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Krogans are the worst race in the game....


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#276
Beerfish

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PurpGuy1 wrote...

Beerfish wrote...
Give Krogan lots of health and shields, make a game mechanic where boss range shots make those irrelevant.
(To go along with this give them no dodge and little mobility.)


Krogan can only be killed by boss units because KROGAN ARE BOSS UNITS

THEY ARE THE BOSS UNITS OF THE PLAYER SIDE

Boss vs Boss = fair


There are tons of great Krogan players out there.  The fact that a Krogan and salarian standing side by side in effect have the same shields and health when being hit with some of the womd like scion blasts is a tad bizarre. 

In anycase I shall let the topic die.  The krogans seem to be enraged.

#277
PurpGuy1

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Beerfish wrote...
There are tons of great Krogan players out there.  The fact that a Krogan and salarian standing side by side in effect have the same shields and health when being hit with some of the womd like scion blasts is a tad bizarre. 


Speaking in generalized terms here.

Suppose you have the Krogan and Salarian standing side by side.

Scion shoots at Salarian.  1st shot takes Salarian to Shield Gate.  Second shot takes Salarian to Health Gate.  Third shot downs Salarian.

Scion shoots Krogan.  1st shot takes Krogan to Shield Gate.  Second shot takes Krogan to Health Gate.  Third shot downs Krogan.

In that sense, the two races are identical.  Would you prefer the Scion to 1-shot-kill the Salarian instead?  Or would you rather give the Krogan more Hit Points/Damage Reduction?

1-shot-kill Salarian: annoy Salarian players
More Krogan HP: imbalance Krogan

Take these same two toons and put them side by side vs Marauder Shields.

Marauder Shields shoots at Salarian.  Damage is reasonable.

Marauder Shields shoots at Krogan.  Krogan laughs and goes Headbutt FTW.

This is balanced out more HP/ability to dodge.  Giving Krogan more HP to make him tankier vs Scions would make him godmode vs Marauder Shields (and every other mook as well).

(Come to think of it, once you L2P Krogan ARE godmode anyway, but I digress)

Modifié par PurpGuy1, 09 septembre 2013 - 11:30 .


#278
the_last_krogan

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krogans are the best i love them cause there like me big and strong

#279
brad2240

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Beerfish wrote...

by a lot, and it grieves me to say so because I like them.

Against one faction they do pretty well against the other three not well compared to other races.

- Huge health and shields which can still be one or two shotted against enemy bosses.
- Virtually no mobility at all.
- Huge hit boxes, where other classes can dance around sync killers as soon as you are in range your toast.
- Suffer from the melee build scenario of having to choose from health and shileds or melee damage.
- Rage mechanic that comes into play not often enough  (as in you get into rage by killing stuff but then you have to hunt down other enemies and by that time rage can subside, not too mention it makes some maps like fbwhite blizzard pretty awful to play.)

Now before we get the old l2p, if played in pug by a good player then yes they will do better than the avg public player but stick 4 good players in a match, one krogan and the other 3 anything they wish and I'm betting you'll lag on the score board.

In conclusion, their high shields and health do not make up for increased sync kill danger and general danger of being an up close fighter.


I think you focus too much on the power of scions, they do what they do to all races so its not fair to call the krogan out on it and ignore their durability against massed mook fire which kills as often as bosses, if not more so..

Likewise, all races suffer from choosing between health or melee so not a "krogan weakness." But krogan can max health and still have above average melee damage, or max melee damage while still having above average health/shields. Not everybody can do that. 
 
I also think you are leaning too much on the sync kill argument, as only inexperienced or incompetent players will try to melee a sync killer when it's not safe to do so. Those players will die regardless of what they're playing.

Krogan are a very forgiving race to play and may be the easiest in the game. Their kits universally have high durability and DR powers, and all have some of the most destructive powers or combinations of powers in the game. They're very straight forward and I love that about them.

I would call vorcha and volus the worst races in the game, or at least the ones with the steepest learning curve. And I'm not saying that as a hater, they're very good and very rewarding for people who learn them. But learning them is harder to do. Vorcha can make very good melee builds but I'd argue that they suffer more than krogan from the health or melee choice. Their signature power, Bloodlust, has to be built up and maintained like krogan Rage, but a krogan without Rage active is much better off than a vorcha without Bloodlust active. And, unlike Rage, Bloodlust takes up a valuable power slot and slows down other power use to boot.

Volus are incredibly fragile, and that's hard for some players to get around. A lot of their survivability is tied to Shield Boost, which has a long-ish cooldown and competes directly with active, offensive powers. I know there are people who are good with them but I don't consider them easy kits to play well and, at least in pugs, its pretty rare to see a volus that doesn't die every wave if doing something other than spamming SB.

Compared to these two, krogan are much more forgiving, arguably more destructive, and have greater variety in builds because they're not tied to "must have" racial powers like Bloodlust or Shield Boost.

All in my opinion, of course. Image IPB

#280
PurpGuy1

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Your above average melee is a tool. Use it when the situation arises but don't try to force that situation. You're allowed to shoot things too.

#281
lightswitch

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PurpGuy1 wrote...

Your above average melee is a tool. Use it when the situation arises but don't try to force that situation. You're allowed to shoot things too.


this. it's as if people think the only thing they're allowed to do with a melee build is melee things.

#282
valium

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I originally agreed with the OP until I thought about the vorcha, so I guess krogans are the second worst race.

#283
Arctican

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PurpGuy1 wrote...

Beerfish wrote...
There are tons of great Krogan players out there.  The fact that a Krogan and salarian standing side by side in effect have the same shields and health when being hit with some of the womd like scion blasts is a tad bizarre. 


Speaking in generalized terms here.

Suppose you have the Krogan and Salarian standing side by side.

Scion shoots at Salarian.  1st shot takes Salarian to Shield Gate.  Second shot takes Salarian to Health Gate.  Third shot downs Salarian.

Scion shoots Krogan.  1st shot takes Krogan to Shield Gate.  Second shot takes Krogan to Health Gate.  Third shot downs Krogan.

In that sense, the two races are identical.  Would you prefer the Scion to 1-shot-kill the Salarian instead?  Or would you rather give the Krogan more Hit Points/Damage Reduction?

1-shot-kill Salarian: annoy Salarian players
More Krogan HP: imbalance Krogan

Take these same two toons and put them side by side vs Marauder Shields.

Marauder Shields shoots at Salarian.  Damage is reasonable.

Marauder Shields shoots at Krogan.  Krogan laughs and goes Headbutt FTW.

This is balanced out more HP/ability to dodge.  Giving Krogan more HP to make him tankier vs Scions would make him godmode vs Marauder Shields (and every other mook as well).

(Come to think of it, once you L2P Krogan ARE godmode anyway, but I digress)


This. I noticed you have not answered why you keep focusing on Krogan's being unable to tank Scions (they can tank a couple of shots) when Krogans can tank pretty much everything else better than the other races.

#284
Roster13

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LOL,i completely agree the krogan are one of the best species in the game
i hope in the new mass effect game they should appear more,playing ME3 without a krogan in your team is HOPELESS AND SAD

Modifié par Roster13, 10 septembre 2013 - 02:07 .


#285
Titus Thongger

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that's like saying a tank is inferior to an infantryman because an anti-tank round will kill them both in one shot.

I'm sorry you can't Krogan.

Actually no, I'm not. I'll melee everything to death and leave you in the dust.

#286
Kirrahe Airlines CEO

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This is still going? -_-

#287
Guest_Lusty Argonian Maid_*

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lightswitch wrote...

PurpGuy1 wrote...

Your above average melee is a tool. Use it when the situation arises but don't try to force that situation. You're allowed to shoot things too.


this. it's as if people think the only thing they're allowed to do with a melee build is melee things.


Yep.

You can and should soften the enemies with your gun before going for melee (especially on higher levels). I really don't understand the mentality "it's bad melee character because you can't one hit platinum phantom". Like why the f are you not allowed to shoot it first and finish it with melee? 

#288
squaredgonzo

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Image IPB

#289
Boog_89

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Phoenix.

#290
n7stormreaver

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Boog_89 wrote...

Phoenix.

Just NO.

#291
Sebastianthorson

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Ares_GoW wrote...
Like why the f are you not allowed to shoot it first and finish it with melee?

Because why bother with melee then? Just shoot it.

#292
Leland Gaunt

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Pyjaks everywhere.

#293
didacuscarr

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There is no worst race, don't be racist.

#294
n7stormreaver

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Sebastianthorson wrote...

Ares_GoW wrote...
Like why the f are you not allowed to shoot it first and finish it with melee?

Because why bother with melee then? Just shoot it.

Because it triggers Damage boosters and when you're using shotgun, Shoot > Melee is faster.

And if you're Warlord, you're dumb if you don't shoot first.

#295
koschwarz74

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I agree with the OP. And their passives are the worst.

I think all the krogans should have health regeneration by default (without triggering by rage or anything else) instead of higher shield and/or health pool, and the "fitness or melee" problem would be gone.

Modifié par koschwarz74, 10 septembre 2013 - 11:17 .


#296
Red Panda

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Let's be fair, the Volus, AIU, Geth Trooper, Batarian Sentinel, TGI are way better at taking damage.


The only tank that exists for the krogan is the battlemaster.

While the other krogan are fun and good, like the shaman, they are just as squishy on higher difficulties due to extreme enemy damage.

Krogan are mediocre, easily exceeded in durability by some kits, and in melee damage by kits like the huntress and the GI.


In fact all krogan are worse than the GI.

#297
Leland Gaunt

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OperatingWookie wrote...

Let's be fair, the Volus, AIU, Geth Trooper, Batarian Sentinel, TGI are way better at taking damage.


The only tank that exists for the krogan is the battlemaster.

While the other krogan are fun and good, like the shaman, they are just as squishy on higher difficulties due to extreme enemy damage.

Krogan are mediocre, easily exceeded in durability by some kits, and in melee damage by kits like the huntress and the GI.


In fact all krogan are worse than the GI.



Wow... just wow.

Image IPB

Modifié par Leland Gaunt, 10 septembre 2013 - 01:58 .


#298
Red Panda

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The Krogan are better at melee than anyone.

Modifié par OperatingWookie, 10 septembre 2013 - 06:57 .


#299
geezer117

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Thanks, beerfish, for this thread. I rarely play Krogans as anything but weapons carriers, but did lately spec out Krodept for powers and used him like an adept with 165 CD. This thread explained why I was getting sync killed several times every game. Warp/shockwave is good, but the warp CD takes too long for banshees and I kept getting grabbed, and shockwave is too short ranged for scions on big maps. Seems best to either play krodept as melee or with a big weapon and long CD. But then, why not Justicar or drelldept? Guess I'll go back to only using Krogans as claymore carriers. Until the stupid store gives me a decent Wraith.

*** insert wall of text rant about the store here ****