2497 réponses à ce sujet

[Hellion Rex]

EmperorSahlertz wrote...

The Rite does have its uses.

If we could modify its power to merely stripping a mage's power, I would be inclined to agree. As of now, not so much.

[Bleachrude]

Lord Aesir wrote...

eluvianix wrote...

 
Also very true! So no, I don't think magic is going anywhere.

While all true, as an alternative to Tranquility for mages deemed too dangerous and those that choose it, it would be invaluable.

There _IS_ an alternative to Tranquility.

Death.

Why exactly are we treating mages differently from the other population? If a mage commits a deed that would result in death if they were not a mage, they should be subject to the same punishment.

[Xilizhra]

The Rite does have its uses.

So does sex. That doesn't mean you inflict it upon someone who doesn't want it.

Why exactly are we treating mages differently from the other population? If a mage commits a deed that would result in death if they were not a mage, they should be subject to the same punishment.

And I'm not for killing them either. I'll design justice based upon what I believe to be just, not what's been inflicted upon those whose treatment I have no hand in deciding.

[AresKeith]

Xilizhra wrote...

The Rite does have its uses.

So does sex. That doesn't mean you inflict it upon someone who doesn't want it.

Why exactly are we treating mages differently from the other population? If a mage commits a deed that would result in death if they were not a mage, they should be subject to the same punishment.

And I'm not for killing them either. I'll design justice based upon what I believe to be just, not what's been inflicted upon those whose treatment I have no hand in deciding.

!. except The Rite and sex aren't even close to the same thing, so comparing them makes no sense

2. I'm afraid of your view of just

[Medhia Nox]

@Bleachrude: Some people want to simply house murderers and criminals in prisons and have people who don't commit crimes pay for them - and then, we can teach them why they were wrong - and they'll come out and not commit the crimes again.

So doing that for mages is going to amount to the same thing for them.

Otherwise - I agree with you.

What is good enough for a man who murders with a knife - is good enough for a mage.

The difference - you cannot disarm a mage without Tranquility.

[KainD]

AresKeith wrote...

!. except The Rite and sex aren't even close to the same thing, so comparing them makes no sense

No, rite and sex are not the same thing. But the aplication of something undesirable on a person is a completely logical and sensable comparison.

[Medhia Nox]

@KainD: Do we normally force criminals into sexual situations now?

Abuses aside (and they are notable in the Dragon Age) - Tranquility was never meant to be used arbitrarily... it was a punishment for breaking the law.

As far as I know - we (in the United States) don't have rape punishments on the lawbooks.

Modifié par Medhia Nox, 12 octobre 2013 - 01:46 .

[Xilizhra]

Medhia Nox wrote...

@KainD: Do we normally force criminals into sexual situations now?

Abuses aside (and they are notable in the Dragon Age) - Tranquility was never meant to be used arbitrarily... it was a punishment for breaking the law.

As far as I know - we (in the United States) don't have rape punishments on the lawbooks.

You're correct legally, but it doesn't make it justified. All it means is that the Chantry considered emotional ravaging to be acceptable punishment.

[KainD]

Medhia Nox wrote...

@KainD: Do we normally force criminals into sexual situations now?

Abuses aside (and they are notable in the Dragon Age) - Tranquility was never meant to be used arbitrarily... it was a punishment for breaking the law.

As far as I know - we (in the United States) don't have rape punishments on the lawbooks.

To be fair though, I would rather get raped than be made trainquil, hell I would rather die, than become an empty broken husk. 

The Rite is just.. Srsly, I can't think of a single thing worse that can be done to a person. But that's my perspective. 

Edit: Maybe cutting off someones hands and legs off, and tying them to a bed for the rest of their life while not letting them die, would match tranquility. 

Modifié par KainD, 12 octobre 2013 - 01:59 .

[Hellion Rex]

KainD wrote...

Medhia Nox wrote...

@KainD: Do we normally force criminals into sexual situations now?

Abuses aside (and they are notable in the Dragon Age) - Tranquility was never meant to be used arbitrarily... it was a punishment for breaking the law.

As far as I know - we (in the United States) don't have rape punishments on the lawbooks.

To be fair though, I would rather get raped than be made trainquil, hell I would rather die, than become an empty broken husk. 

The Rite is just.. Srsly, I can't think of a single thing worse that can be done to a person. But that's my perspective. 

I agree. Having our emotions, and being able to dream is what makes life so bright. To take that away from someone, even in the name of the greater good, unsettles me greatly.

Modifié par eluvianix, 12 octobre 2013 - 01:58 .

[KainD]

eluvianix wrote...

I agree. Having our emotions, and being able to dream is what makes life so bright. To take that away from someone, even in the name of the greater good, unsettles me greatly.

It's just perfect slavery. 

Edit: Or, I don't even know. I feel like there needs to be a new word for it. Because atleast slaves still enjoy the fact that they are alive, hence why they want to survive and obey. 

Modifié par KainD, 12 octobre 2013 - 02:07 .

[Hellion Rex]

KainD wrote...

eluvianix wrote...

I agree. Having our emotions, and being able to dream is what makes life so bright. To take that away from someone, even in the name of the greater good, unsettles me greatly.

It's just perfect slavery.

I am hesitant to use that word, because of the connotation it carries (as well as the inevitable BSN explosion that occurs after.) But that is your own opinion. Is Tranquility degrading? Yes. Is it uncomonly cruel? Yes, without a doubt. But it isn't slavery. To kill off a person's emotions and soul like that is undoubtedly one of the inhumane acts out there, but it's not slavery. It is a whole other beast altogether.

Edit: I agree that slavery isn't the best word for it. It is hard to find a word that can encompass all the Tranquility is.

Modifié par eluvianix, 12 octobre 2013 - 02:09 .

[AresKeith]

KainD wrote...

Medhia Nox wrote...

@KainD: Do we normally force criminals into sexual situations now?

Abuses aside (and they are notable in the Dragon Age) - Tranquility was never meant to be used arbitrarily... it was a punishment for breaking the law.

As far as I know - we (in the United States) don't have rape punishments on the lawbooks.

To be fair though, I would rather get raped than be made trainquil, hell I would rather die, than become an empty broken husk. 

The Rite is just.. Srsly, I can't think of a single thing worse that can be done to a person. But that's my perspective. 

Edit: Maybe cutting off someones hands and legs off, and tying them to a bed for the rest of their life while not letting them die, would match tranquility. 

Even though the Rite has been abused, the only reason you'd be made Tranquil is for being a blood mage or abomination 

[KainD]

eluvianix wrote...

To kill off a person's emotion like that is undoubtedly one of the inhumane acts out there, but it's not slavery. It is a whole other beast altogether.

Yes, I edited a little there. It is worse than slavery and it deserves it's own word.

[spirosz]

I agree. Tranquillity has its uses, I would never want to become one.

[KainD]

AresKeith wrote...

Even though the Rite has been abused, the only reason you'd be made Tranquil is for being a blood mage or abomination 

I don't care why people are made tranquil. I don't care for the fact that people are made tranquil as well, it's their problems, lol. 

All I'm saying is, being made tranquil is a very bad experience. And being a slave, and being raped or killed, is a lot better fate, than being made tranquil. 

Modifié par KainD, 12 octobre 2013 - 02:13 .

[Medhia Nox]

@KainD: My point wasn't that I think Tranquility is awesome and totally a great option.

I only meant that rape is the punishment of the innocent - while Tranquility was the punishment of the guilty.

Guilty - because both the First Enchanter and the Knight Commander AGREE to the guilt btw.

No, I am not saying Tranquility is a good option... but it is not forced sex. I actually find the comparison grossly insulting.

I also think we should be careful before we start discussing what types of trauma's are better unless we've personally experienced them.  It's a little bit insensitive.

Modifié par Medhia Nox, 12 octobre 2013 - 02:13 .

[Hellion Rex]

AresKeith wrote...

KainD wrote...

Medhia Nox wrote...

@KainD: Do we normally force criminals into sexual situations now?

Abuses aside (and they are notable in the Dragon Age) - Tranquility was never meant to be used arbitrarily... it was a punishment for breaking the law.

As far as I know - we (in the United States) don't have rape punishments on the lawbooks.

To be fair though, I would rather get raped than be made trainquil, hell I would rather die, than become an empty broken husk. 

The Rite is just.. Srsly, I can't think of a single thing worse that can be done to a person. But that's my perspective. 

Edit: Maybe cutting off someones hands and legs off, and tying them to a bed for the rest of their life while not letting them die, would match tranquility. 

Even though the Rite has been abused, the only reason you'd be made Tranquil is for being a blood mage or abomination 

At the end of the day, it needs to be modified to strict magic removal, and then execution or whatever else would happen otherwise. The horrors of current Tranquility practice can lead to another rebellion if it were to be abused further down the road in its current state.

[Medhia Nox]

My question is... what exactly is Aeonar for?

[KainD]

Medhia Nox wrote...

 I actually find the comparison grossly insulting.

Elaborate.

[Medhia Nox]

@KainD: I did. It's a terrible personal experience - but if you have not been raped, I would be careful comparing it to fictional events that can't happen in real life and saying that these fictional events are so much worse to something someone on these forums might have actually gone through.

But that's way off topic - and not appropriate for a game board.

Modifié par Medhia Nox, 12 octobre 2013 - 02:16 .

[Hellion Rex]

Medhia Nox wrote...

My question is... what exactly is Aeonar for?

Good point. Codex says its a place for "accused apostates and maleficarum". Seems kind of useless since they could just be made tranquil.


Edit: Apparently it's the northern twin to Ostagar, and only templars know its location.

Modifié par eluvianix, 12 octobre 2013 - 02:18 .

[Hellion Rex]

Medhia Nox wrote...

@KainD: I did. It's a terrible personal experience - but if you have not been raped, I would be careful comparing it to fictional events that can't happen in real life and saying that these fictional events are so much worse to something someone on these forums might have actually gone through.

But that's way off topic - and not appropriate for a game board.

You are right. We need to be cognizant of that.

[Medhia Nox]

@eluvianix: It also shoots holes into the "every naughty mage is made Tranquil at the whim of some tyrannical Templar mastermind" theory.

[Hellion Rex]

Medhia Nox wrote...

@eluvianix: It also shoots holes into the "every naughty mage is made Tranquil at the whim of some tyrannical Templar mastermind" theory.

Not large holes, mind you. But you do have a point. I wonder if we will ever get to visit..