250 réponses à ce sujet

[Silfren]

Cthulhu42 wrote...

J. Reezy wrote...

Chashan wrote...

Gerry ending up with Triss in bed at the beginning of TW2 isn't and has me grumbling somewhat, though.

Why is that even an issue?

From my understanding, you could play the first game without being with Triss at the end, so TW2 establishing Geralt with her is essentially a retcon for players who played otherwise.

Not being a PC player though, I haven't actually gotten to play TW1, so I don't know for sure.

I think what happens is that if you go with Shani, TW2 is written so that Shani decides Geralt isn't capable of maintaining a healthy, mature relationship and so she leaves him, and he ends up back with Triss.  I can understand why this would make Shani-mancers uphappy, but I think it's a fairly well handled retcon.  Haven't been able to play TW2 yet because my computer refused to play it beyond the opening scene, but I really enjoyed TW1.

[I SOLD MY SOUL TO BIOWARE]

The Hierophant wrote...

Anyone have a suspicion that if he played TW that he'd probably like Siegfried?

Siegried was the bro of all bros.

[jaza]

SergeantSnookie wrote...

The Hierophant wrote...

Anyone have a suspicion that if he played TW that he'd probably like Siegfried?

Siegried was the bro of all bros.

Yeah. Too bad he dosent have the same voice as the had in 1. I loved that voice.

[I SOLD MY SOUL TO BIOWARE]

jaza wrote...

SergeantSnookie wrote...

The Hierophant wrote...

Anyone have a suspicion that if he played TW that he'd probably like Siegfried?

Siegried was the bro of all bros.

Yeah. Too bad he dosent have the same voice as the had in 1. I loved that voice.

I've never played the English version of either Witchers, but he had Hawke's voice in TW2 didn't he? :S

[Chashan]

J. Reezy wrote...

Ah, I see. I wasn't even sure that's what Chashan was getting at. It came off as a "nudity has no place in video games, if it's there it's porn" kind of post.

That wasn't what I was getting at, no.

I was pointing that one instance out as one, it's awkwardly placed at the very beginning of TW2, and two does forego the mentioned establishment of Geralt's relationship in TW1. Which is my key concern there.

It wasn't even on the more explicit side of things, those segments_were_one and all strictly optional. So if the developers keep that kind of optional approach to this up and avoid another lock-in of who Geralt's with at the start of TW3, I am good.

krul2k wrote...

The question is what inspiration could DAI get from Spec OP's the Line, now there a story worthy of any game trying to emulate

No argument there. The mood they seem to be pushing for TW3's war-time scenario could work out well for some content where there's no way of coming through as a 'hero' at the end.

[BouncyFrag]

krul2k wrote...

The question is what inspiration could DAI get from Spec OP's the Line, now there a story worthy of any game trying to emulate

I had to manually close my jaw after the phosphorus bit. Much more shocking than anders blowing up the chantry.

[Seboist]

SergeantSnookie wrote...

jaza wrote...

SergeantSnookie wrote...

The Hierophant wrote...

Anyone have a suspicion that if he played TW that he'd probably like Siegfried?

Siegried was the bro of all bros.

Yeah. Too bad he dosent have the same voice as the had in 1. I loved that voice.

I've never played the English version of either Witchers, but he had Hawke's voice in TW2 didn't he? :S

Yes.

[The Hierophant]

BouncyFrag wrote...

krul2k wrote...

The question is what inspiration could DAI get from Spec OP's the Line, now there a story worthy of any game trying to emulate

I had to manually close my jaw after the phosphorus bit. Much more shocking than anders blowing up the chantry.

This, along with the inferred fate of Dubai's survivors after the water heist.

[Allan Schumacher]

Locking this thread. Almost 13 full pages, and the multitude of posts discussing The Witcher's relevance fueled by basically two sides that are not willing to disengage (despite acknowledging that they should) is the type of thing that makes me angry and very frustrated.

However, the general idea of the thread is fine enough, so I'll reopen after The Culling™.

[Allan Schumacher]

Reopening the thread.  Please do not make me regret it

In general I have no problem with a thread like this.  I wouldn't be surprised if there is some pretty decent overlap between fans of both franchises and studios, which I think is just fine.


As for some things to consider:

When discussing the popularity of the game, recognize that you will have an affilitation with people that have similar interests to you.  This will distort your perspective.  As such, I'm much more exposed to BioWare games than I am to CDPR games (for rather obvious reasons, I hope >.>), so I can recognize that my opinion on who is "more popular" is very likely not accurate.

For all intents and purposes, The Witcher 2 is a very successful game.  It has sold pretty well (I haven't fact checked the numbers mentioned in this thread, but if they're north of 3 million that's pretty great).

If The Witcher is "passed by" it's likely only because BioWare has a longer history, and would have been heard of by people that don't play our games simply because we've had some big games.  Given that fun RPGs aren't exactly coming out with monthly releases though, I'm glad there's another developer bringing more to the table for us to eat.

I shared my thoughts on The Witcher games, and was very flattered when a dev chimed in to say thank you when I complimented TW2's cinematics.  I was flattered because they had mentioned that Mass Effect 2 as their goal, and knew it'd be hard to achieve.  In that sense, I think the level of competition perceived between BioWare and CDPR is more in the eyes of the fans.  I know one dev at CDPR through a different forum, and he seems like a pretty a-ok guy to me.


Some general, more moderator themed comments.  If a poster is aggravating you, don't engage.  It'll likely only solicit further comments from said poster, which will likely only cause further aggravation.  This goes double if you genuinely think the poster is trolling, because responding is just what the poster wants you to do.  While I am more than guilty of thinking Duty Calls in my past, rarely will either party convince the other and it ends up derailing the thread.  I deleted 4 pages worth of posts that I considered mostly irrelevant to this thread and in many cases unnecessary and silly.  It became "arguing to win" which really isn't productive, and both sides were to blame.

Second point, if you wish to engage in an actual discussion, at no point should you declare your perspective the obvious truth.  No matter how much you may think it is, someone with a different perspective is also going to think theirs is the truth.  Why?  Because if they didn't think it was the truth, they wouldn't believe it.  Have some humility, and even if you adamantly disagree with someone's perspective, learn to disengage rather than having both people smash their heads up against each other's walls.  Butting heads undoubtedly leads to escalation, which leads to more direct insult types of posts, to which I end up having to implement the ban hammer.  And this thing is +5 with very little immunities against it.  I also prefer to NOT ban people.  Having some humility and recognizing that your perspective is unique to you, and may have faults, is what I would consider a very mature perspective in interacting with different people with all sorts of backgrounds.  I will give virtual cookies from time to time when I see this.


Discuss the game, and compare, which is fine.  If you don't think DAI can benefit from The Witcher, that's fine.  Be respectful to those that think there are some aspects that they may like.  It's not a competition and the idea of speaking loudly to make sure BioWare doesn't go "oh wow, look at all this support" isn't necessary.  And 100% vice versa as well.

Thanks.

Allan

[DarthSideus2]

Blackrising wrote...

None, as far as I'm concerned.
The Witcher just doesn't click with me. At all. I recently gave The Witcher 2 another try and it.simply.doesn't.work. I can't play it.
I hate Gerald, I hate the dialouges, I hate the world, I hate the atmosphere, I hate the combat, I hate the graphics.
I can't even tell you exactly why I don't like it, it just doesn't do it for me.

So I'd prefer it if DA stuck to their own style and, if they do take some inspiration from The Witcher or other RPGs, modify it and make it their own.

This.

[slimgrin]

Now there's a man that has made up his mind. Developers stealing ideas is mostly a good thing imo.

[Dominus]

Developers stealing ideas is mostly a good thing imo.

There is a distinct difference between imitation and inspiration. How many genre-changing games would exist without deriving new ideas from the old? Or I may be taking that comment the wrong way, in which case I apologize.

As far as inspiration that could be taken from the Witcher, I would say first and foremost, the Choice & Consequence in the second of the series. Other minor gameplay pieces under the hood like a more convenient alchemy on-the-go system wouldn't hurt. Other than that, nothing is coming to mind, really. Actually, a somewhat more realistic portrayal of romance scenes. Most of the encounters in the game couldn't be considered more than casual sex, but it seemed less cheeseball and more like a genuine bond between 2 lovers.

Modifié par DominusVita, 06 octobre 2013 - 01:36 .

[duckley]

KiwiQuiche wrote...

The Witcher is crap. I have no idea why some people use it as the pinnacle of RPG.

There, I said it.

Just curious about what you didnt like about the game.?

[Deverz]

I'm not a big fan of The Witcher but something I think it excels at is the morally gray characters that I can understand and empathize with, even if I don't agree with their motives. Some Dragon Age antagonists tend to be hit with the looney-stick a little too often.

Modifié par Deverz, 06 octobre 2013 - 12:29 .

[aries1001]

I already thing the DA universe has taken some clues from the Witcher games and are inspired by them. The most important thing seems to be the DA's take on dwarven and elven culture, and of course, also how these are portrayed to the player. My first playthrough of DA: Origins was as Dalish elf (warrior), now playing as an elven mage, I can tell that the DA universe surely must have been inspried by the Wicther games take in dwarfs and elves.

Dwarfs have their own culture in the DA universe, Dalish and City elves also have their own culture. In the Witcher games, dwarves also have their own culture, as does the elves. And both the dwarfs and the elves aren't the standard types of klichee elves or dwarfes, we've come to know (mostly in the D&D and Tolkien universe) The same is true, imo, for the DA universe. The city elves are looked down upon by everyone, the Dalish elves even look down upon the city elf.
And and as elf I can tell the Revered Mother in Lothering to go jump in a lake - not that exact wording, but I can tell her that the I don't believe in the Maker, I think? and something about oppression of my (elven) people etc.

I'm hoping that Bioware will be inspired by the political plot of the Witcher 2 as well as Geralt's ability to say, nope, not gonna happen, I'll just back away from it all. This was an option I felt was missing in DA2's endgame, you had to choose sides. And then, it didn't matter which side you chose, you had to fight both Templars and Mages in the end. I hope Bioware takes a cue from the Witcher 2 when it comes to make two different and distinctive paths to play through the game.

I like both the Witcher games, and the DA games (many of us do, I find). But for different reasons. It is, as someone said, a matter of comparing apples and oranges or even bananas and apples. I like them equallt both but at different times depending on what I need. [I also like the Bioschock games, adventure games like Keepsake, the Sherlock Holmes games, and I play Call of Duty occasionally, Halo and Far Cry as well]. The point being this:

I like Witcher and DA games, but for different reasons. I like that Geralt in the Witcher games are more of a realistic type of character, I also like that he only has two swords, and that it takes him forever to get better equipment. I like the political implications in the Witcher games and that Geralt somehow gets wrangled up in them.
[I believe that this was what Bioware wanted to do in DA2, but simply didn't have time enough to execute/design/implement well in the timeframe established to finish the game]. I, also, play the Witcher games for the story, the characters, and yes, the monsters, both human and those in the swamp/marsh.

Bioware games I play for the the banter between companions, the tactical/strategical combat, the story, the characters, the world and the partybased combat. It seems to me that Bioware is the nearly the one out there doing partybased rpg games these days. I, for one, hope, it stays this way. I certainly don't play Bioware games for the cinematics (but is is nice to see something which is goodloking and well crafted, though) nor do I play for the gameplay or the ability to spend 1 hour selling and buying wares to merchants out of 2 hours I've just played. [Hint: please do something about the horrible pathfinding issue....]

[Aolbain]

^ The similarity's are clear but the dates doesn't hold up. When The Witcher was published 2007 Origins had already been in development for several years.

Deverz wrote...

I'm not a big fan of The Witcher but something I think it excels at is the morally gray characters that I can understand and empathize with, even if I don't agree with their motives. Some Dragon Age antagonists tend to be hit with the looney-stick a little too often.

Indeed. That one thing I feel Bioware could take from CDPR is their villains. Hell, some points could be taken from their plots as a whole. Plots in Bioware games degrades into "and then the evily insane/insanely evil people came and tried to kill everyone" depressingly often. 

Modifié par Aolbain, 06 octobre 2013 - 12:46 .

[Reaverwind]

Aolbain wrote...

^ The similarity's are clear but the dates doesn't hold up. When The Witcher was published 2007 Origins had already been in development for several years.

Deverz wrote...

I'm not a big fan of The Witcher but something I think it excels at is the morally gray characters that I can understand and empathize with, even if I don't agree with their motives. Some Dragon Age antagonists tend to be hit with the looney-stick a little too often.

Indeed. That one thing I feel Bioware could take from CDPR is their villains. Hell, some points could be taken from their plots as a whole. Plots in Bioware games degrades into "and then the evily insane/insanely evil people came and tried to kill everyone" depressingly often. 

I think that is the one thing Bioware could take away from TW2 - how to write believeable conflicts without devolving them into looney #1 vs looney #2.

[Allan Schumacher]

There is a distinct difference between imitation and inspiration. How many genre-changing games would exist without deriving new ideas from the old? Or I may be taking that comment the wrong way, in which case I apologize.

Innovation is absolutely important. But at the same time if a game effectively makes improvements to existing systems, I think other games undermine themselves if they obstinately stick with something that is clearly inferior.

(I use the word obstinately because I mean as a deliberate design choice. Sometimes there are reasons which can delay/complicate making these types of changes).

[AresKeith]

slimgrin wrote...

Now there's a man that has made up his mind. Developers stealing ideas is mostly a good thing imo.

But it's not really stealing, they look at other games as a way to improve of certain aspect

[slimgrin]

AresKeith wrote...

slimgrin wrote...

Now there's a man that has made up his mind. Developers stealing ideas is mostly a good thing imo.

But it's not really stealing, they look at other games as a way to improve of certain aspect

That's what I mean. I think the video game industry is shameless in the sheer amount of hijacking that goes on. But it also leads to much faster innovation. It used to bug the hell out of me, now I embrace an idea that has been stolen yet improved upon. Although I'd hope Bioware can show they innovate rather than inserting ideas from other games, something they have been guilty of in the past. 

Modifié par slimgrin, 06 octobre 2013 - 01:47 .