141 réponses à ce sujet

[Thomas Andresen]

But isn't it supposed to be part of the lore that all denizens of the Fade are fascinated by the physical world?

Justice pretty much word for word say that they pity the mortals for living in what he thinks must be such a boring place, shortly after you recruit him. Or when you recruit him. I'm not entirely sure. I also think it's more about Justice himself than spirits in general.

Later he says he could never have imagine all those sensations and impressions and seems like he'd rather stay than return to the Fade. That's my impression anyway.

[Silfren]

Lord Raijin wrote...

Silfren wrote...
No, you haven't explained it.  The deleted scene IS. NOT. CANON.  As far as the official story goes, it does not exist.  Ergo, you can't use it as evidence of anything.  Doesn't matter that it could happen, because woulda coulda shoulda, the fact remains, it didn't.

Just because it was a deleted scene does not mean that it cannot happen. Seinor Enchanters like Wynne have an obligation to report any suspicious activities of other mages to her superiors. From being possessed by demons to using blood magic. Possession is possession and blood magic is blood magic.

Not one person here has tried to change my mind by using lore in Wynne's defense. Shes an abomination just like Anders.

Did you read my comment at all?  The fact is, it DID NOT happen.  That it could have is irrelevant.  You cannot use a deleted scene to make your argument.  It's completely invalid.
 

Modifié par Silfren, 01 octobre 2013 - 03:33 .

[AresKeith]

Lord Raijin wrote...

Silfren wrote...
No, you haven't explained it.  The deleted scene IS. NOT. CANON.  As far as the official story goes, it does not exist.  Ergo, you can't use it as evidence of anything.  Doesn't matter that it could happen, because woulda coulda shoulda, the fact remains, it didn't.

Just because it was a deleted scene does not mean that it cannot happen. Seinor Enchanters like Wynne have an obligation to report any suspicious activities of other mages to her superiors. From being possessed by demons to using blood magic. Possession is possession and blood magic is blood magic.

Not one person here has tried to change my mind by using lore in Wynne's defense. Shes an abomination just like Anders.

We're not trying to change your mind, and frankly I don't care 

But your argument about Wynne being a hypocrite is invalid and irrelevent because your trying to use cut content that isn't considered canon 

Modifié par AresKeith, 01 octobre 2013 - 03:33 .

[Mr.House]

Lord Raijin wrote...

Silfren wrote...
No, you haven't explained it.  The deleted scene IS. NOT. CANON.  As far as the official story goes, it does not exist.  Ergo, you can't use it as evidence of anything.  Doesn't matter that it could happen, because woulda coulda shoulda, the fact remains, it didn't.

Just because it was a deleted scene does not mean that it cannot happen. Seinor Enchanters like Wynne have an obligation to report any suspicious activities of other mages to her superiors. From being possessed by demons to using blood magic. Possession is possession and blood magic is blood magic.

Not one person here has tried to change my mind by using lore in Wynne's defense. Shes an abomination just like Anders.

She never used blood magic at all. Nice try.

[Br3admax]

Actually, as to whether she was dead or not, I'm pretty sure she was dead. D-E-A-D. Even if she wasn't , the Templar that she brought back to life was as dead as dead can be. It would be possible.

[Silfren]

Mr.House wrote...

Lord Raijin wrote...

Silfren wrote...
No, you haven't explained it.  The deleted scene IS. NOT. CANON.  As far as the official story goes, it does not exist.  Ergo, you can't use it as evidence of anything.  Doesn't matter that it could happen, because woulda coulda shoulda, the fact remains, it didn't.

Just because it was a deleted scene does not mean that it cannot happen. Seinor Enchanters like Wynne have an obligation to report any suspicious activities of other mages to her superiors. From being possessed by demons to using blood magic. Possession is possession and blood magic is blood magic.

Not one person here has tried to change my mind by using lore in Wynne's defense. Shes an abomination just like Anders.

She never used blood magic at all. Nice try.

Somewhat off topic, one of the fun ironies about Wynne is that you COULD make her a blood mage, even if the game didn't acknowledge it and in fact argued against it.  

At least in Awakening, if you made Anders a blood mage, the game recognized it.

[Thomas Andresen]

She never used blood magic at all. Nice try.

Though I hesitate to defend this guy, I'm pretty sure that's not what he implied.

[Plaintiff]

So much for resurrection being impossible in the setting, I guess.

I don't think the specifics of Wynne's possession are really relevant. The Templars certainly didn't make the distinction when they slaughtered Rivaini seers enmasse.

Modifié par Plaintiff, 01 octobre 2013 - 03:43 .

[Mr.House]

Plaintiff wrote...

So much for resurrection being impossible in the setting, I guess.

The boat sailed along time ago.

[cjones91]

Br3ad wrote...

Actually, as to whether she was dead or not, I'm pretty sure she was dead. D-E-A-D. Even if she wasn't , the Templar that she brought back to life was as dead as dead can be. It would be possible.

Yep,being dead means your heart stops beating and everything around you starts to go black.So Wynne and Evangeline were clinically dead.

[Thomas Andresen]

Even if she wasn't , the Templar that she brought back to life was as dead as dead can be.

Did I miss something here?

[Silfren]

Br3ad wrote...

Actually, as to whether she was dead or not, I'm pretty sure she was dead. D-E-A-D. Even if she wasn't , the Templar that she brought back to life was as dead as dead can be. It would be possible.

I don't think Wynne was dead, and nothing in the game offers evidence that she was, actually, beyond Wynne's own opinion.  Then again, I'm one of those people who thinks too many people put far too much weight in the medical concept of being clinically dead and brought back.  I think you're either dead, or you're not.  

I see your point in the case of Evangeline, although it could be argued that she hadn't completely expired at that point.  There is still the sticking point that the established lore says that actual resurrection is not possible.  It could be wrong, of course, but I'd prefer a more clear-cut case of resurrection before we toss that out.  But Evangeline's story remains to be told--I'm convinced we'll see her in Inquisition.

Modifié par Silfren, 01 octobre 2013 - 03:43 .

[Silfren]

Thomas Andresen wrote...

Even if she wasn't , the Templar that she brought back to life was as dead as dead can be.

Did I miss something here?

A plot point in the book Asunder.  You want spoilers?

[Silfren]

Plaintiff wrote...

So much for resurrection being impossible in the setting, I guess.

I don't think the specifics of Wynne's possession are really relevant. The Templars certainly didn't make the distinction when they slaughtered Rivaini seers enmasse.

=/

I wonder what Vivienne will have to say about that.  From all appearances, she's ethnically Rivaini, if nationally Orlesian.

[Plaintiff]

Silfren wrote...

Plaintiff wrote...

So much for resurrection being impossible in the setting, I guess.

I don't think the specifics of Wynne's possession are really relevant. The Templars certainly didn't make the distinction when they slaughtered Rivaini seers enmasse.

=/

I wonder what Vivienne will have to say about that.  From all appearances, she's ethnically Rivaini, if nationally Orlesian.

What tidbits we've gleaned suggest to me that Vivienne is primarily concerned with her own status and wellbeing. She might not care.

[Silfren]

Plaintiff wrote...

Silfren wrote...

Plaintiff wrote...

So much for resurrection being impossible in the setting, I guess.

I don't think the specifics of Wynne's possession are really relevant. The Templars certainly didn't make the distinction when they slaughtered Rivaini seers enmasse.

=/

I wonder what Vivienne will have to say about that.  From all appearances, she's ethnically Rivaini, if nationally Orlesian.

What tidbits we've gleaned suggest to me that Vivienne is primarily concerned with her own status and wellbeing. She might not care.

Oh? I haven't looked too closely into those details.  With Inquisition at least a year out, I'm not convinced that anything we hear now will be accurate at release.

[addiction21]

cjones91 wrote...

Br3ad wrote...

Actually, as to whether she was dead or not, I'm pretty sure she was dead. D-E-A-D. Even if she wasn't , the Templar that she brought back to life was as dead as dead can be. It would be possible.

Yep,being dead means your heart stops beating and everything around you starts to go black.So Wynne and Evangeline were clinically dead.

How many times have you been "dead" to know what it is?

[Br3admax]

addiction21 wrote...

cjones91 wrote...

Br3ad wrote...

Actually, as to whether she was dead or not, I'm pretty sure she was dead. D-E-A-D. Even if she wasn't , the Templar that she brought back to life was as dead as dead can be. It would be possible.

Yep,being dead means your heart stops beating and everything around you starts to go black.So Wynne and Evangeline were clinically dead.

How many times have you been "dead" to know what it is?

Can't tell if serious....

[Br3admax]

Silfren wrote...

Br3ad wrote...

Actually, as to whether she was dead or not, I'm pretty sure she was dead. D-E-A-D. Even if she wasn't , the Templar that she brought back to life was as dead as dead can be. It would be possible.

I don't think Wynne was dead, and nothing in the game offers evidence that she was, actually, beyond Wynne's own opinion.  Then again, I'm one of those people who thinks too many people put far too much weight in the medical concept of being clinically dead and brought back.  I think you're either dead, or you're not.  

I see your point in the case of Evangeline, although it could be argued that she hadn't completely expired at that point.  There is still the sticking point that the established lore says that actual resurrection is not possible.  It could be wrong, of course, but I'd prefer a more clear-cut case of resurrection before we toss that out.  But Evangeline's story remains to be told--I'm convinced we'll see her in Inquisition.

Well maybe not brain dead, but not breathing and no pulse. Well on their way to being dead, dead. I see your point. 

[Plaintiff]

Silfren wrote...

Plaintiff wrote...

Silfren wrote...

Plaintiff wrote...

So much for resurrection being impossible in the setting, I guess.

I don't think the specifics of Wynne's possession are really relevant. The Templars certainly didn't make the distinction when they slaughtered Rivaini seers enmasse.

=/

I wonder what Vivienne will have to say about that.  From all appearances, she's ethnically Rivaini, if nationally Orlesian.

What tidbits we've gleaned suggest to me that Vivienne is primarily concerned with her own status and wellbeing. She might not care.

Oh? I haven't looked too closely into those details.  With Inquisition at least a year out, I'm not convinced that anything we hear now will be accurate at release.

Actually, I might be wrong. The DA wiki describes Vivienne as "extremely pro-Circle" and says she joins the Inquisition to "help her fellow mages however she can".

Modifié par Plaintiff, 01 octobre 2013 - 04:00 .

[cjones91]

addiction21 wrote...

cjones91 wrote...

Br3ad wrote...

Actually, as to whether she was dead or not, I'm pretty sure she was dead. D-E-A-D. Even if she wasn't , the Templar that she brought back to life was as dead as dead can be. It would be possible.

Yep,being dead means your heart stops beating and everything around you starts to go black.So Wynne and Evangeline were clinically dead.

How many times have you been "dead" to know what it is?

You're joking right?Being dead means your heart stops pumping blood and major organs start shutting down.Both Wynne and Evangeline were dead since their hearts stopped for several minutes before being revived.

[wolfhowwl]

If getting rid of Jowan was a mistake it is one I hope Bioware repeats.

[Silfren]

cjones91 wrote...

addiction21 wrote...

cjones91 wrote...

Br3ad wrote...

Actually, as to whether she was dead or not, I'm pretty sure she was dead. D-E-A-D. Even if she wasn't , the Templar that she brought back to life was as dead as dead can be. It would be possible.

Yep,being dead means your heart stops beating and everything around you starts to go black.So Wynne and Evangeline were clinically dead.

How many times have you been "dead" to know what it is?

You're joking right?Being dead means your heart stops pumping blood and major organs start shutting down.Both Wynne and Evangeline were dead since their hearts stopped for several minutes before being revived.

Er.  We have no idea how long Wynne's heart was stopped, or even if it was.  Evangeline is a different story, since her heart didn't so much stop beating as get stabbed completely through, but in Wynne's case, you're making that up.

[Lord Raijin]

Mr.House wrote...

Lord Raijin wrote...

Silfren wrote...
No, you haven't explained it.  The deleted scene IS. NOT. CANON.  As far as the official story goes, it does not exist.  Ergo, you can't use it as evidence of anything.  Doesn't matter that it could happen, because woulda coulda shoulda, the fact remains, it didn't.

Just because it was a deleted scene does not mean that it cannot happen. Seinor Enchanters like Wynne have an obligation to report any suspicious activities of other mages to her superiors. From being possessed by demons to using blood magic. Possession is possession and blood magic is blood magic.

Not one person here has tried to change my mind by using lore in Wynne's defense. Shes an abomination just like Anders.

She never used blood magic at all. Nice try.

At least Jowan didn't get himself all possesed out. Wynne is a walking zombie.

[Silfren]

Lord Raijin wrote...

Mr.House wrote...

Lord Raijin wrote...

Silfren wrote...
No, you haven't explained it.  The deleted scene IS. NOT. CANON.  As far as the official story goes, it does not exist.  Ergo, you can't use it as evidence of anything.  Doesn't matter that it could happen, because woulda coulda shoulda, the fact remains, it didn't.

Just because it was a deleted scene does not mean that it cannot happen. Seinor Enchanters like Wynne have an obligation to report any suspicious activities of other mages to her superiors. From being possessed by demons to using blood magic. Possession is possession and blood magic is blood magic.

Not one person here has tried to change my mind by using lore in Wynne's defense. Shes an abomination just like Anders.

She never used blood magic at all. Nice try.

At least Jowan didn't get himself all possesed out. Wynne is a walking zombie.

Once again, by all appearances, it was something the spirit did to Wynne, not something that Wynne outright asked for.  Based on what Wynne tells the Warden, even if you could argue that she willingly accepted help from the spirit, it doesn't mean that Wynne knew precisely what was going to happen.  You're trying to say that Wynne made a deal the spirit in exactly the same way that Anders made a deal with Justice, and that very clearly is NOT the case at all.  Whether she was actually dead or not, Wynne was definitely on the brink of death and not exactly in control of the situation.