158 réponses à ce sujet

[LorDC]

Personally, I am for gameplay/story segregation. Merely choosing blood magic as a specialization or using it in combat shouldn't lead to any major repercussions.

[In Exile]

Taleroth wrote...
People underestimate Blood Control. It works wonderfully on Elites. Can even take an Ogre.

It's not that we underestimate it. Why would I care it can control an ogre? Blood would will paralyze it, and it will be dead before the spell wears off. 

[dragonflight288]

PantheraOnca wrote...

sandalisthemaker wrote...


Here we go.   World of Thedas page109:

"Mages who experiment with blood magic are more susceptible to demonic spirits, such as pride demons and risk becoming abominations by way of possession."

There is also a excerpt in the form of a letter on that page  "Responsible Blood Magic"  written by a magister:

"And what of Magister Calanthus, that fool who believed he could make himself the 'Ascended Man' with blood magic? Thirty-three slaves died in that rite, and Calanthus became an abomination so horrific that his apprentices tore out their eyes at the sight of him." 

Apparently, merely casting a powerful blood magic spell while shedding lots of blood runs the risk of instantly turning the caster into an abomination.

I dunno, I read both of those as being due to character traits/situation rather than blood magic itself.

For the first, the type of person who is willing to break taboos to use blood magic is also probably going to be willing to trade something for power.

For the second, I'm betting the instructioms for a ritual or something that would "turn him in to the ascended man" were really just some things a demon had traded off to a mage in the past as such an ascension ritual when it really probably just called the demon to the mage and made the mage vulnerable to possesion. Here it's the ritual/instructions that made the mage suceptable to possession, not blood magic. Though the ritual likely included blood magic. This is kind of a fiddly distinction.

This is a very distinct possibility. Or maybe blood mages, having so much more power than other mages, attract demons more often as a result, and any extensive blood ritual may call a demons attention swiftly, and if the mage is unprepared, may end up possessed.

[Chanda]

LorDC wrote...

Personally, I am for gameplay/story segregation. Merely choosing blood magic as a specialization or using it in combat shouldn't lead to any major repercussions.

Why not, though? If being a Qunari might make it harder for you to actually complete one of the quests (the Devs have mentioned this), then being a Blood Mage should have some consequences, too.

[Taleroth]

Chanda wrote...

LorDC wrote...

Personally, I am for gameplay/story segregation. Merely choosing blood magic as a specialization or using it in combat shouldn't lead to any major repercussions.

Why not, though? If being a Qunari might make it harder for you to actually complete one of the quests (the Devs have mentioned this), then being a Blood Mage should have some consequences, too.

Qunari can make one quest easier while another harder, that's cool.

People are talking about Blood Mage like it should make the townspeople revolt and your companions abandon you.

[Phate Phoenix]

Chanda wrote...

LorDC wrote...

Personally, I am for gameplay/story segregation. Merely choosing blood magic as a specialization or using it in combat shouldn't lead to any major repercussions.

Why not, though? If being a Qunari might make it harder for you to actually complete one of the quests (the Devs have mentioned this), then being a Blood Mage should have some consequences, too.

I agree with this, especially if it's build up like it usually is. If I keep being told that being a Blood Mage is Kind Of A Big Deal, then it should still be kind of a big deal if I specialize in it. That said, new players, who have no idea about blood magic and the crud that could go down, should be given lots of warning if the game decides to be harsh on Blood Mages.

Like, a Blood Mage should be quartered in the streets.

[Mornmagor]

If Blood Magic is so common, why is it gonna be a specialization again?(speculating on this here)

It seems like, for one more time, in DA:I this time, one specialization slot is gonna be reserved for Blood Mage, while the rest of us still ponder if we will ever see our favorite specializations again.

Sigh... -.-

Modifié par Kuroi Kishin, 07 septembre 2013 - 07:57 .

[Chanda]

Taleroth wrote...

Chanda wrote...

LorDC wrote...

Personally, I am for gameplay/story segregation. Merely choosing blood magic as a specialization or using it in combat shouldn't lead to any major repercussions.

Why not, though? If being a Qunari might make it harder for you to actually complete one of the quests (the Devs have mentioned this), then being a Blood Mage should have some consequences, too.

Qunari can make one quest easier while another harder, that's cool.

People are talking about Blood Mage like it should make the townspeople revolt and your companions abandon you.

Not quite that extreme. But it should affect how your companions treat you. Vivienne, being pro-Circle, should be disgusted by it, and maybe she won't help you as much as she could. Kind of like the rivalry/friendship relationship that DA2 had. I would think that Templars especially should be really upset by it. If they see you using blood magic, I think it makes sense that they should approach you and threaten you, or even attack you. You might be able to say, "I"m the Inquisitor, back off" and get away with it, but they shouldn't just ignore it, like in past DA games.

[DarkKnightHolmes]

Personally, if Bioware cared so much about story consistency then they should just drop the blood mage spec because their is no way they can deal with all the consequences of being a blood mage.

[Chanda]

DarkKnightHolmes wrote...

Personally, if Bioware cared so much about story consistency then they should just drop the blood mage spec because their is no way they can deal with all the consequences of being a blood mage.

...Um... Yes, they can. They just have to put it in the gameplay mechanics. The consequences that they want are what they will write into the game. They control the programming. They control how NPC's react.

[Taleroth]

Chanda wrote...

Not quite that extreme. But it should affect how your companions treat you. Vivienne, being pro-Circle, should be disgusted by it, and maybe she won't help you as much as she could. Kind of like the rivalry/friendship relationship that DA2 had. I would think that Templars especially should be really upset by it. If they see you using blood magic, I think it makes sense that they should approach you and threaten you, or even attack you. You might be able to say, "I"m the Inquisitor, back off" and get away with it, but they shouldn't just ignore it, like in past DA games. 

Only if they're going to make other companions hate you for choosing Spirit Healer or Champion with no way of allowing you to justify yourself.

If you want to have consequences, make them tradeoffs equal to the tradeoffs others have. Don't just single one out because you think it's super special.

[DarkKnightHolmes]

Chanda wrote...

DarkKnightHolmes wrote...

Personally, if Bioware cared so much about story consistency then they should just drop the blood mage spec because their is no way they can deal with all the consequences of being a blood mage.

...Um... Yes, they can. They just have to put it in the gameplay mechanics. The consequences that they want are what they will write into the game. They control the programming. They control how NPC's react.

So if there's a major part where you have to go to the Chantry or side with Templars in some moment, you don't think it'll be weird if they allow a blood mage PC to tell them what to do especially in times of war where they're hunting mages.

The game will become extremely unfair to people just because they decided to choose one spec.

Modifié par DarkKnightHolmes, 07 septembre 2013 - 08:18 .

[Taleroth]

DarkKnightHolmes wrote...

So if there's a major part where you have to go to the Chantry or side with Templars in some moment, you don't think it'll be weird if they allow a blood mage PC to tell them what to do especially in times of war where they're hunting mages.

From what it looks, the Templars that are "at war" have become the Red Templar faction. They murder entire villages. I don't see you being forced to side with them, nor do I see them any longer caring whether or not someone is using evil magics.

[Uccio]

I don´t want to have demons as the only way to learn blood magic. As itself that alone makes blood magic "teh evil". I should have the option to learn it from some old spell books in one of the circles. Choosing blood magic should have effects which are not direct (no, you chose blood magic, now your baby dies!) but it should be more subtle consequences, depending on the choises made while using blood magic. It should however also provide good possibilities too, not only bad.

And Cassandra having issue with blood magic is no problem. She´s going to get the murder-knife anyway.

Modifié par Ukki, 07 septembre 2013 - 08:27 .

[DarkKnightHolmes]

Taleroth wrote...

DarkKnightHolmes wrote...

So if there's a major part where you have to go to the Chantry or side with Templars in some moment, you don't think it'll be weird if they allow a blood mage PC to tell them what to do especially in times of war where they're hunting mages.

From what it looks, the Templars that are "at war" have become the Red Templar faction. They murder entire villages. I don't see you being forced to side with them, nor do I see them any longer caring whether or not someone is using evil magics.

Not all templar hunters are high on red lyrium. I'm sure some normal templars who have nothing to do with red lyrium are also hunting down apostate mages.

I'll give an example with the PC being blood mage and helping templars might happen.

The templars are protecting a mere village from being destroyed and their are some mages who have been possessed by demons. After you've killed all the abominations, the random templars thank you and be on their merry way. If we were being story consistent they would more likely go "Blood mage!" and then you'd have to kill them too.

I'm sure we'll be interacting with many templars so I can't imagine Bioware would want every fight to end with templars vs. you.

Modifié par DarkKnightHolmes, 07 septembre 2013 - 08:26 .

[Herr Uhl]

It would make sense if becoming a reaver or bloodmage or just being a mage would make templar and chantry factions suspicious of you. The devs have talked about having the specializations having more impact, so I hope there'll be some differences.

Though it is a bit early to speculate, seeing as they haven't hammered down the basic talent trees, much less which specializations are going to be in the game or how they'll be acquired. Though bloodmage is pretty much a given.

[KainD]

LorDC wrote...

Personally, I am for gameplay/story segregation.

I cannot stress enough how I hate it. 

[Taleroth]

DarkKnightHolmes wrote...

Not all templar hunters are high on red lyrium. I'm sure some normal templars who have nothing to do with red lyrium are also hunting down apostate mages.

 And I'm sure that with the Chantry disorganized, the only Templars who haven't been absorbed into the Inquisition so they can focus on recovering the veil are the ones that are completely insane.

The ones that broke from the Accord are the ones who ended up going to seek the red lyrium. The chantry controlled the lyrium trade and when they broke off, they had to find their own source or become incapable of fighting. Hence the red lyrium.

Modifié par Taleroth, 07 septembre 2013 - 08:36 .

[DarkKnightHolmes]

Taleroth wrote...
And I'm sure that with the Chantry disorganized, the only Templars who haven't been absorbed into the Inquisition so they can focus on recovering the veil are the ones that are completely insane.

Wait. Wait. Wait. Where did it say that templars have been absorbed into the Inquisition?

Taleroth wrote...
The ones that broke from the Accord are the ones who ended up going to seek the red lyrium. Any others are going to be like Vivienne, pro-circle.

And pro-circle Templars wouldn't attack blood mages?

Modifié par DarkKnightHolmes, 07 septembre 2013 - 08:37 .

[Phate Phoenix]

Taleroth wrote...

Chanda wrote...

Not quite that extreme. But it should affect how your companions treat you. Vivienne, being pro-Circle, should be disgusted by it, and maybe she won't help you as much as she could. Kind of like the rivalry/friendship relationship that DA2 had. I would think that Templars especially should be really upset by it. If they see you using blood magic, I think it makes sense that they should approach you and threaten you, or even attack you. You might be able to say, "I"m the Inquisitor, back off" and get away with it, but they shouldn't just ignore it, like in past DA games. 

Only if they're going to make other companions hate you for choosing Spirit Healer or Champion with no way of allowing you to justify yourself.

If you want to have consequences, make them tradeoffs equal to the tradeoffs others have. Don't just single one out because you think it's super special.

This is also a very fair point. I've wondered about this. I feel that the game shouldn't ignore blood magic, but, on the other hand, how do you avoid making Blood Mages super-special-awesome? It's... a little frustrating to ponder, which means I can only imagine the hair pulling that occurs when the actual writers think about it.

So I won't be surprised if there is still a gameplay-story segregation for Blood Mages. Disappointed, yes, but not surprised.

[Taleroth]

DarkKnightHolmes wrote...

Taleroth wrote...
And I'm sure that with the Chantry disorganized, the only Templars who haven't been absorbed into the Inquisition so they can focus on recovering the veil are the ones that are completely insane.

Wait. Wait. Wait. Where did it say that templars have been absorbed into the Inquisition?

Nowhere. But they have no place else to go. The Red Templars are the Templar order, now. Templars who abandon it are going to be deprived of lyrium and without support.

Taleroth wrote...
The ones that broke from the Accord are the ones who ended up going to seek the red lyrium. Any others are going to be like Vivienne, pro-circle.

And pro-circle Templars wouldn't attack blood mages?

No, they wouldn't. Templars in the circle system don't just go attacking mages unprovoked. They arrest them to take to a mage prison designed to sort out abominations. In the current climate, they unlikely still have access to those prisons.

So they're not precisely going to go attacking the guy saving the world. They're not violent fanatics.

[Herr Uhl]

Taleroth wrote...

The Red Templars are the Templar order, now.

Has this been confirmed from an official source?

[Taleroth]

Herr Uhl wrote...

Taleroth wrote...

The Red Templars are the Templar order, now.

Has this been confirmed from an official source?

Consider it speculation. I more mean "the core organized group of Templars that follow Lambert's voiding of the Nevarran Accord."

The Red Templars have numbers, lyrium, and an excuse to be fighting when there are bigger problems to deal with.

[mikeymoonshine]

i think people are forgetting about the fact that you are the inquisitor. Not saying it should give you an ultimate free pass but attacking a blood mage with allot of powerful allies and an army is a bit different from attaching a blood mage.

Plus who is actually going to know you are a blood mage? Sure when hawke uses it in combat and nobody ever bats an eyelid that is annoying but It's not like you are wearing a big red sign all the time saying BLOOD MAGE.

Sure if you use it directly in front of templars then maybe they would attack you (if they have not already for simply being a mage and if you do it in front of other NPCs then maybe they should freak out and run away but I don't see a need for much more reactivity than that outside of your party.

[mikeymoonshine]

Phate Phoenix wrote...

Taleroth wrote...

Chanda wrote...

Not quite that extreme. But it should affect how your companions treat you. Vivienne, being pro-Circle, should be disgusted by it, and maybe she won't help you as much as she could. Kind of like the rivalry/friendship relationship that DA2 had. I would think that Templars especially should be really upset by it. If they see you using blood magic, I think it makes sense that they should approach you and threaten you, or even attack you. You might be able to say, "I"m the Inquisitor, back off" and get away with it, but they shouldn't just ignore it, like in past DA games. 

Only if they're going to make other companions hate you for choosing Spirit Healer or Champion with no way of allowing you to justify yourself.

If you want to have consequences, make them tradeoffs equal to the tradeoffs others have. Don't just single one out because you think it's super special.

This is also a very fair point. I've wondered about this. I feel that the game shouldn't ignore blood magic, but, on the other hand, how do you avoid making Blood Mages super-special-awesome? It's... a little frustrating to ponder, which means I can only imagine the hair pulling that occurs when the actual writers think about it.

So I won't be surprised if there is still a gameplay-story segregation for Blood Mages. Disappointed, yes, but not surprised.

Templars are meant to be almost as wary of spirit healers as they are of blood mages because of there connection to the fade. I guess Anders is a good example of spirits being just as bad as demons.