37 réponses à ce sujet

[Fast Jimmy]

No to nearly every suggestion in this thread. Reason: Save Import limitations.

Lather, rinse, repeat.

Modifié par Fast Jimmy, 08 novembre 2013 - 12:27 .

[snackrat]

CURE WEREWOLVES: Dalish and ex-werewolf at Wounded Coast.
KILL WEREWOLVES: Dalish and innocent falsely accused of lycanthropy at Wounded Coast.
KILL DALISH (werewolves uncured): Woman appears at Dalish camp, wanting materials for potion.

Because 'kill werewolves' is already closure to that issue, any closure we do get is going to be of the side-quest variety. Can't make werewolves (or at least, Brecillian ones) the main part of a plot if you don't know they're even there.
Curing them also prevents their appearance, but your mileage may vary on whether that counts as true closure. (Especially if you know they're being actively hunted.)

[Vortex13]

King Killoth wrote...

I hope we do..I would even go so far as to have the chance to recruit them into the inquisition. I always long for my army of werewolves to strike fear into my enemies.

Same here.

In fact I would love the option to recruit Werewolves, Golems, Slvans, Awakened Darkspawn, Vantrelal (sp?), Dragons, Griffions, and undead/abominations into my ranks.

Paritaly because I so want to see the look on peoples faces when I arrive to parley flanked by Walking Trees, Stone Men, Wolfmen, and Darkspawn. I really want to give off that "Don't -BLEEP- With Me!" vibe. 


But the main reason why I want to see the more exotic fantasy creatures as possible, recruitable allies, is becuase I want to uttlerly annialate the trope that ONLY the 'goodly' races can be seen as helpful and that the 'non-human' are more than "KILL EVERYTHING IN SIGHT BECAUSE WE'RE MONSTERS!"

[Beerfish]

I hate the werewolves because Swiftrunner was such a snooty bastard. He did have a good name though. 'Run away! run away!'

You kick his ass in the 1st encounter with him, he runs away and threatens you. You kick his ass in the 2nd encounter, he runs away and threatens you. Just a pleasure to make a rug out of his gnarly hide on the last encounter.

[myahele]

Ware wolves are stronger and can infect others to quickly increase in size, but is that a good thing.

Innocent people turning into warewolves. There'll a rift btwn followers of the Lady and those who want a diff life.

That and they are going crazy. I dont think we'll an sane warewolves

[In Exile]

Vortex13 wrote...
Paritaly because I so want to see the look on peoples faces when I arrive to parley flanked by Walking Trees, Stone Men, Wolfmen, and Darkspawn. I really want to give off that "Don't -BLEEP- With Me!" vibe.  

You mean the "I look like the demon invasion threatening everything, immediately kill it with fire?" actual reaction people would have, or the magical protagonist shield that RPGs give players despite having a train in tow that often amounts to a declaration of war?

But the main reason why I want to see the more exotic fantasy creatures as possible, recruitable allies, is becuase I want to uttlerly annialate the trope that ONLY the 'goodly' races can be seen as helpful and that the 'non-human' are more than "KILL EVERYTHING IN SIGHT BECAUSE WE'RE MONSTERS!" 

They are monsters. Werewolves live a horror of an existence to not go on insane murder rampages, and the darkspawn are an actual existence that's antithetical to life. The only way to even make the darkspawn possible allies is to create lore nonsense to nerf or otherwise remove all the things about them that makes them remotely "monstrous" beside their appearrance (e.g. their lack of sentience, their perpetual infecting, poisoning and decimating all life around then, their reproduction by canibalistic rape, etc.). 

[Sylvius the Mad]

Fast Jimmy wrote...

No to nearly every suggestion in this thread. Reason: Save Import limitations.

Lather, rinse, repeat.

But that's easily solved:

Eliminate the save import.


You're welcome.

Modifié par Sylvius the Mad, 08 novembre 2013 - 11:17 .

[Sharn01]

Icy Magebane wrote...

Sharn01 wrote...

Angrywolves wrote...

I expect it'll end badly.
Players who supported the werewolves may have to help Allistair/Anora clean up the mess in their DAI playthroughs.

Its the one decision that definitely should end badly, its the only choice throughout DA:O that can't be justified no matter how much you stretch your perception.  At the time you make the decision, the Keeper has sworn to be your ally if you help him, you have to actually convince the werewolves to give up the whole thing they have been planning since the beginning and murder all the elves, not just the one responsible for their affliction with no forseeable benefit to your Warden, its complete metagaming to pretend you could forsee them joining you in place of the Dalish.

This does not mean that there are not roleplaying reasons to kill the elves, if your character is a murderous psychopath, then thats a reason, its just not a justifiable one in a sense of good decision making,  and I have played through the game once as a murderous psychopath and it was very fun at times, but realistically that character should never have succeeded in his mission to end the blight.

lol... don't you think that's a bit self-righteous?  It's actually pretty easy for a human Warden to wind up on bad terms with the Dalish, and to dislike them before even meeting the Keeper (and he's the second Dalish you speak to!).  You don't have to offer to help him during the initial conversation, and later on, when you meet him in the ruins, you can say "I never agreed to help you."  Furthermore, there are numerous opportunities to avoid fighting the werewolves if you have a decent persuasion skill... so you can be at least respectful towards one another long before  meeting the Lady of the Forest.

As for wiping out the Dalish... well, werewolves are a lot more powerful than elves, so...    I'd be more willing to accept "pragmatic" or even "sociopath" to describe it.  "Psychopath" implies taking pleasure in inflicting pain, which is not the only reason to do this.  But based on what you've written so far, I'm probably wasting my time trying to change your mind.

What is pragmatic about abandoning a gauranteed ally in the hopes that after tricking a group to commit an act that was the opposite of their initial intent they will replace that ally?

How is someone being rude to you punishable by death?  If I killed everyone that was rude to me and managed to get away with it there wouldnt be a single living person within hundreds of miles, even my best friends and wife have been rude to me when they are in a bad mood.  Even if I limited it to people who where initially rude on first meeting and showed no intention of changing their behavior there would be a severe population drop.

Sorry, there is no way to justify the decision in beneficial or pragmatic terms within the game, it is based soley on a decision of not liking elves or metagaming because you know they will be replaced by werewolves and you prefer that option.

To give another example of a slaughter in the game, at the alienage the slaver offers to sacrafice the elves to make you more powerful.  Now, no matter how cold hearted or evil that choice may be, there is a clear benefit to your character for performing the act that they are aware of before making the decision.  There is no clear benefit to the player in the case of the werewolves, you have to actually convince them with a persuade check to kill the dalish with no known benefit to you at the time of making the choice.  It would be equal to showing up at the slaver in the alienage and persuading him to kill all the elves because you just feel like killing elves, and after you kill them all he says, well, since we have all these dead elves I know a spell to use thier life force to give you some power.

Thats why its the one decision that cant be pragmatically justified within the game, because you make it before you have the knowledge that doing so will have any benefit for you.

Modifié par Sharn01, 09 novembre 2013 - 09:52 .

[Huge_Beaver]

[/quote]

What is pragmatic about abandoning a gauranteed ally in the hopes that after tricking a group to commit an act that was the opposite of their initial intent they will replace that ally?

How is someone being rude to you punishable by death?  If I killed everyone that was rude to me and managed to get away with it there wouldnt be a single living person within hundreds of miles, even my best friends and wife have been rude to me when they are in a bad mood.  Even if I limited it to people who where initially rude on first meeting and showed no intention of changing their behavior there would be a severe population drop.

Sorry, there is no way to justify the decision in beneficial or pragmatic terms within the game, it is based soley on a decision of not liking elves or metagaming because you know they will be replaced by werewolves and you prefer that option.

To give another example of a slaughter in the game, at the alienage the slaver offers to sacrafice the elves to make you more powerful.  Now, no matter how cold hearted or evil that choice may be, there is a clear benefit to your character for performing the act that they are aware of before making the decision.  There is no clear benefit to the player in the case of the werewolves, you have to actually convince them with a persuade check to kill the dalish with no known benefit to you at the time of making the choice.  It would be equal to showing up at the slaver in the alienage and persuading him to kill all the elves because you just feel like killing elves, and after you kill them all he says, well, since we have all these dead elves I know a spell to use thier life force to give you some power.

Thats why its the one decision that cant be pragmatically justified within the game, because you make it before you have the knowledge that doing so will have any benefit for you.

[/quote]

Also a houndred of the most skilled archers with longbows would do a hell of a lot more damage than werewolves whos fighting style kinda makes it a given for them to become tainted. And also since darkspawn doesn't feel fear in a "normal" way they wouldn't be intimidated because they growl and snarl at them.

In short, no reason what so ever to side with the werewolves from a in-game standpoint, only if you find the Dalish boring which I don't understand since they're kickass

Edit: Tried to remove most of the quotes but ****ed it up...

Modifié par Huge_Beaver, 09 novembre 2013 - 03:52 .

[Icy Magebane]

@Sharn01 - The point at which the Warden can make this proposal is during a negotiation to recruit the werewolves as allies. The Warden wouldn't be trying to do this from the beginning unless you're metagaming. However, when you speak to the Lady, you have the option of negotiating, and part of this includes killing the Dalish clan.

Also, I never said that rudeness was punishable by death. What I said is that the player is given many reasons to dislike the Dalish as this questline progresses, and that during conversations and side quests with them, it is possible to alienate them unless you agree with most of what they say. This also includes the merchant refusing to trade with you. Should this occur, it is far more likely that you would desire alternate allies, which the game conveniently provides later on.

With regard to your slaver analogy, this seems comparable, but only at first glace. You must keep in mind that the persuade option is immediately followed by "I'd rather have you as allies" or something to that effect... it should be obvious to the player that choosing the persuade option is the beginning of negotiating for different allies. What other reason could you have for wiping out a group that might help you end the Blight? Maybe you are indeed a psychopath and just lucked into new allies... but I doubt that most people playing the game didn't immediately conclude that this option would lead to being able to recruit the werewolves...

@Huge_Beaver - Yeah, okay, I admit the Dalish are cool in their own way, but that's just a matter of taste.  Werewolves, especially the Shadow Wolves were kicking my butt in the deepest part of the ruins, so I can't dismiss their fighting ability.  But of course, that only applies to certain classes and parties... last time I played, they died surprisingly quickly...

As far as the taint goes, that would give you a reason not to use the dwarves or humans, so I can't say that ranged attacks makes the elves more attractive as allies...

Modifié par Icy Magebane, 09 novembre 2013 - 07:03 .

[Huge_Beaver]

@Icy Magebane

Sorry mate I'm very slow but how can an army equipped with one of the most dangerous weapons which guarentees them not getting the taint not be attractive (Unless engaged in close combat of course) . Not trying to be snarky, just don't understand, ELI5

[Icy Magebane]

Huge_Beaver wrote...

@Icy Magebane

Sorry mate I'm very slow but how can an army equipped with one of the most dangerous weapons which guarentees them not getting the taint not be attractive (Unless engaged in close combat of course) . Not trying to be snarky, just don't understand, ELI5

Vulnerability to the taint is irrelevant because half of the army (75% if you recruit the Templars) will be using melee regardless.  How do you even know that werewolves can be tainted?  I just think that this is a poor reason to recruit the elves...  maybe ranged weapons are preferable to you, and I admit that they have advantages at times, but leave the taint out of it, that's all I'm saying.

[celestial_emperor]

I would really like to see what happens with the Werewolves, they're a very powerful force and the shock of a tribe of werewolves lurking in Fereldan could be pretty terrifying enough to reach the Orlesians.

The Inquisition has been set up to be really um, FOCUSED, on what the Warden and the Champion were doing. I think it would be unfair to not see what releasing the werewolves has done to the world.