454 réponses à ce sujet

[Star fury]

billy the squid wrote...

Star fury wrote...

Plaintiff wrote...

Star fury wrote...

Having races except white should be on the 100th place in a priority list of Bioware.

What's number one, then?

Romances! Lots and lots of romances. They could do with good story and decent combat too.

What? Clearly you're out of your mind, pixel waifus and mailbox humping is what makes a game, no need for a story, and combat, we need a skip combat button anyway.

Many many people here would agree with that line.

[fdgvdddvdfdfbdfb]

Zu Long wrote...

EntropicAngel wrote...

Statare wrote...

I agree Isabela is not black. But I would like to point out that having "shiny hair"/ "smooth cheekbones" and being black are not mutually exclusive. I'm not entirely sure what you meant, but being of African decent does not mean you'll have any set qualities, other than (and sometimes not) darker skin pigmentation.

Anyway. I think part of the problem with making characters look non-European was a result of the past engine. Or at least I hope. Also, the Antivans are more Spanish, and less Latin@. Sadly.

I have never seen an (pure) African descendent without coarse hair. Have you?

The potruding cheeckbones is less common, but it is still fairly common--blacks typically have high cheeckbones. Unlike Isabella.

So if you're not a "pure" African descendent, you're not actually black?

I guess you're not pure black? Isn't that how the logic should go? For example isn't obama just as white as he is black? Plus he's raised by a white parent idk

"being of African decent does not mean you'll have any set qualities, other than (and sometimes not) darker skin pigmentation."
How is that true? How about blue eyes, light (and straight) hair, epicanthal folds and on and on. and you're contradicting yourself since the complaint about older games was that "they don't look black, they're just tanned" That begs the question, what makes a character suggestive of African descent? Wider nostrils, plumper lips? I think hair isn't as important since so  many people straighten nowadays that it's something you're used to seeing. Of course, there's a risk of turning into a caricuture. Unless they're modelled after real people and any accusations will fly into a brick wall.


I also wonder why these issues always revolve around black and white when there are so many ethnicities that are NEVER represented in games. And why are africans in games always treated as african americans? They both have to do with the nature of the market and developer I guess.
And what's up with elves? Are they just a race of "pointy eared white people"? and dwarfs "short white people"? We already have "superpowered white people" on Krypton and "viking cosplay white people" on Asgard so why the hell not. See this is why I like the Elder Scroll's races.

[Maria Caliban]

Allan Schumacher wrote...

But yes, diversity in DAI. Interesting? Hmmm... quite.

I find it odd that various types of British accents seem to be common in Ferelden, Tevinter, Rivian, and the Free Marches. The only places with non-British accents are Orlais, Nivara (sp?), and Antiva.

[phunx]

Maria Caliban wrote...

Western society posits European features as more attractive than those associated with African ancestry. The white doll, black doll test shows us that even at a young age, children consider whites prettier.

No, it's not surprising that you don't find wiry hair attractive. Yes, it's probably racist, but there's no way to be sure and I'm not sure it's something you could change if you wanted to.
 

I am glad you brought that study up, it just speaks volumes on the reality of things. It's not just "personal preference", the rabbit hole goes very deep and "colorblindness" does nothing but maintains the status quo.

[fdgvdddvdfdfbdfb]

greengoron89 wrote...

Ailith430 wrote...

Arcane Warrior Mage Hawke wrote...

Volourn wrote...

I enjoyed jade Empire just fine despite it having only one scene with a white person and I was playing an Asian. Not once did I think to myself, my god, I rate this game an 8 but if I could be white, I'd give it a 10!


The moment you start judging something/someone based on skin colour that is racism/bigotry. That said, some racism is a lot more 'benign' or 'ess offensive' than others. ie. Asking for a characetr that has the same colour skin as you and implying you won't like the game as much if there isn't is racism but it's not as bad (obviously) as beating someone up because they are a different colour.

So equality= racism/sexism? because that's what your post is saying to me.

Yeah, go figure a game that takes place in an Asian based kingdom would be made up of mostly Asian people. Holy moley.

As opposed to a game that takes place in a Europe-based kingdom that is made up of mostly white people?

zing.

Gta san andreas didn't have many white people either and it was cool

[Estelindis]

I'd like DA:I to have a good selection of African-looking character-creation options. Aside from the fact that appropriate hair, skin colour and facial structure options will enable people to play African-looking Inquisitors if they want, giving plenty of these options seems (to me) to make it more likely that we'll see a good number of NPCs who look like this. I make no claim to know how the process of deciding NPCs' looks works in Bioware; speaking purely as someone who's fooled around in the NWN toolset for far too long, it would be silly not to use all of the options for NPC looks, in order to distinguish one from the next. If 25% of chargen options have an African look, you'd be limiting yourself to only using 75% of the resources for making NPCs' faces look different if you didn't create some African-looking NPCs.

Incidentally, in spite of the fact that I come from a country where the vast majority is white, I find black people to be the most attractive people on the planet.  I have never been quite sure if this is racist of me or not.  

Modifié par Estelindis, 16 septembre 2013 - 10:22 .

[ManchesterUnitedFan1]

Maria Caliban wrote...

Allan Schumacher wrote...

But yes, diversity in DAI. Interesting? Hmmm... quite.

I find it odd that various types of British accents seem to be common in Ferelden, Tevinter, Rivian, and the Free Marches. The only places with non-British accents are Orlais, Nivara (sp?), and Antiva.

Well Vivienne has a British accent, so apparently in some regions of Orlais they have English accents too.

I find it so boring.

[mikeymoonshine]

Maria Caliban wrote...

Western society posits European features as more attractive than those associated with African ancestry. The white doll, black doll test shows us that even at a young age, children consider whites prettier.

No, it's not surprising that you don't find wiry hair attractive. Yes, it's probably racist, but there's no way to be sure and I'm not sure it's something you could change if you wanted to.

Plaintiff wrote...

Only if being homosexual makes me sexist.

They're really not equivalent.

Well I am white and I find black people just as attractive as white people. I don't think you can claim humans just naturally find white people more attractive based on this very simple study that doesn't really account for any variables and only involved 20 test subjects.

[Ziggeh]

mikeymoonshine wrote...

Well I am white and I find black people just as attractive as white people. I don't think you can claim humans just naturally find white people more attractive based on this very simple study that doesn't really account for any variables and only involved 20 test subjects.

Nor can you refute a small scale study with an anecdote.

(Attraction is deeply complicated so I would hesitate to draw an conclusion that wasn't heavily caveated, but the above is still true)

[Daissran]

mikeymoonshine wrote...

Maria Caliban wrote...

Western society posits European features as more attractive than those associated with African ancestry. The white doll, black doll test shows us that even at a young age, children consider whites prettier.

No, it's not surprising that you don't find wiry hair attractive. Yes, it's probably racist, but there's no way to be sure and I'm not sure it's something you could change if you wanted to.

Plaintiff wrote...

Only if being homosexual makes me sexist.

They're really not equivalent.

Well I am white and I find black people just as attractive as white people. I don't think you can claim humans just naturally find white people more attractive based on this very simple study that doesn't really account for any variables and only involved 20 test subjects.

Regardless of what you think, unfortunately 'white' is considered more 'beautiful' and 'preferable', here's an example: www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/08/05/cover-girl-diversity_n_3696327.html

[mikeymoonshine]

Daissran wrote...

mikeymoonshine wrote...

Maria Caliban wrote...

Western society posits European features as more attractive than those associated with African ancestry. The white doll, black doll test shows us that even at a young age, children consider whites prettier.

No, it's not surprising that you don't find wiry hair attractive. Yes, it's probably racist, but there's no way to be sure and I'm not sure it's something you could change if you wanted to.

Plaintiff wrote...

Only if being homosexual makes me sexist.

They're really not equivalent.

Well I am white and I find black people just as attractive as white people. I don't think you can claim humans just naturally find white people more attractive based on this very simple study that doesn't really account for any variables and only involved 20 test subjects.

Regardless of what you think, unfortunately 'white' is considered more 'beautiful' and 'preferable', here's an example: www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/08/05/cover-girl-diversity_n_3696327.html

Again, Variables. That article is commenting on the covers of magazines in a country Where Caucasian is the majority of people. 
The cover women generally seem to be fashion icons and pop stars. There could be many other reasons why black women are not on the covers of these magazines as much as white women are. 
lets say this is evidence that people in white countries find white people more attractive, the reasoning could be far more complicated than "it's just natural to humans". 
I have yet to see any evidence that shows people just naturally find white people more beautiful. It seems much more likely that this kind of thinking is caused by our society.

[Daissran]

mikeymoonshine wrote...

Daissran wrote...

mikeymoonshine wrote...

Maria Caliban wrote...

Western society posits European features as more attractive than those associated with African ancestry. The white doll, black doll test shows us that even at a young age, children consider whites prettier.

No, it's not surprising that you don't find wiry hair attractive. Yes, it's probably racist, but there's no way to be sure and I'm not sure it's something you could change if you wanted to.

Plaintiff wrote...

Only if being homosexual makes me sexist.

They're really not equivalent.

Well I am white and I find black people just as attractive as white people. I don't think you can claim humans just naturally find white people more attractive based on this very simple study that doesn't really account for any variables and only involved 20 test subjects.

Regardless of what you think, unfortunately 'white' is considered more 'beautiful' and 'preferable', here's an example: www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/08/05/cover-girl-diversity_n_3696327.html

Again, Variables. That article is commenting on the covers of magazines in a country Where Caucasian is the majority of people. 
The cover women generally seem to be fashion icons and pop stars. There could be many other reasons why black women are not on the covers of these magazines as much as white women are. 
lets say this is evidence that people in white countries find white people more attractive, the reasoning could be far more complicated than "it's just natural to humans". 
I have yet to see any evidence that shows people just naturally find white people more beautiful. It seems much more likely that this kind of thinking is caused by our society.

Not sure what it'll take to convince you ...but here's more proof: www.beautyredefined.net/beauty-whitewashed-how-white-ideals-exclude-women-of-color/

Snip: "In a country where a full one-third of the
population is black, Native American, Asian, Pacific Islander, Hispanic
or Latina, the serious underrepresentation of women of color in media
is really disturbing..."

[phunx]

mikeymoonshine wrote...
Again, Variables. That article is commenting on the covers of magazines in a country Where Caucasian is the majority of people. 
The cover women generally seem to be fashion icons and pop stars. There could be many other reasons why black women are not on the covers of these magazines as much as white women are. 
lets say this is evidence that people in white countries find white people more attractive, the reasoning could be far more complicated than "it's just natural to humans". 
I have yet to see any evidence that shows people just naturally find white people more beautiful. It seems much more likely that this kind of thinking is caused by our society.

Who said it's "just natural to humans"? We're saying the exact opposite.
EDIT: Also the promotional material for DA:2 did something very similar to Isabela

Modifié par phunx, 16 septembre 2013 - 11:52 .

[Hazegurl]

As long as I can use the character creator to create this woman (the one holding the flag)


And this man.



I'm happy lol!

[Xilizhra]

Is anyone but me kind of put off by the term "people of color?" Not that it's a big issue or anything, but it sort of implies that white people are "colorless," which would seem to imply either being a raceless default (which I thought the people here wanted to avoid) or somehow inferior and possessed of no worthwhile racial characteristics. Again, not a major issue, but something that's niggled at me.

[Br3admax]

Xilizhra wrote...

Is anyone but me kind of put off by the term "people of color?" Not that it's a big issue or anything, but it sort of implies that white people are "colorless," which would seem to imply either being a raceless default (which I thought the people here wanted to avoid) or somehow inferior and possessed of no worthwhile racial characteristics. Again, not a major issue, but something that's niggled at me.

No. I'm perfectly fine with the term.

[t0mm06]

I'm confused about what this thread is asking? i mean you've always had the choice of skin tones from pale to dark.
And as for NPCs, well The chasand are dark skinned, the rivain or sort of, (i've always assumed) more indian in skin tone. antivans are quite i would say more spanish/italian/greek(?).

[mikeymoonshine]

phunx wrote...

mikeymoonshine wrote...
Again, Variables. That article is commenting on the covers of magazines in a country Where Caucasian is the majority of people. 
The cover women generally seem to be fashion icons and pop stars. There could be many other reasons why black women are not on the covers of these magazines as much as white women are. 
lets say this is evidence that people in white countries find white people more attractive, the reasoning could be far more complicated than "it's just natural to humans". 
I have yet to see any evidence that shows people just naturally find white people more beautiful. It seems much more likely that this kind of thinking is caused by our society.

Who said it's "just natural to humans"? We're saying the exact opposite.
EDIT: Also the promotional material for DA:2 did something very similar to Isabela

I guess I just misunderstood then, Sorry. Whitewashing of black women and characters really upsets me tbh. 

[Cutlass Jack]

David7204 wrote...

You know, I really think I ought to be honest here.

I don't think those characters would look as nice with wiry hair. And I would thus probably frown on BioWare making them with it.

Not really racist. Because Wiry hair looks even worse on white people.

[Zkyire]

Daissran wrote...

Regardless of what you think, unfortunately 'white' is considered more 'beautiful' and 'preferable', here's an example: www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/08/05/cover-girl-diversity_n_3696327.html

White features are considered more attractive in white-majority countries?

Well I never.

Modifié par Zkyire, 16 septembre 2013 - 01:03 .

[Bionuts]

I find very dark skin to be immensely attractive. And very pale skin is repulsive to me. I'm not racist, it's just that I want to create dark skinned characters. Not those stains in Origins.