626 réponses à ce sujet

[DKJaigen]

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

DKJaigen wrote...

Orsino likely didnt know all the activities of quentin. orsino supported him because he believed it would lead to knowledge how to resserect a person. So its good intensions bad ending type of situation

Oh, puh-lease.
Experimenting with corpses on ressurection? That's playing God right there.
Coupled with Orsinos paranoia about Meredith finding out and his mastery of Blood Magic?

Playing god? thats a good thing. In fact we do it every single to prevent diseases hunger genetic defects and all the other nastyness mother nature throws at us fom happening.

[Lotion Soronarr]

DKJaigen wrote...

Playing god? thats a good thing. In fact we do it every single to prevent diseases hunger genetic defects and all the other nastyness mother nature throws at us fom happening.

Death isn't a desease.
It is part of life and inevitable end.

Bringing corpses back to life isn't the same as looking to cure cancer, dr. Frankenstein.

[Lotion Soronarr]

TheRedVipress wrote...

We don't really know what is the Litany, and how it was made or discovered, and we don't know how different types of magic really interact with each other.
So don't be so hasty to judge the Litany. (even if it interrupts you from completely demonizing magic and mages)

Litanny is suppsoed to a written text you read.
Like some kind of incantation (sicen it's a piece of paper). Either that or it's some kind of magical artifact.

If 1) - then it makes little sense since magic doesn't work by incantation in Thedas. And the danger of demons nad blood mages would be made trivial. Make a thousand copies and have a few people chant them on the streets over and over. Anywhere witing earshout is a demon-free and blood-magic free zone.

If 2) - then why not just mass-produce it and get the same result as 1? Adralla was a circle mage. She studied and documented her findings.

[Br3admax]

1. Magic can very well work by incantation as seen in Warden's keep.
2. The Litany is clearly written on a scroll.
3. Everyone isn't going to have the entire litany memorized for the off chance that a blood mage appears. Would you?

[Xilizhra]

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

DKJaigen wrote...

Playing god? thats a good thing. In fact we do it every single to prevent diseases hunger genetic defects and all the other nastyness mother nature throws at us fom happening.

Death isn't a desease.
It is part of life and inevitable end.

Bringing corpses back to life isn't the same as looking to cure cancer, dr. Frankenstein.

Death from old age is a function of decaying telomeres within our cells. If that can be halted or reversed, no more inevitability. Immortality is possible, even if some would deny it... just as, for instance, flight was.

@Xilizhra: Did you just excuse
Orsino's support of Quentin? Are you actually Pro-Serial Killer - or are
you "roleplaying"?

It wasn't support, he just didn't tell anything about Quentin to the templars. And I can understand his position.

Modifié par Xilizhra, 25 septembre 2013 - 01:16 .

[Laughing_Man]

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

TheRedVipress wrote...

We don't really know what is the Litany, and how it was made or discovered, and we don't know how different types of magic really interact with each other.
So don't be so hasty to judge the Litany. (even if it interrupts you from completely demonizing magic and mages)

Litanny is suppsoed to a written text you read.
Like some kind of incantation (sicen it's a piece of paper). Either that or it's some kind of magical artifact.

If 1) - then it makes little sense since magic doesn't work by incantation in Thedas. And the danger of demons nad blood mages would be made trivial. Make a thousand copies and have a few people chant them on the streets over and over. Anywhere witing earshout is a demon-free and blood-magic free zone.

If 2) - then why not just mass-produce it and get the same result as 1? Adralla was a circle mage. She studied and documented her findings.

Magic and incantation:
While magic dose not require incantation usualy, it dosen't mean that incantations don't have any power.
For example, the Litany can focus the reader faith or willpower in a similar yet stronger way to the templars usual skill, also, if you want to use the: "Names Have Power" trope, you can say that the Litany calls for spiritual help from benevolent spirits in the fade.

Mass Producing:
The chantry really likes to keep it's power to itself, otherwise there won't be a real need to keep the templars dependent on Lyrium (even if it boosts them), AND the secrets of the templar powers would be available to everyone, or at least regular law-enforcment.

Modifié par TheRedVipress, 25 septembre 2013 - 01:17 .

[Reaverwind]

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

TheRedVipress wrote...

We don't really know what is the Litany, and how it was made or discovered, and we don't know how different types of magic really interact with each other.
So don't be so hasty to judge the Litany. (even if it interrupts you from completely demonizing magic and mages)

Litanny is suppsoed to a written text you read.
Like some kind of incantation (sicen it's a piece of paper). Either that or it's some kind of magical artifact.

If 1) - then it makes little sense since magic doesn't work by incantation in Thedas. And the danger of demons nad blood mages would be made trivial. Make a thousand copies and have a few people chant them on the streets over and over. Anywhere witing earshout is a demon-free and blood-magic free zone.

If 2) - then why not just mass-produce it and get the same result as 1? Adralla was a circle mage. She studied and documented her findings.

On mass production - cost-prohibitive without a printing press. 

[eye basher]

TheRedVipress wrote...

Nefla wrote...

I find it bad. It's taught by demons, it dominates the minds of others, it is purely destructive. If you actually want to protect people with magic, there are much better schools.

You ignore the fact that to dominate the minds of others is a *choice*, and at least some kinds of mind attacks are possible through regular magic as well, which may mean that it's possible to use regular magic to dominate or influence minds as well.

Besides, what is a greater sacrifice than a man spilling his own blood to protect others?

The problem with blood magic is that in order to work ever bigger spells you need more and more blood are you gonna bleed yourself dry what if a huge army is attacking you are you going to bleed yourself to death or what if you think ''hey maybe i can use other peoples blood after all i'm saving their lives i have good intentions''.

[draken-heart]

krul2k wrote...

So Blood magic, you can mind control ppl right?? well i wannae mind control 4 templars in game an watch em do the YMCA

I never understood the whole thing with people believing that blood magic can control minds. Seems to me that it only hijacks the body. Magic like is used in the Litany are primarliy used to stop the spell from being completed.

[DarthLaxian]

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

DKJaigen wrote...

Playing god? thats a good thing. In fact we do it every single to prevent diseases hunger genetic defects and all the other nastyness mother nature throws at us fom happening.

Death isn't a desease.
It is part of life and inevitable end.

Bringing corpses back to life isn't the same as looking to cure cancer, dr. Frankenstein.

of course death and aging are kind of diseases! (the first bacteria are essentially immortal, so aging only came into play after complex organisms rose up, so IMHO in the formation of these organisms there is a misstake or something)

greetings LAX

[draken-heart]

DarthLaxian wrote...

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

DKJaigen wrote...

Playing god? thats a good thing. In fact we do it every single to prevent diseases hunger genetic defects and all the other nastyness mother nature throws at us fom happening.

Death isn't a desease.
It is part of life and inevitable end.

Bringing corpses back to life isn't the same as looking to cure cancer, dr. Frankenstein.

of course death and aging are kind of diseases! (the first bacteria are essentially immortal, so aging only came into play after complex organisms rose up, so IMHO in the formation of these organisms there is a misstake or something)

greetings LAX

You are forgetting murder/homicide, overdosing, suicide, and plain old accidental death

[Uccio]

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

DKJaigen wrote...

Playing god? thats a good thing. In fact we do it every single to prevent diseases hunger genetic defects and all the other nastyness mother nature throws at us fom happening.

Death isn't a desease.
It is part of life and inevitable end.

Bringing corpses back to life isn't the same as looking to cure cancer, dr. Frankenstein.

Whats so bad about playing god? 

[The Elder King]

Ukki wrote...

Whats so bad about playing god? 

Well, it'll lead to your death, if you want to play with my PC's family and friends.

[Laughing_Man]

Hmm... I wonder, if the magic to resurrect someone was not looking so disgusting with blood and body parts all over the place, but instead had lots of white light and heavenly choirs singing,
would that be considered "playing god" too?

*going to look for a spell to make bright lights and mood music*

[Boycott Bioware]

TheRedVipress wrote...
Hmm... I wonder, if the magic to resurrect someone was not looking so disgusting with blood and body parts all over the place, but instead had lots of white light and heavenly choirs singing,
would that be considered "playing god" too?

*going to look for a spell to make bright lights and mood music*

That's not magic, that's miracle!

[Bogrot]

Blood magic is an alternative form of magic. It's not inherently evil, but it makes casting very powerful spells possible. For example, a mage would normally need very large amounts of lyrium, a strong connection to the Fade and even more colleagues to reanimate the dead. The chantry suppresses such knowledge fearing the return of the Magisters. Demons can teach Blood magic to those that desire great power or are truly desperate. Sometimes demons get the upper hand when they interact with these people and they transform the unfortunate mages into abominations.

[DKJaigen]

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

DKJaigen wrote...

Playing god? thats a good thing. In fact we do it every single to prevent diseases hunger genetic defects and all the other nastyness mother nature throws at us fom happening.

Death isn't a desease.
It is part of life and inevitable end.

Bringing corpses back to life isn't the same as looking to cure cancer, dr. Frankenstein.

Death is nothing more then a flaw (as xil already explained)in the human being . its a weakness that will be terminated in time. But i wonder why you insist on being weak instead of growing stronger? I wonder what you are afraid of.

[Karach_Blade]

There had better be multiple ways of acquiring the blood mage skill for those who don't want all of their mages making deals with demons to get it. As for blood magic itself....it is a weapon, a dangerous weapon, but a weapon nonetheless.

[Laughing_Man]

Karach_Blade wrote...

There had better be multiple ways of acquiring the blood mage skill for those who don't want all of their mages making deals with demons to get it. As for blood magic itself....it is a weapon, a dangerous weapon, but a weapon nonetheless.

Yeah, a deal with a demon would have made sense if you got some impressive demonic-spells in return,
not only the demon tells you that blood magic is possible.

Basic blood-magic is kinda self-explanatory.

[Azaron Nightblade]

TheRedVipress wrote...

My question is this: Let's say an experienced mage who knows about the fade and the temptations of demons uses blood magic for good, like killing darkspawn, or demons, or insane red templars, whatever, does this act in itself makes him a bad-guy?

I don't think it's inherently evil, but it's definitely a very slippery slope to walk.
Blood Magic is the quick and dirty way to power, all it requires is a bit of knowledge as Dragon Age 2 showed us when a lot of mages resorted to blood magic when they were cornered and saw no other way out.
It's a very insidious temptation by it's very nature - each time a blood mage fails to do something with their own powers there will be a little voice in their head telling them "You could probably do this... if only you opened up someone else's veins...".

[Laughing_Man]

Azaron Nightblade wrote...

I don't think it's inherently evil, but it's definitely a very slippery slope to walk.
Blood Magic is the quick and dirty way to power, all it requires is a bit of knowledge as Dragon Age 2 showed us when a lot of mages resorted to blood magic when they were cornered and saw no other way out.
It's a very insidious temptation by it's very nature - each time a blood mage fails to do something with their own powers there will be a little voice in their head telling them "You could probably do this... if only you opened up someone else's veins...".

The problem with the "sippery slope" logic, is that while it can't be dismissed out of hand, it is in itself a "slippery slope", simply because you can say that about almost anything.

If the human race in general was paralised with fear, it would still be living in caves and we wouldn't have awesome video-games as entertainment.

Modifié par TheRedVipress, 26 septembre 2013 - 08:01 .

[Azaron Nightblade]

TheRedVipress wrote...

Azaron Nightblade wrote...

I don't think it's inherently evil, but it's definitely a very slippery slope to walk.
Blood Magic is the quick and dirty way to power, all it requires is a bit of knowledge as Dragon Age 2 showed us when a lot of mages resorted to blood magic when they were cornered and saw no other way out.
It's a very insidious temptation by it's very nature - each time a blood mage fails to do something with their own powers there will be a little voice in their head telling them "You could probably do this... if only you opened up someone else's veins...".

The problem with the "sippery slope" logic, is that while it can't be dismissed out of hand, it is in itself a "slippery slope", simply because you can say that about almost anything.

If the human race in general was paralised with fear, it would still be living in caves and we wouldn't have awesome video-games as entertainment.

Oh, I'm aware of that - magic in the DA universe is dangerous enough by itself.
The thing is that with most other "weapons" and technologies, they don't get any more effective by sacrificing a few hundred Elves in some ritual - so there is no temptation to do it unless you are already a psychopath (in which case any weapon would be put to a dark use).

[DarthLaxian]

Ukki wrote...

Whats so bad about playing god? 

nothing is, if you are not an amoral kind of person IMHO (it's just people's fears coming out to play - they fear the unknown...or have religious reservations etc.)

greetings LAX

[Laughing_Man]

Azaron Nightblade wrote...

TheRedVipress wrote...

Azaron Nightblade wrote...

I don't think it's inherently evil, but it's definitely a very slippery slope to walk.
Blood Magic is the quick and dirty way to power, all it requires is a bit of knowledge as Dragon Age 2 showed us when a lot of mages resorted to blood magic when they were cornered and saw no other way out.
It's a very insidious temptation by it's very nature - each time a blood mage fails to do something with their own powers there will be a little voice in their head telling them "You could probably do this... if only you opened up someone else's veins...".

The problem with the "sippery slope" logic, is that while it can't be dismissed out of hand, it is in itself a "slippery slope", simply because you can say that about almost anything.

If the human race in general was paralised with fear, it would still be living in caves and we wouldn't have awesome video-games as entertainment.

Oh, I'm aware of that - magic in the DA universe is dangerous enough by itself.
The thing is that with most other "weapons" and technologies, they don't get any more effective by sacrificing a few hundred Elves in some ritual - so there is no temptation to do it unless you are already a psychopath (in which case any weapon would be put to a dark use).

Temptations exist with any kind of power, and unless you are a sociopath or a psychopath you would not sacrifice hundreds of slaves for use as fuel.