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[The Night Mammoth]

I'm not aware of any forced friendship, and I don't even know what sentimental hallmark moments are.

[Barquiel]

The only forced friendship moment with Liara was in ME2, when Shep hugs her on Illium. In ME3, you always have the option to tell her that you don't want to talk about personal stuff, you can refuse the gift, etc.

Modifié par Barquiel, 01 octobre 2013 - 04:55 .

[Seboist]

Mdoggy1214 wrote...

Steelcan wrote...

David7204 wrote...

Wrong again, Massively. You claimed that liking LotSB was based on 'fanboyism.' If the majority of the players agree it was very high quality, which they do, then it clearly isn't fanboyism at all. It's a perfectly legitimate argument.

Popularity DOES NOT EQUATE TO QUALITY

I replayed Lair of the Shadow broker somewhat recently, and it's still imo the best Mass Effect DLC. If you asked me, the height of Mass Effect in terms of quality, peaked with LotSB. From there it's been a steady but slow decline, and then plummets to the frozen wasteland of the 7th layer of Hell during the final few hours of ME3.

The only good things about LOTSB were the pew pew and Tela Vasir.

[The Night Mammoth]

StreetMagic wrote...

Barquiel wrote...

The only forced friendship moment with Liara was in ME2, when Shep hugs her on Illium. In ME3, you always have the option to tell her that you don't want to talk about personal stuff, you can refuse the gift, etc.

There's no evolution to those choices though. It's just an ever repeating series of saying "No". No loyalty gauge. Just  her trying again later.

Can twice be a considered an ever repeating series?

[Mathias]

Seboist wrote...

Mdoggy1214 wrote...

Steelcan wrote...

David7204 wrote...

Wrong again, Massively. You claimed that liking LotSB was based on 'fanboyism.' If the majority of the players agree it was very high quality, which they do, then it clearly isn't fanboyism at all. It's a perfectly legitimate argument.

Popularity DOES NOT EQUATE TO QUALITY

I replayed Lair of the Shadow broker somewhat recently, and it's still imo the best Mass Effect DLC. If you asked me, the height of Mass Effect in terms of quality, peaked with LotSB. From there it's been a steady but slow decline, and then plummets to the frozen wasteland of the 7th layer of Hell during the final few hours of ME3.

The only good things about LOTSB were the pew pew and Tela Vasir.

And the music
And the driving section
And the boss fight
And the dossiers and vids on the Shadow Broker ship

[Seboist]

Mdoggy1214 wrote...

Seboist wrote...

Mdoggy1214 wrote...

Steelcan wrote...

David7204 wrote...

Wrong again, Massively. You claimed that liking LotSB was based on 'fanboyism.' If the majority of the players agree it was very high quality, which they do, then it clearly isn't fanboyism at all. It's a perfectly legitimate argument.

Popularity DOES NOT EQUATE TO QUALITY

I replayed Lair of the Shadow broker somewhat recently, and it's still imo the best Mass Effect DLC. If you asked me, the height of Mass Effect in terms of quality, peaked with LotSB. From there it's been a steady but slow decline, and then plummets to the frozen wasteland of the 7th layer of Hell during the final few hours of ME3.

The only good things about LOTSB were the pew pew and Tela Vasir.

And the music
And the driving section
And the boss fight
And the dossiers and vids on the Shadow Broker ship

Lol, no.

[dreamgazer]

Mdoggy1214 wrote...

And the music
And the driving section
And the boss fight
And the dossiers and vids on the Shadow Broker ship

I think Shadow Broker is pretty great, but most of these are definitely not highlights to me---especially that driving section.

[The Night Mammoth]

StreetMagic wrote...

The Night Mammoth wrote...

StreetMagic wrote...

Barquiel wrote...

The only forced friendship moment with Liara was in ME2, when Shep hugs her on Illium. In ME3, you always have the option to tell her that you don't want to talk about personal stuff, you can refuse the gift, etc.

There's no evolution to those choices though. It's just an ever repeating series of saying "No". No loyalty gauge. Just  her trying again later.

Can twice be a considered an ever repeating series?

I'm counting the whole story. She never gets the message. The best writing I got was from Karpynshyn back in ME1.. It seemed like you could set some boundaries there, but her weird behavior just repeated again into the last game.

What wierd behaviour? You only need to talk to Liara once in the first game past her recruitment, once in the second game, and though she's a major character in the third game, there are only two personal conversations you can't avoid. 

It's a contrast to some characters where if you say one line, you burn a bridge from that point.

Like who?

The other thing that sucks about her in 3 is she acts entitled to Shepard's inner thoughts more than others. It's kind of the same thing she does in ME1, where she tries to get Shepard to say "what you're really feeling" and not just what you tell the crew.

Shepard never has to give Liara their inner thoughts unless you choose to. 

[Sir DeLoria]

Mdoggy1214 wrote...

And the music
And the driving section
And the boss fight
And the dossiers and vids on the Shadow Broker ship

The driving section was boring. The music was mediocre. The boss fight was incredibly short. The dossiers were far more creepy than funny.

Not saying it was a bad dlc, I enjoyed many parts of it, but those are not its strongest points.

[Br3admax]

LotSB isn't that great. The only reason it's held in high regard among the dlc is because ME dlc isn't that good to begin with.

[The Night Mammoth]

[quote]StreetMagic wrote...

[quote]The Night Mammoth wrote...


Like who?[/quote]

As far as I know, once a romance choice is cut off in any given game a character is in, it's not an option again. It's a burned bridge and stays a "business relationship". Additionally, you can get Miranda or the VS killed pretty easily in 3 by being terse or missing a beat in the social options. This is not a burned bridge per se, but another way of developing tension. Kelly Chambers is a pretty finicky character like this in 2. Challenge her in any way, and the entire relationship changes. You have to kiss her ass just to see her in 3. One could say Wrex stands on pretty shaky ground throughout the series too. There's all kinds of ways to screw things up with him.[/quote]
[/quote]
I don't understand. It is possible to screw up romantic or even friendly relationships with certain characters. I'm pretty sure Liara is one of them. Cheat on her or renegade her in the third game and she gets less conversational. Regardless though, why does not being able to screw up a relationship with her matter? The only thing that should matter is how she interacts with Shepard.

[quote][quote]
Shepard never has to give Liara their inner thoughts unless you choose to. 
[/quote]

No, you don't have to. But it'll come up again in another form. That's not how real people behave, unless they're creepy. Not to say she is "creepy". She's not real. Just how it comes off, if she was real. They don't have any kind of flags or reputation with how you interact with Liara apparently. They just always assumed her to be this confidant type of character, regardless of your choices.
[/quote]
Unless you pursue a friendly, paragon relationship with her, she doesn't ask about Shepard's inner thoughts except for once during the first cabin visit in the third game. I really have no idea where this notion comes from. 

Modifié par The Night Mammoth, 01 octobre 2013 - 06:48 .

[KaiserShep]

Br3ad wrote...

LotSB isn't that great. The only reason it's held in high regard among the dlc is because ME dlc isn't that good to begin with.

I'm going to have to call shenanigans on this one. Just because someone doesn't find it to be all that good doesn't mean that those that do hold it in high regard only do so because they're weighing it against their opinions of the other DLC's. For myself, the only other DLC's I hold higher than this is Citadel, and I guess to some extent the Extended Cut, as it salvages the entire trilogy for me compared to the OE.

Modifié par KaiserShep, 01 octobre 2013 - 07:33 .

[Mathias]

Necanor wrote...

Mdoggy1214 wrote...

And the music
And the driving section
And the boss fight
And the dossiers and vids on the Shadow Broker ship

The driving section was boring. The music was mediocre. The boss fight was incredibly short. The dossiers were far more creepy than funny.

Not saying it was a bad dlc, I enjoyed many parts of it, but those are not its strongest points.

Driving section was great. It was a nice feature that they didn't have to add in but they did it anyway. It was cool to actually pilot a "hovercar" in a futuristic city. Loved the music, thought it fit the scenes perfectly. Dossiers were funny and interesting, not sure why you found them creepy.

[Mathias]

Cthulhu42 wrote...

Mdoggy1214 wrote...

I replayed Lair of the Shadow broker somewhat recently, and it's still imo the best Mass Effect DLC.

Citadel >>>> LotSB

Citadel is 2nd best imo. It had way too many cheesy scenes and the basic premise of it was ridiculous. There's a doomsday clock on all of civilization, hundreds of thousands of people are being slaughtered by the hour. But hey, we  gotta party down!

[KaiserShep]

Music mediocre? Humbug to this tomfoolery.

[Mathias]

Seboist wrote...

Mdoggy1214 wrote...

Seboist wrote...

Mdoggy1214 wrote...

Steelcan wrote...

David7204 wrote...

Wrong again, Massively. You claimed that liking LotSB was based on 'fanboyism.' If the majority of the players agree it was very high quality, which they do, then it clearly isn't fanboyism at all. It's a perfectly legitimate argument.

Popularity DOES NOT EQUATE TO QUALITY

I replayed Lair of the Shadow broker somewhat recently, and it's still imo the best Mass Effect DLC. If you asked me, the height of Mass Effect in terms of quality, peaked with LotSB. From there it's been a steady but slow decline, and then plummets to the frozen wasteland of the 7th layer of Hell during the final few hours of ME3.

The only good things about LOTSB were the pew pew and Tela Vasir.

And the music
And the driving section
And the boss fight
And the dossiers and vids on the Shadow Broker ship

Lol, no.

Yea they were. None of these things detracted from the DLC.

[Mathias]

KaiserShep wrote...

Music mediocre? Humbug to this tomfoolery.

I've heard nothing but universal praise for LotSB until today. What did I fall into a coma and during that time the BSN decided LotSB sucks? Humbug indeed.

[KaiserShep]

Over time, everything will be replaced by hate. It makes us strong, gives us focus.

[Sir DeLoria]

Mdoggy1214 wrote...

Necanor wrote...

The driving section was boring. The music was mediocre. The boss fight was incredibly short. The dossiers were far more creepy than funny.

Not saying it was a bad dlc, I enjoyed many parts of it, but those are not its strongest points.

Driving section was great. It was a nice feature that they didn't have to add in but they did it anyway. It was cool to actually pilot a "hovercar" in a futuristic city. Loved the music, thought it fit the scenes perfectly. Dossiers were funny and interesting, not sure why you found them creepy.

Well, I thought reading through your best friends' most private information was pretty creepy. Sure, they were funny at first, but I can't really get along with the idea. The car chase scene was creative, but nothing too special. The music was alright, but it's nothing compared to the OST of the basic game.

[Sir DeLoria]

KaiserShep wrote...

Over time, everything will be replaced by hate. It makes us strong, gives us focus.

It's not hate, I just think the dlc is a little overrated. It's still the second to third best ME dlc imo, but Citadel was much, much more fun.