VWB as a DoT even when you know the thing won't die in time to explode.

[NinjaWJ]

i play on the console version so i dont think i have the nerf to crushing prison. I think it kicks ass as a spell because everytime its casted on me it is basically a one-hit kill. Its also useful being cast on an enemy because they are paralyzed and take a good amount of damage and you can neutralize enemy mages and bosses like this

[Sloth Of Doom]

wowpwnslol wrote...

ArathWoeeye wrote...

I use it on mages. Not to mention you can do the aoe combo. I guess it doesn't feel as good as a 4th tier spell, but then again, cone of cold should probably be tier 5.
Spells do need some arrangements, that is, if higher tier should essentially mean more powerful spell.

Swap crushing prison and force field around.

Swap Virulent Walking Bomb and Animate Dead around

This, i would agree with.

[ArathWoeeye]

wowpwnslol wrote...

ArathWoeeye wrote...

I use it on mages. Not to mention you can do the aoe combo. I guess it doesn't feel as good as a 4th tier spell, but then again, cone of cold should probably be tier 5.
Spells do need some arrangements, that is, if higher tier should essentially mean more powerful spell.

Swap crushing prison and force field around.

Swap Virulent Walking Bomb and Animate Dead around

Good call with prison and field. Never used the other two.
You forgot about cone of cold being tier 6 (getting up!)

[nmal015]

I dont think it needed nerfing to be honest, it was powerful but could only be used once per combat and didnt freeze boses. Against the player it was far better but still only one spell that could be easily dispelled by a templar. It was annoying but never overpowered imo.

[wowpwnslol]

ArathWoeeye wrote...

Good call with prison and field. Never used the other two.
You forgot about cone of cold being tier 6 (getting up!)

VWB can one shot some bosses (not elites, bosses) when it denotates with vulnerabilities active. It can also be comboed with force field to basically nullify its weakness (friendly fire). If you play solo, you use it on your own mage obviously, if party, you force field your tank as everything around him gets obliterated.

Cone of cold, I feel is balanced @ 15 sec and tier 3.

Spell might should be tier 4, for sure. It scales incredibly well and it's easy to have 100++ spellpower at level 15. Mana clash should be nerfed, made more reliable on nightmare and moved to tier 3.

Spell shield should be tier 2 (too good vs enemy casters with potion spam)

[errant_knight]

I have to disagree. When combined with vulnerability hex, it's very effective, especially on mages of all kinds. It works well on tough enemies in repitition with other imobilizing spells.... The only thing I use more often is the CoC/stonefist combo

[RangerSG]

Crushing prison a tier 2 spell? Gads. It's easy enough to kill people with it now. It's a guaranteed single target death for any mage or rogue caught by it. Even for tanks, it usually represents a 50% health hit. Plus the immobilization so they can get pounded on by everything else.



I'd call the only 'fact' of this thread that someone doesn't know how to use the spell. I agree that some spells need rearranging. Or better, they need a higher mana cost and/or cooldown for the amount of dmg they do. I don't see how cone of cold is more powerful than Blizzard. So if cone of cold is tier 4, where would you put that? 7? 8?



Better to just say the cold line of spells is more powerful than the other lines and should have a mana & cooldown cost reflecting that.

[Kestulefa]

NinjaWJ wrote...

i play on the console version so i dont think i have the nerf to crushing prison. I think it kicks ass as a spell because everytime its casted on me it is basically a one-hit kill. Its also useful being cast on an enemy because they are paralyzed and take a good amount of damage and you can neutralize enemy mages and bosses like this

I use Curse of Mortality and Crushing Prison in tandem, sometimes with another spell... 9 times out of 10, no matter the enemy, it dies. It is a good lockdown for mid- or high-strength enemies, like ogres or spell casters or the floating wraith/revenant types.

[wowpwnslol]

RangerSG wrote...

Crushing prison a tier 2 spell? Gads. It's easy enough to kill people with it now. It's a guaranteed single target death for any mage or rogue caught by it. Even for tanks, it usually represents a 50% health hit. Plus the immobilization so they can get pounded on by everything else.

Define "people"? Trash mobs, which are easily killed by lower tier spells? In which case paralysis is a guaranteed death to any mage or rogue caught by it. Mass paralysis is an *AOE* guaranteed death to anything that gets caught it in (party friendly too). Cone of cold is guaranteed death to *elites* caught it in at 1/4 cooldown.

I'd call the only 'fact' of this thread that someone doesn't know how to use the spell.

How to use it properly? Click it on non elite/boss?

I agree that some spells need rearranging. Or better, they need a higher mana cost and/or cooldown for the amount of dmg they do. I don't see how cone of cold is more powerful than Blizzard. So if cone of cold is tier 4, where would you put that? 7? 8?

I never suggested anything like that.

Better to just say the cold line of spells is more powerful than the other lines and should have a mana & cooldown cost reflecting that.

Terrible way to balance, considering mana pools are limitless.

[RangerSG]

Paralysis does 'no' direct damage. Correct? So no, it isn't guaranteed death.



And I said specifically what it can be used on. Mages are 'trash mobs'? I'll bite my tongue, because this really invites a dig with the level of disregard you show.



I play on the PC w/ 1.02. Sorry, I don't buy that the spell is useless at all. In fact, if I'm not in a position to drop an AOE without being seen, it's my first choice spell, target the enemy mage or lock down the boss. Then drop a nuke on the goons. That pretty much leaves things at 'mop-up' stage right there.



And mana pools aren't 'limitless.' Sure you can drink a potion. If you're not getting beat on from the aggro when you do so. If you are, hope you have Wynne to get you back to your feet.

[jkaymartin]

I find that since I got CP, most fights aren't that difficult. I use it on the highest level enemy, and when it expires, toss paralysis on them; and if I haven't finished off the rest of the mob by then, I throw force field on them until I can get my tank over there. Finished the Archdemon fight in one take because if it - although the AD resisted, the rest of the 'spawn were toast.



CoC is an awesome spell also - blizzard is good, but the friendly fire possibilities are a pain. I can usually position Morrigan near enough to CoC, without actually getting beat upon; and she mostly misses allies...



I'm running a rogue this time, and am using the mabari as one of my tanks - the Dread Howl spell rocks, as does Overwhelm - turn the tables on those b*tch werewolves for a change ;-}

[dkjestrup]

There's no doubt that it's a good spell. Just that I find it gets resisted a lot. I generally get Forcefield, but no higher.



I like Forcefield, mainly to dispel Crushing Prison (friendly fire) and to save my tank from Grab attacks.



Cone of Cold, whilst good, is overrated. It just needs a 20 second cooldown.



Also, on the subject of cooldowns, outside of battle, all cooldowns should be reset (after say, 30 seconds). There's no point. You can just wait for them to reset if you wish, and "quite frankly, it's getting dull".



Spot the reference.

[wowpwnslol]

RangerSG wrote...

Paralysis does 'no' direct damage. Correct? So no, it isn't guaranteed death.

Damage portion was not why crushing prison was used. It was the 20 second CC. Damage was good addition, but not why it was dangrous. Right it's useless with half duration. Inferior to many damage AND cc spells.

And I said specifically what it can be used on. Mages are 'trash mobs'? I'll bite my tongue, because this really invites a dig with the level of disregard you show.

Non elite mages are so easily neutralized, it's a complete joke. Yes, they are "trash mobs" if you know how to play.

I play on the PC w/ 1.02. Sorry, I don't buy that the spell is useless at all. In fact, if I'm not in a position to drop an AOE without being seen, it's my first choice spell, target the enemy mage or lock down the boss. Then drop a nuke on the goons. That pretty much leaves things at 'mop-up' stage right there.

You lost all credibility here. Crushing prison doesn't "lock down bosses". Please, try using crushing prison on any boss and see what happens.

And mana pools aren't 'limitless.' Sure you can drink a potion. If you're not getting beat on from the aggro when you do so. If you are, hope you have Wynne to get you back to your feet.

Drinking mana doesn't cause aggro, wtf are you talking about?

[jkaymartin]

Oh yeah - and I counter Overwhelm with Force Field on whoever's down. Which, of course, only works if I haven't cast FF on a 'spawn.

[KariTR]

I wonder if level difference is causing your spell to fail? I prefer a non-magic group, but will have Wynne out on occasion and havent noticed CP being unreasonably resisted by bosses.

Mind you, I am not one who likes to be able to spam anything, total lockdowns are ridiculous, so the patched version gets a thumbs-up from me. I guess you could always unpatch, they arent mandatory.

[Spitz6860]

Crushing Prison got nerfed? when? last them i checked it's still an excellent mage killer

[castaftw]

used it before nerf, but after it just isnt worth going for. I often take mind blast and force field, but taking telekinetic weapons, which I mostly regard as useless when playing mage, just to get a semi good single target spell is waste of talents.

Glyph of paralysis is imo the best single target boss disable and this one is tier 1, usually lasts a LOT longer than any other disable. This is on nightmare (don't really care bout the lower difficulties).

[ArathWoeeye]

May be a bit of spoiler ahead:

Why I overrate cone of cold is that I am yet to spot a mob that resisted it. Probably not the big A, but even high dragon. Only non-end-game-boss mob I've seen to resist it more than once are the Revenants and a simple hex solves that issue as well.

Not to mention it's aoe and it can be made less resistable by hexes. And it also makes mobs shatterable. There is no cast time. Just... too good.

[Wompoo]

Tad ludicrous to expect that spell to work on elite bosses. Playing nightmare now with an elven mage, do I expect CP to work every time at that level? no, it would be foolish to do so. It is a great get out of gaol spell when ambushed with multiple mages and I also get a fairly good success rate with CoM and CP on yellow mobs. Heh I prefer horror as my CC for boss mobs anyway. All the spells have their pros and cons although CoC is obviously very broken. All I see is someone getting their backside served to then in nightmare, having a cry (and nightmare is actually only hard, hard is normal and so on so on... true nightmare is lacking in this game).

[castaftw]

ArathWoeeye wrote...

May be a bit of spoiler ahead:
Why I overrate cone of cold is that I am yet to spot a mob that resisted it. Probably not the big A, but even high dragon. Only non-end-game-boss mob I've seen to resist it more than once are the Revenants and a simple hex solves that issue as well.
Not to mention it's aoe and it can be made less resistable by hexes. And it also makes mobs shatterable. There is no cast time. Just... too good.

Only thing I find overpowered by the spell is that no one can resist the freeze effect even when immune to cold damage and this obviously needs to be fixed. That being said, on nightmare this freeze effect last like a quarter of a second on most boss elites, not to mention that they will never shatter, so it doesn't break the game. I actually prefer fireball against trash, much bigger aoe, but then again I always take them both.