341 réponses à ce sujet

[Wissenschaft]

Lord Raijin wrote...

MerinTB wrote...

Also - Cassandra is a Seeker. That's a level above Templar, as far as I understand it.

Templars are men, not mages, resistant to magic and able to do clearly magical things.

"Because of lyrium!"

Who's to say that Seekers aren't equally endowed?

And - anyone who's taken the time to watch Dawn of the Seeker, and see Cassandra taking down, single-handedly, a half dozen adult dragons in one fight, shouldn't question her ability to defeat a gate.

Realism is not Dragon Age's watch-word.

Seekers aren't one giant army of these thats walking about.

 



After watching Dawn of the Seeker, I'm pretty sure Cassandra could take on the Hulk just like Wolverine did. She might not win but she'd give one hell of a fight. 

Modifié par Wissenschaft, 08 septembre 2013 - 05:13 .

[MisterJB]

Rawgrim wrote...
Given that Cassandra can smash in a metal gate with her shield, it should logically cause one hit kills. You can`t make one of them make sense if it excludes the other.

That's the point! It doesn't make sense and it doesn't need to! It never has!

PCs and Companions in Dragon Age can be set on fire, frozen, have a dragon munch on them, an ogre grab them, be hit by multiple arrows while wearing robes, etc, etc, etc and walk away fine so long as their HP and Defense rating was high enough.
Realistically speaking, it doesn't matter how tough your armor is or how strong you are. If a dragon; which also shouldn't, realistically spaking, be capable of flight, BTW; bites you, you're either going to be cut into pieces or smashed inside your very durable armor.
Being frozen to the point of not moving should also kill you. Even if you're unfrozen quickly; never mind that you're unfrozen when the timer runs out; there would be ice crystal inside your cells which pretty bad.

Point to me one RPG where combat is realistic, just one.

Modifié par MisterJB, 08 septembre 2013 - 05:14 .

[Rawgrim]

Wissenschaft wrote...

lady_v23 wrote...
but they always been there!  why are you complaining about something that has always existed!?

 

I kind of get the feeling that the OP just wants to start an arguement for the sake of arguement. Happens all the time on these forums.

No, its a genuine concern. I don`t want DA2 combat, and I deffinatly don`t want something thats even sillier than that.

[Former_Fiend]

Zu Long wrote...

*Sigh* People need to get over this notion that Dragon Age is some kind of Medieval Simulation. It's not. It's NEVER been that way. As people have pointed out, DA:O had plenty of completely unrealistic facets. My 100lbs soaking wet city elf warrior that you see in my profile picture ran around in heavy armor, and could fling whole groups of armored enemies through the air using a two-handed maul that was BIGGER THAN SHE WAS. She could stun Dragons and Ogres who outweighed her by orders of magnitude by pommel striking them.

To me? All of this was awesome. I deliberately played as a warrior elf in part for the hilarity of this tiny woman running around beating up fantasy monsters. I realize that isn't to everyone's taste, but don't pretend like this is some kind of shift on Bioware's part. They firmly set themselves here from the very beginning.

It's nice when someone makes some kind of sense.

[Rawgrim]

MisterJB wrote...

Rawgrim wrote...
Given that Cassandra can smash in a metal gate with her shield, it should logically cause one hit kills. You can`t make one of them make sense if it excludes the other.

That's the point! It doesn't make sense and it doesn't need to! It never has!

PCs and Companions in Dragon Age can be set on fire, frozen, have a dragon munch on them, an ogre grab them, be hit by multiple arrows while wearing robes, etc, etc, etc and walk away fine so long as their HP and Defense rating was high enough.
Realistically speaking, it doesn't matter how tough your armor is or how strong you are. If a dragon; which also shouldn't, realistically spaking, be capable of flight, BTW; bites you, you're either going to be cut into pieces or smashed inside your very durable armor.
Being frozen to the point of not moving should also kill you. Even if you're unfrozen quickly; never mind that you're unfrozen when the timer runs out; there would be ice crystal inside your cells which pretty bad.

Point to me one RPG where combat is realistic, just one.

Not counting spells and magic here. The drakensang games has pretty realistic combat. The Game of Thrones Rpg has pretty realistic combat. Baldur`s Gate and Icewind Dale, to some point. Betrayal at Krondor. The Ultima games I guess could fall under realistic. Belivable is probably a better word to use, though.

[lady_v23]

Rawgrim wrote...

lady_v23 wrote...

Rawgrim wrote...

lady_v23 wrote...

Rawgrim wrote...

In Exile wrote...

Rawgrim wrote...
Healing spells and healing potions heal the damage. If you don`t use those things warriors die from being electrocuted, stabbed, burned, frozen and whatsnot.

There's no "heal spell" for being set on fire. You burn alive, your armour melts into your flesh, your hair catches fire, your skin roasts, and you roll on the ground begging to die after the first fireball that you're hit with. 

DA:O is very clear that you can be set on fre and get up like it's nothing. A dragon can crush you in its jaw, through you 20 feet and you can get up like it's nothing.

Hell, you can be turned into a pincussion by arrows without wearing any armour and still be fine. 

It heals you while you are burning Anyway, nobody said DA:O was the pinnacle of realism either. But Cassandra shamsing a metal gate like that is just way out there. Its like introducing cellphones to the setting for no good reason other than having it replace the awsome button.

...you're just going in circles now.

Not really. I did state flat out that there is stuff in the previous games that are lame too. Its not my fault that people ignore that I agree with them on that.

but they always been there!  why are you complaining about something that has always existed!?

As I explained 4-5 times earlier, things like these are way too much "out there". And is messes so much with the lore when a single human being can smash down a metal gate of a keep like it was made out of twigs.

It's not out there.  rogues can vanish in a cloud of smoke, warriors knock people down with a shout and the player can be chewed out by a dragon and still be alive and continue fighting.

  YOU'RE the one that it's nit picking what is unrealistic and what is not.

[Wissenschaft]

Rawgrim wrote...

Wissenschaft wrote...

lady_v23 wrote...
but they always been there!  why are you complaining about something that has always existed!?

 

I kind of get the feeling that the OP just wants to start an arguement for the sake of arguement. Happens all the time on these forums.

No, its a genuine concern. I don`t want DA2 combat, and I deffinatly don`t want something thats even sillier than that. 

 

Errr, then you might want to prepare for disappointment. Because the Pax Demo shows that DA: I will be at least as stylish as DA 2 combat.

Modifié par Wissenschaft, 08 septembre 2013 - 05:17 .

[In Exile]

Rawgrim wrote...
As I explained 4-5 times earlier, things like these are way too much "out there". And is messes so much with the lore when a single human being can smash down a metal gate of a keep like it was made out of twigs.

The lore was broken the second DA:O started and the Warden killed 2000 people by the end. RPGs are impossible, because humans can't perform the kinds of epic feats required to be a single hero that averted a global apocalypse. 

[immhey]

I think people here just don't understand. They use argument like this is already fantasy so this is not a problem. The fact is making the world believeable is a part of making immersive game. Would you be okay the Inquisition shooting laser out of his eyes?

[lady_v23]

Rawgrim wrote...

Wissenschaft wrote...

lady_v23 wrote...
but they always been there!  why are you complaining about something that has always existed!?

 

I kind of get the feeling that the OP just wants to start an arguement for the sake of arguement. Happens all the time on these forums.

No, its a genuine concern. I don`t want DA2 combat, and I deffinatly don`t want something thats even sillier than that.

then I guess you don't want Origins combat as well.  Since it had a lot of unrealistic elements.  So tell me, what exactly do you want?  I

[Wissenschaft]

immhey wrote...

I think people here just don't understand. They use argument like this is already fantasy so this is not a problem. The fact is making the world believeable is a part of making immersive game. Would you be okay the Inquisition shooting laser out of his eyes?

 

Actually yes, can my Mage have that power? Its certainly no different then my Mage shooting fireballs out of his hands.

Modifié par Wissenschaft, 08 septembre 2013 - 05:20 .

[Reznore57]

I don't know , I don't care about combat because I know that any combat with realism would be boring to death.
But there's so much you can headcannon like not really happening because gameplay!
I'd like for non combat abilities to stay somewhat "normal" , she could bash the locks of the gate.
Or Smash it open because the lock was not strong enough ,but smash to pieces?
It looks silly.
I can live with it though and again I think the smash ability is nice and can be used for other stuff.

[Rawgrim]

lady_v23 wrote...

Rawgrim wrote...

lady_v23 wrote...

Rawgrim wrote...

lady_v23 wrote...

Rawgrim wrote...

In Exile wrote...

Rawgrim wrote...
Healing spells and healing potions heal the damage. If you don`t use those things warriors die from being electrocuted, stabbed, burned, frozen and whatsnot.

There's no "heal spell" for being set on fire. You burn alive, your armour melts into your flesh, your hair catches fire, your skin roasts, and you roll on the ground begging to die after the first fireball that you're hit with. 

DA:O is very clear that you can be set on fre and get up like it's nothing. A dragon can crush you in its jaw, through you 20 feet and you can get up like it's nothing.

Hell, you can be turned into a pincussion by arrows without wearing any armour and still be fine. 

It heals you while you are burning Anyway, nobody said DA:O was the pinnacle of realism either. But Cassandra shamsing a metal gate like that is just way out there. Its like introducing cellphones to the setting for no good reason other than having it replace the awsome button.

...you're just going in circles now.

Not really. I did state flat out that there is stuff in the previous games that are lame too. Its not my fault that people ignore that I agree with them on that.

but they always been there!  why are you complaining about something that has always existed!?

As I explained 4-5 times earlier, things like these are way too much "out there". And is messes so much with the lore when a single human being can smash down a metal gate of a keep like it was made out of twigs.

It's not out there.  rogues can vanish in a cloud of smoke, warriors knock people down with a shout and the player can be chewed out by a dragon and still be alive and continue fighting.

  YOU'RE the one that it's nit picking what is unrealistic and what is not.

I said those things were lame too. You just chose to ignore it.

[Wissenschaft]

krul2k wrote...

i must admit that made me lol

 

What made u lol?

[Rawgrim]

immhey wrote...

I think people here just don't understand. They use argument like this is already fantasy so this is not a problem. The fact is making the world believeable is a part of making immersive game. Would you be okay the Inquisition shooting laser out of his eyes?

This.

[immhey]

Wissenschaft wrote...

immhey wrote...

I think people here just don't understand. They use argument like this is already fantasy so this is not a problem. The fact is making the world believeable is a part of making immersive game. Would you be okay the Inquisition shooting laser out of his eyes?

 

Actually yes, can my Mage have that power? Its certainly no different then my Mage shooting fireballs out of his hands.

Then we should just go really high fantasy like summoning dragons and warrior could change their blade into gigantic blade and smash the whole group of enemy.

[Rawgrim]

Wissenschaft wrote...

immhey wrote...

I think people here just don't understand. They use argument like this is already fantasy so this is not a problem. The fact is making the world believeable is a part of making immersive game. Would you be okay the Inquisition shooting laser out of his eyes?

 

Actually yes, can my Mage have that power? Its certainly no different then my Mage shooting fireballs out of his hands.

Laser isn`t in the lore.

[Daissran]

MerinTB wrote...

ThunderfoxF wrote...

Wissenschaft wrote...

Rawgrim wrote...
Being angry is a state of mind. I doubt it will mess up for her in combat. Given the way she is now she can kill dragons with a tiny dagger, jab down metal gates. Pretty much makes her a one man army. Thats a Mary Sue.

 
Sigh, being overpowered is not what Mary Sue means. It refers to the author inserting themselves into the story, such as in bad fan fiction. Please stop using the term wrong.

That said, by your definiton, the Warden and Hawke are far more Mary Sue than even Cassandra. They smash though whole armies within their games. In fact, the Warden can leave the world in a perfect state, having saved everyone possible. Which makes the Warden a worst offender of believeibility than Cassandra.

Yeah the usage of Mary-sue on this forum can get very riddiculus. As long as charcter has demonstrable flaws, that can and should get in their way and they aren't universally loved (in universe) they're not a mary-sue

Agreed.

People need to stop using words they don't understand.

Overpowered in not Mary Sue.  At.  All.  A Mary Sue CAN be overpowered, but I doubt anyone is claiming Darkseid or Apocalypse are Mary Sue's.  And if they are, they are ignorant.

^^This.

...and for those of you who still don't get it. adventuresofcomicbookgirl.tumblr.com/post/13913540194/mary-sue-what-are-you-or-why-the-concept-of-sue-is

Modifié par Daissran, 08 septembre 2013 - 05:22 .

[Elhanan]

Wissenschaft wrote...

Considering its just one way to gain entrance to the keep, if you dislike the gate bashing then you can enter by a different method such as through the sewers.

I probably would select an alternative route and subterfuge with a different Class leading that band. However, if this ability exists, being able to spam it would detract from gameplay, IMO.

And avoiding a game mechanic can be helpful, but it does not fix the problem. I choose not to use Harm/ Heal/ Devastating Crit as offensive spells in NWN1, as they also appear to be unbalanced, and this can work for the solo game experience. But the implementation still remains flawed. And when used against you, or with others using it in m/p, it simply becomes another game of reload or follow the leader. IMO.

Modifié par Elhanan, 08 septembre 2013 - 05:23 .

[Former_Fiend]

immhey wrote...

I think people here just don't understand. They use argument like this is already fantasy so this is not a problem. The fact is making the world believeable is a part of making immersive game. Would you be okay the Inquisition shooting laser out of his eyes?

And I think that people are making a mountain out of a molehill.

This isn't shooting lasers out of your eyes. This isn't jumping fifty feet in the air. And this isn't throwing ogres around like rag dolls. This is a gate. A single, thin, steel gate that is by all accounts in poor repair and likely rusted.

Were the two hits a little too much? Maybe. But I guarentee you that if it took a prolonged battering to bring that gate down, people would complain about it taking too long and being tedious. 

[addiction21]

Rawgrim wrote...

Wissenschaft wrote...

immhey wrote...

I think people here just don't understand. They use argument like this is already fantasy so this is not a problem. The fact is making the world believeable is a part of making immersive game. Would you be okay the Inquisition shooting laser out of his eyes?

 

Actually yes, can my Mage have that power? Its certainly no different then my Mage shooting fireballs out of his hands.

Laser isn`t in the lore.

Neither are arrows that bounce to multiple targets or when fired into the air split into dozens more. Dragon Age Origins must be one of the worst games you ever played... you did play it right?

[lady_v23]

Rawgrim wrote...

lady_v23 wrote...

Rawgrim wrote...

lady_v23 wrote...

Rawgrim wrote...

lady_v23 wrote...

Rawgrim wrote...

In Exile wrote...

Rawgrim wrote...
Healing spells and healing potions heal the damage. If you don`t use those things warriors die from being electrocuted, stabbed, burned, frozen and whatsnot.

There's no "heal spell" for being set on fire. You burn alive, your armour melts into your flesh, your hair catches fire, your skin roasts, and you roll on the ground begging to die after the first fireball that you're hit with. 

DA:O is very clear that you can be set on fre and get up like it's nothing. A dragon can crush you in its jaw, through you 20 feet and you can get up like it's nothing.

Hell, you can be turned into a pincussion by arrows without wearing any armour and still be fine. 

It heals you while you are burning Anyway, nobody said DA:O was the pinnacle of realism either. But Cassandra shamsing a metal gate like that is just way out there. Its like introducing cellphones to the setting for no good reason other than having it replace the awsome button.

...you're just going in circles now.

Not really. I did state flat out that there is stuff in the previous games that are lame too. Its not my fault that people ignore that I agree with them on that.

but they always been there!  why are you complaining about something that has always existed!?

As I explained 4-5 times earlier, things like these are way too much "out there". And is messes so much with the lore when a single human being can smash down a metal gate of a keep like it was made out of twigs.

It's not out there.  rogues can vanish in a cloud of smoke, warriors knock people down with a shout and the player can be chewed out by a dragon and still be alive and continue fighting.

  YOU'RE the one that it's nit picking what is unrealistic and what is not.

I said those things were lame too. You just chose to ignore it.

And I already told you this things has always been.  I asked you why you're complaining about something that always existed, and you replied that it is too unrealistic.

So you're going in circles...  If it bothers you that much, I believe you're in the wrong franchise.

[Rawgrim]

lady_v23 wrote...

Rawgrim wrote...

Wissenschaft wrote...

lady_v23 wrote...
but they always been there!  why are you complaining about something that has always existed!?

 

I kind of get the feeling that the OP just wants to start an arguement for the sake of arguement. Happens all the time on these forums.

No, its a genuine concern. I don`t want DA2 combat, and I deffinatly don`t want something thats even sillier than that.

then I guess you don't want Origins combat as well.  Since it had a lot of unrealistic elements.  So tell me, what exactly do you want?  I

It was less in your face, in origins. Told you that earlier too. Please read my posts.

[MisterJB]

Rawgrim wrote...
Not counting spells and magic here.

Spells and magic count. You can discount mages being able to use magic but non-mage being capable of, for instance, be frozen and then be fine as soon as the timer runs out  already makes it unrealistic.

.

The drakensang games has pretty realistic combat.

 Never played. However, watching some images leads me to believe it works much like DA. Characters gets hit by a ball of fire, character is fine so long as healt didn't fall to zero.

The Game of Thrones Rpg has pretty realistic combat.

 
Are you kidding? You can be set on fire with Wildfire; you know, fire that literally can't be put out and is capable of melting stone; and be fine.
And that is not magic. The process of creating wildfire is 100% scientifical.

Baldur`s Gate and Icewind Dale, to some point. Betrayal at Krondor. The Ultima games I guess could fall under realistic. Belivable is probably a better word to use, though.

It's more impossible to fight giants monster; which you can in, at least, some of these games; with a melee weapon than it is to smash through a metal gate with  shield.