136 réponses à ce sujet

[andar91]

I don't think Bioware wants us to see the story in black and white. Issues in the world of Thedas are complicated. They COULD have just said that mages have magic and left it at that, and I suspect the world would be very different. The very real threat of demonic possession, however, makes sure that it's a complex issue. Mages are absolutely real people with hopes and dreams like anybody else. They ALSO have power that sets them apart and puts themselves and others at risk. And some of them prove the Templar's worst fears (see DA2 lol).

The presence of religion also complicates things because it casts magic as evil, whereas I don't think it actually is. But still, it sways opinions.

[DeathScepter]

Templars and the Chantry and The Qun are right about the Mages. They need to be control. For All Mages are dangerous

[DatOneFanboy]

DeathScepter wrote...

Templars and the Chantry and The Qun are right about the Mages. They need to be control. For All Mages are dangerous

Stupidest sht ive ever heard.

So Every black person is dangerous and shoud be locked up for living in the ghetto, just because they have a high crime rate? 

2nd. Ur gonna sit down get your fat fingers and tell me that Mage's Are more dangerous then Qunari? i dont remember Them  invading and killing no vicount. Stand up and go get some Cold water  ur heating up too quick 

Modifié par DatOneFanboy, 08 septembre 2013 - 04:38 .

[KainD]

Former_Fiend wrote...

If I lived in the dragon age world where magic and the threats posed by it were very real, then I'd change my tune. 

That's basically my point. There is no real comparison, and every faction has a point. 

[KainD]

MasterScribe wrote...

Only if your INTENTION is to cause harm in order to survive.

If it happens otherwise, morality doesn't seem to play a part.

Yes I fully intend to slaughter all the animals I am eating, and I would intend to murder any person that would threaten my life directly. 

[eye basher]

If i can i'm gonna do what i always do in games when given a choice between 2 sides kill them all and let the devil sort them out.

[Aaleel]

DA:O I was more pro-mage due to how things were portrayed. After how mages were portrayed in DA2 I was completely back on the fence.

[KainD]

eye basher wrote...

If i can i'm gonna do what i always do in games when given a choice between 2 sides kill them all and let the devil sort them out.

So basically you do nothing, you don't care. 

[eye basher]

KainD wrote...

eye basher wrote...

If i can i'm gonna do what i always do in games when given a choice between 2 sides kill them all and let the devil sort them out.

So basically you do nothing, you don't care. 

No there's just a bigger problem you know that tear thats raining demons on everyone either they both get in line and help close it or i use them both as fodder for the demons while i figure out i way to fix it.

[DaringMoosejaw]

DA:2 made both sides end up looking so stupid that, ultimately, if I wasn't given an option to somehow stop them from being stupid or plain kill them both off, I was forced to pick between two choices I had no investment in and the ending ultimately had little to no meaning for me. A lot of people favor that sort of morally grey choice, but you can make things so grey that you just end up not caring who lives or dies - then what's the point?

[TheKomandorShepard]

i want destroy everything like in arcanum xD

[Former_Fiend]

All this having been said, I'm standing by my original point. Right, wrong, doesn't matter. Bigger problems.

So it doesn't matter to me who has the moral high ground in the templar/mage debate. I will beat them both into submission to suit my purposes.

[DatOneFanboy]

Former_Fiend wrote...

All this having been said, I'm standing by my original point. Right, wrong, doesn't matter. Bigger problems.

So it doesn't matter to me who has the moral high ground in the templar/mage debate. I will beat them both into submission to suit my purposes.

dont get carried off that only works in video games

[KainD]

MasterScribe wrote...

Well, if they threaten your life, then it's justified. Is it not?

Understand this: 

There are things that people consider worse than death. It's different for all - some would rather die than be a cripple, some would prefer death to poverty, some don't want to live without a loved one etc. It's all about the quality of life basically, because bare life on it's own does not really have much value. 

Now if it is justified to hurt or kill others to save your life, and there are worse things than death, why wouldn't it be justified to hurt or kill others to improve your quality of life? 

[In Exile]

I would have sided with leaving Kirkwall to burn, but apparently that wasn't a side.

[Former_Fiend]

DatOneFanboy wrote...

Former_Fiend wrote...

All this having been said, I'm standing by my original point. Right, wrong, doesn't matter. Bigger problems.

So it doesn't matter to me who has the moral high ground in the templar/mage debate. I will beat them both into submission to suit my purposes.

dont get carried off that only works in video games

Being that this is a video game, I feel fully validated in using this tactic.

[Potato Cat]

Extermination of the mages is silly, but letting them be free is just as silly. I agree with the Qun and the Circles. Keep the mages safe, keep the rest of the world safe.

[Chari]

Both sides have their reasons. I believe in peaceful resoultion, change, but not revoltuion
But again, most of people see world as black and white. For most people religion is only evil, templars are only evil, chantry is only evil. The hypocrisy of theirs only grows stronger when they support the frigging Tevinter.
I only hope that Bioware won't get influenced by this mass, keep it DA:O style, with realistic conflict

[CELL55]

DA2 didn't do a great job of making either side sympathetic IMO. It came down to me GUESSING that MAYBE there were some kids in the mage tower, while there wouldn't be kids on the templar side as far as I knew. Therefore, I decided to attack the side that would not result in my being directly responsible for killing some young mage kids.
There's some serious logical leaps in my 'reasoning', but the game doesn't exactly offer anything even remotely concrete to stand on.
Conclusion: Both sides were huge jerks, and without any real reason to pick one side over the other, one might as well flip a coin. Hope DAI is better.

[Navasha]

Elfman wrote...

Extermination of the mages is silly, but letting them be free is just as silly. I agree with the Qun and the Circles. Keep the mages safe, keep the rest of the world safe.

Unfortunately, its that kind of thinking that lead to Japanese American internment camps during WWII.   For me, people have the right to exist free and of their own choosing.   That freedom should only be ended by society where there is PROOF that an individual has voluntarily infringed upon another person.  

In that case then the society should come down hard and fast.   Imprisonment or death are then viable options to both remove the problem and serve as a deterrent to others who would consider harming others.

[Vit246]

Elfman wrote...

Extermination of the mages is silly, but letting them be free is just as silly. I agree with the Qun and the Circles. Keep the mages safe, keep the rest of the world safe.

The Qun is inhumane and the conditions of the Circles under Chantry/Templar control were bad enough that Circle mages revolted. The Circles are certainly necessary but if they go back to the way the Chantry/Templars did it, it won't work.

[Taleroth]

Everyone's more right than the Red Templars.

[Former_Fiend]

Navasha wrote...

Elfman wrote...

Extermination of the mages is silly, but letting them be free is just as silly. I agree with the Qun and the Circles. Keep the mages safe, keep the rest of the world safe.

Unfortunately, its that kind of thinking that lead to Japanese American internment camps during WWII.   For me, people have the right to exist free and of their own choosing.   That freedom should only be ended by society where there is PROOF that an individual has voluntarily infringed upon another person.  

In that case then the society should come down hard and fast.   Imprisonment or death are then viable options to both remove the problem and serve as a deterrent to others who would consider harming others.

Where the difference ultimately falls apart is that the kind of prejudice seen here in the real world is always wrong. In Dragon Age, they kind of have a valid point.

And it's not even the X-men argument of mages being unreasonably powerful. It's that each of them is a time bomb. At any given moment they could be taken over, absent their own free will, and slaughter everyone around them. And that's if something minor and blunt like a rage demon possesses them. A pride or desire demon could do much more damage subtly.

If it weren't for this aspect of Dragon Age lore, I'd actually be more inclined to agree with the mages. Give them their freedom and when one uses their powers to kill punish them just like any other criminal. But we're not talking about people who need to be held personally accountable for their actions, we're talking about people who, through no fault of their own, pose a very real threat to everyone around them. A threat that they seem to refuse to acknowledge.