816 réponses à ce sujet

[Mecha Elf]

The romance in DA:O was perfecto, a little too fast, but perfect nonetheless. The scenes for the sex though...... not so much. Anyway i liked the way bioware was going to do the scenes, short & sweet. While I don't think they should spend an incredible amount of money onr the scenes that that's already set in stone. And the dude could just be saying this just because and have it be the exact opposite in the game

[MissCurlsbel]

CynicalShep wrote...

MissCurlsbel wrote...

CynicalShep wrote...

MissCurlsbel wrote...

The problem is a lot of people do the whole romancing, specifically BECAUSE of the sex scenes and the nudity. These become an issue when they only serve to pursue pornographic tastes.

If sex scenes are shown in a way that they are NOT the main objective of romancing a LI, maybe nudity and sex will stop being an issue then!

There is no such way. Whoever is a pervert and plays the game for the porn will either go on rule34 or download a nude mod of Nexus. The rest of the people will play it like they always did. We're all (well, most of us) adults here who saw much more than that video-game is ever going to have in real life. Fade to black isn't really that big an issue (for me, at least) but seeing Traynor taking a shower in her clothes literally made me get off my computer and get a drink - it's hilariously stupid and childish. 

Traynor takes a shower in her clothes? I actually didn't even know about that. They shouldn't have included that scene then, since that does sound quite a bit ridiculous

As for the sex scenes being important or not, fact is that they take up a majority of the "romance time" you have with a character. I find that making the LIs do and say things to show you are cared about is a lot more important to the romance and relationship between the characters rather then giving sex scenes as the "prize" for investing your time into the LIs.

Yes, she does.
And I agree that the dialogue is more important if it's well written, but there is nothing wrong with a tasteful scene. In fact, it adds to the experience. 


Also, what Darth Krytie said. I never actually romanced Traynor myself but I've seen the scene. It's cringe-worthy. I'll take fade to black and bad porn music over that idiocy. 

I agree a tasteful scene will add to the experience. I just don't believe that making it the most important and time grabbing thing out of the whole romance story is a good thing at all. It just keeps feeding the whole "female characters in videogames are a prize to be had" thing.

Sex sells. I know that. But if you want to make a game about this then make a porn game, don't just chuck sex into a story driven AAA title just for the hell of it.

[Mathias]

MissCurlsbel wrote...

CynicalShep wrote...

MissCurlsbel wrote...

CynicalShep wrote...

MissCurlsbel wrote...

The problem is a lot of people do the whole romancing, specifically BECAUSE of the sex scenes and the nudity. These become an issue when they only serve to pursue pornographic tastes.

If sex scenes are shown in a way that they are NOT the main objective of romancing a LI, maybe nudity and sex will stop being an issue then!

There is no such way. Whoever is a pervert and plays the game for the porn will either go on rule34 or download a nude mod of Nexus. The rest of the people will play it like they always did. We're all (well, most of us) adults here who saw much more than that video-game is ever going to have in real life. Fade to black isn't really that big an issue (for me, at least) but seeing Traynor taking a shower in her clothes literally made me get off my computer and get a drink - it's hilariously stupid and childish. 

Traynor takes a shower in her clothes? I actually didn't even know about that. They shouldn't have included that scene then, since that does sound quite a bit ridiculous

As for the sex scenes being important or not, fact is that they take up a majority of the "romance time" you have with a character. I find that making the LIs do and say things to show you are cared about is a lot more important to the romance and relationship between the characters rather then giving sex scenes as the "prize" for investing your time into the LIs.

Yes, she does.
And I agree that the dialogue is more important if it's well written, but there is nothing wrong with a tasteful scene. In fact, it adds to the experience. 


Also, what Darth Krytie said. I never actually romanced Traynor myself but I've seen the scene. It's cringe-worthy. I'll take fade to black and bad porn music over that idiocy. 

I agree a tasteful scene will add to the experience. I just don't believe that making it the most important and time grabbing thing out of the whole romance story is a good thing at all. It just keeps feeding the whole "female characters in videogames are a prize to be had" thing.

Sex sells. I know that. But if you want to make a game about this then make a porn game, don't just chuck sex into a story driven AAA title just for the hell of it.

But there are men in the game that you can romance, so I have to disagree with this, among other reasons.

[eelostryker]

Do we get to hear any Sexual climaxes during a certain sex scene between a Inquisitor, a LI, or even a p********e in a bro**el?

[MissCurlsbel]

Mdoggy1214 wrote...

MissCurlsbel wrote...

CynicalShep wrote...

MissCurlsbel wrote...

CynicalShep wrote...

MissCurlsbel wrote...

The problem is a lot of people do the whole romancing, specifically BECAUSE of the sex scenes and the nudity. These become an issue when they only serve to pursue pornographic tastes.

If sex scenes are shown in a way that they are NOT the main objective of romancing a LI, maybe nudity and sex will stop being an issue then!

There is no such way. Whoever is a pervert and plays the game for the porn will either go on rule34 or download a nude mod of Nexus. The rest of the people will play it like they always did. We're all (well, most of us) adults here who saw much more than that video-game is ever going to have in real life. Fade to black isn't really that big an issue (for me, at least) but seeing Traynor taking a shower in her clothes literally made me get off my computer and get a drink - it's hilariously stupid and childish. 

Traynor takes a shower in her clothes? I actually didn't even know about that. They shouldn't have included that scene then, since that does sound quite a bit ridiculous

As for the sex scenes being important or not, fact is that they take up a majority of the "romance time" you have with a character. I find that making the LIs do and say things to show you are cared about is a lot more important to the romance and relationship between the characters rather then giving sex scenes as the "prize" for investing your time into the LIs.

Yes, she does.
And I agree that the dialogue is more important if it's well written, but there is nothing wrong with a tasteful scene. In fact, it adds to the experience. 


Also, what Darth Krytie said. I never actually romanced Traynor myself but I've seen the scene. It's cringe-worthy. I'll take fade to black and bad porn music over that idiocy. 

I agree a tasteful scene will add to the experience. I just don't believe that making it the most important and time grabbing thing out of the whole romance story is a good thing at all. It just keeps feeding the whole "female characters in videogames are a prize to be had" thing.

Sex sells. I know that. But if you want to make a game about this then make a porn game, don't just chuck sex into a story driven AAA title just for the hell of it.

But there are men in the game that you can romance, so I have to disagree with this, among other reasons.

Wow, that did sound a bit feminist, I'm sorry about that, I meant no disrespect . I meant, BOTH men and women in videogames should stop being treated as sex objects, ESPECIALLY by their creators.

We have enough people twisting these characters on the internet already. No need to make it cannon UNLESS the character is meant to be shown in such a way (look at Isabela in DAII for example). Unless it serves a logical and perfectly reasonable purpose, I just find it stupid. But that's my opinion anyways...

[CynicalShep]

MissCurlsbel wrote...

I agree a tasteful scene will add to the experience. I just don't believe that making it the most important and time grabbing thing out of the whole romance story is a good thing at all. It just keeps feeding the whole "female characters in videogames are a prize to be had" thing.

Sex sells. I know that. But if you want to make a game about this then make a porn game, don't just chuck sex into a story driven AAA title just for the hell of it.

I don't think anyone is arguing that making it the most important is a good thing. Like I already said - good dialogue and a good plot are much more important to a story. Problem isn't that they can't allocate the resources, it's that they keep trying to please all the tabloid hacks and femi****s on this planet and it leads to scenes like Traynor's shower scene. I'd rather have absolutely no nudity than have to handwave anything like that again. And men undress just like women, I don't see where you got the whole "prize to be had" thing. Sarkeesian is a scam and a fraud, I wouldn't put too much thought into something she clearly didn't put much effort in. 

Modifié par CynicalShep, 15 octobre 2013 - 03:11 .

[Demx]

Similar to Mass Effect's love scene? Don't you mean Austin Powers: International Man of Mystery?

Modifié par Siradix, 15 octobre 2013 - 03:21 .

[ScarMK]

eelostryker wrote...

Do we get to hear any Sexual climaxes during a certain sex scene between a Inquisitor, a LI, or even a p********e in a bro**el?

Repeating that terrible one liner wasn't funny the first time, it won't be a second time.

[Mathias]

MissCurlsbel wrote...

Mdoggy1214 wrote...

MissCurlsbel wrote...

CynicalShep wrote...

MissCurlsbel wrote...

CynicalShep wrote...

MissCurlsbel wrote...

The problem is a lot of people do the whole romancing, specifically BECAUSE of the sex scenes and the nudity. These become an issue when they only serve to pursue pornographic tastes.

If sex scenes are shown in a way that they are NOT the main objective of romancing a LI, maybe nudity and sex will stop being an issue then!

There is no such way. Whoever is a pervert and plays the game for the porn will either go on rule34 or download a nude mod of Nexus. The rest of the people will play it like they always did. We're all (well, most of us) adults here who saw much more than that video-game is ever going to have in real life. Fade to black isn't really that big an issue (for me, at least) but seeing Traynor taking a shower in her clothes literally made me get off my computer and get a drink - it's hilariously stupid and childish. 

Traynor takes a shower in her clothes? I actually didn't even know about that. They shouldn't have included that scene then, since that does sound quite a bit ridiculous

As for the sex scenes being important or not, fact is that they take up a majority of the "romance time" you have with a character. I find that making the LIs do and say things to show you are cared about is a lot more important to the romance and relationship between the characters rather then giving sex scenes as the "prize" for investing your time into the LIs.

Yes, she does.
And I agree that the dialogue is more important if it's well written, but there is nothing wrong with a tasteful scene. In fact, it adds to the experience. 


Also, what Darth Krytie said. I never actually romanced Traynor myself but I've seen the scene. It's cringe-worthy. I'll take fade to black and bad porn music over that idiocy. 

I agree a tasteful scene will add to the experience. I just don't believe that making it the most important and time grabbing thing out of the whole romance story is a good thing at all. It just keeps feeding the whole "female characters in videogames are a prize to be had" thing.

Sex sells. I know that. But if you want to make a game about this then make a porn game, don't just chuck sex into a story driven AAA title just for the hell of it.

But there are men in the game that you can romance, so I have to disagree with this, among other reasons.

Wow, that did sound a bit feminist, I'm sorry about that, I meant no disrespect . I meant, BOTH men and women in videogames should stop being treated as sex objects, ESPECIALLY by their creators.

We have enough people twisting these characters on the internet already. No need to make it cannon UNLESS the character is meant to be shown in such a way (look at Isabela in DAII for example). Unless it serves a logical and perfectly reasonable purpose, I just find it stupid. But that's my opinion anyways...

It's ok you don't have to apologize lol. But in Bioware's case I don't agree that they're treating their characters as sex objects. As David Gaider said, romancing and sex is a minor part in their games. Their writers all have passion for the characters they create. Look at characters such as Alistair, Garrus, Tali, Liara, or Morrigan. Can you really say their creators reverted them to nothing but sex objects just because your can  become intimate with them?

I romanced Ashley in Mass Effect and I can probably name 10 things I admired about her, before even saying how attractive I thought she was. Same thing for Liara.




EDIT: On a side note I'm not gonna ignore the sexualization of some of these characters that happened in later games. However this sort of thing came off as more of an influence by EA. We know sex sells, and EA wants to achieve as many sales is possible. It's entirely possible it was Bioware's decisions to "upgrade" Ashley in many different ways, but I'm not inclined to believe that.

Modifié par Mdoggy1214, 15 octobre 2013 - 03:26 .

[Xilizhra]

Wow, that did sound a bit feminist, I'm sorry about that, I meant no disrespect

Never apologize for this. Feminism is not a bad thing.

[Reznore57]

Xilizhra wrote...

Wow, that did sound a bit feminist, I'm sorry about that, I meant no disrespect

Never apologize for this. Feminism is not a bad thing.

I agree.

[Br3admax]

Xilizhra wrote...

Wow, that did sound a bit feminist, I'm sorry about that, I meant no disrespect

Never apologize for this. Feminism is not a bad thing.

The point is once again missed. 

[Gwydden]

Xilizhra wrote...

Wow, that did sound a bit feminist, I'm sorry about that, I meant no disrespect

Never apologize for this. Feminism is not a bad thing.

I hate these sort of semantical arguments. Hembrism, then? Whatever you call it, no, it's not a good thing. Not sending bad vibes here, I'm trying to be reasonable.

[CynicalShep]

Reznore57 wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...

Wow, that did sound a bit feminist, I'm sorry about that, I meant no disrespect

Never apologize for this. Feminism is not a bad thing.

I agree.

Modern day feminism or what feminism originally stood for? If the first - I disagree, if the second - I'm all for it 
(male here)

[Angrywolves]

I kinda wish the naysayers would just get over it
Who are they trying to convince ? The players who like romances should just do porn argument .
They may have.
Or maybe they don't like porn and prefer a romance .
The romance includes sex. So that's it.
Bioware decided to give the romance fans what they wanted.
Nonsense statements about porn change nothing.
People who don't like romance don't have to do them.
The sex should stop being the main objective is ludicrous.
Sex is a consequences of a real genuine romance, imo and isn't the main objective .
But it's there.
Players who hate romances wanting to purge them from can't force Bioware to stop doing them by saying romance fans are overpreoccupied with sex, or Bioware is wasting time and resources best spent elsewhere, or Bioware should just use fade to black ( hint romance fans don't want fade to black imo).
So Bioware has told us what the romances are going to be, so the naysayers need to move on to something else.

[Xilizhra]

Gwydden wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...

Wow, that did sound a bit feminist, I'm sorry about that, I meant no disrespect

Never apologize for this. Feminism is not a bad thing.

I hate these sort of semantical arguments. Hembrism, then? Whatever you call it, no, it's not a good thing. Not sending bad vibes here, I'm trying to be reasonable.

That's not a semantic argument at all, they mean entirely different things.

[Br3admax]

CynicalShep wrote...

Reznore57 wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...

Wow, that did sound a bit feminist, I'm sorry about that, I meant no disrespect

Never apologize for this. Feminism is not a bad thing.

I agree.

Modern day feminism or what feminism originally stood for? If the first - I disagree, if the second - I'm all for it 
(male here)

Agreed. 

[Mathias]

Angrywolves wrote...

I kinda wish the naysayers would just get over it
Who are they trying to convince ? The players who like romances should just do porn argument .
They may have.
Or maybe they don't like porn and prefer a romance .
The romance includes sex. So that's it.
Bioware decided to give the romance fans what they wanted.
Nonsense statements about porn change nothing.
People who don't like romance don't have to do them.
The sex should stop being the main objective is ludicrous.
Sex is a consequences of a real genuine romance, imo and isn't the main objective .
But it's there.
Players who hate romances wanting to purge them from can't force Bioware to stop doing them by saying romance fans are overpreoccupied with sex, or Bioware is wasting time and resources best spent elsewhere, or Bioware should just use fade to black ( hint romance fans don't want fade to black imo).
So Bioware has told us what the romances are going to be, so the naysayers need to move on to something else.

OMFG

So.....much.....truth....in one post...

I can't take it! It's too overwhelming. The reason! The pure pwnage!

[Gwydden]

Mdoggy1214 wrote...

It's ok you don't have to apologize lol. But in Bioware's case I don't agree that they're treating their characters as sex objects. As David Gaider said, romancing and sex is a minor part in their games. Their writers all have passion for the characters they create. Look at characters such as Alistair, Garrus, Tali, Liara, or Morrigan. Can you really say their creators reverted them to nothing but sex objects just because your can  become intimate with them?

I romanced Ashley in Mass Effect and I can probably name 10 things I admired about her, before even saying how attractive I thought she was. Same thing for Liara.

EDIT: On a side note I'm not gonna ignore the sexualization of some of these characters that happened in later games. However this sort of thing came off as more of an influence by EA. We know sex sells, and EA wants to achieve as many sales is possible. It's entirely possible it was Bioware's decisions to "upgrade" Ashley in many different ways, but I'm not inclined to believe that.

I don't believe the need for love/sex scenes for the developpers is an attempt to make the characters possessions, but simply a matter of convenience. You could reduce the romance to dialogue, and have the love scene be a given, but then the confirmation/culmination of the romance is not felt. It's this scene that makes you say "yeah, they're in a romance". If it is omitted, it might just seem a very tender friendship, and if the just mention that it happened, without as much as the preview... well, let's just say that this is one of those times were is better to show than to tell.

As for certain characters getting prettied up for eye candy, well, this happens in any sort of storetelling media. People, even unconsciusly, like reading about and seing beautiful people. It may come off as fan service and cheap marketing, but then, pretty much everything in the game is.

[Xilizhra]

CynicalShep wrote...

Reznore57 wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...

Wow, that did sound a bit feminist, I'm sorry about that, I meant no disrespect

Never apologize for this. Feminism is not a bad thing.

I agree.

Modern day feminism or what feminism originally stood for? If the first - I disagree, if the second - I'm all for it 
(male here)

The vast majority of modern feminism is perfectly fine, but media sources like inflating the crazy ones.

[Allan Schumacher]

Rawgrim wrote...

I don`t see why a sex scene would cost more than a regular cutscene, to be honest.

Characters interacting and touching makes the scenes a lot more challenging with respect to things like clipping and so forth.

[Gwydden]

Xilizhra wrote...

Gwydden wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...

Wow, that did sound a bit feminist, I'm sorry about that, I meant no disrespect

Never apologize for this. Feminism is not a bad thing.

I hate these sort of semantical arguments. Hembrism, then? Whatever you call it, no, it's not a good thing. Not sending bad vibes here, I'm trying to be reasonable.

That's not a semantic argument at all, they mean entirely different things.

The intent was rather clear, don't you think? But I'll leave it at that.

[Allan Schumacher]

Knight of Dane wrote...

jaza wrote...

The romances are something many fans love (and demand) in biowares games.

Which just goes to show how laughable most Bioware fans are.

According to you. I think people should just appreciate what they like and keep their judgement of others out of it. It doesn't belong in this debate wether or not you think people feel the right way.

I agree.  Lets not trash on people because they like different stuff out of their video games.

[MissCurlsbel]

Mdoggy1214 wrote...

MissCurlsbel wrote...

Mdoggy1214 wrote...

MissCurlsbel wrote...

CynicalShep wrote...

MissCurlsbel wrote...

CynicalShep wrote...

MissCurlsbel wrote...

The problem is a lot of people do the whole romancing, specifically BECAUSE of the sex scenes and the nudity. These become an issue when they only serve to pursue pornographic tastes.

If sex scenes are shown in a way that they are NOT the main objective of romancing a LI, maybe nudity and sex will stop being an issue then!

There is no such way. Whoever is a pervert and plays the game for the porn will either go on rule34 or download a nude mod of Nexus. The rest of the people will play it like they always did. We're all (well, most of us) adults here who saw much more than that video-game is ever going to have in real life. Fade to black isn't really that big an issue (for me, at least) but seeing Traynor taking a shower in her clothes literally made me get off my computer and get a drink - it's hilariously stupid and childish. 

Traynor takes a shower in her clothes? I actually didn't even know about that. They shouldn't have included that scene then, since that does sound quite a bit ridiculous

As for the sex scenes being important or not, fact is that they take up a majority of the "romance time" you have with a character. I find that making the LIs do and say things to show you are cared about is a lot more important to the romance and relationship between the characters rather then giving sex scenes as the "prize" for investing your time into the LIs.

Yes, she does.
And I agree that the dialogue is more important if it's well written, but there is nothing wrong with a tasteful scene. In fact, it adds to the experience. 


Also, what Darth Krytie said. I never actually romanced Traynor myself but I've seen the scene. It's cringe-worthy. I'll take fade to black and bad porn music over that idiocy. 

I agree a tasteful scene will add to the experience. I just don't believe that making it the most important and time grabbing thing out of the whole romance story is a good thing at all. It just keeps feeding the whole "female characters in videogames are a prize to be had" thing.

Sex sells. I know that. But if you want to make a game about this then make a porn game, don't just chuck sex into a story driven AAA title just for the hell of it.

But there are men in the game that you can romance, so I have to disagree with this, among other reasons.

Wow, that did sound a bit feminist, I'm sorry about that, I meant no disrespect . I meant, BOTH men and women in videogames should stop being treated as sex objects, ESPECIALLY by their creators.

We have enough people twisting these characters on the internet already. No need to make it cannon UNLESS the character is meant to be shown in such a way (look at Isabela in DAII for example). Unless it serves a logical and perfectly reasonable purpose, I just find it stupid. But that's my opinion anyways...

It's ok you don't have to apologize lol. But in Bioware's case I don't agree that they're treating their characters as sex objects. As David Gaider said, romancing and sex is a minor part in their games. Their writers all have passion for the characters they create. Look at characters such as Alistair, Garrus, Tali, Liara, or Morrigan. Can you really say their creators reverted them to nothing but sex objects just because your can  become intimate with them?

I romanced Ashley in Mass Effect and I can probably name 10 things I admired about her, before even saying how attractive I thought she was. Same thing for Liara.




EDIT: On a side note I'm not gonna ignore the sexualization of some of these characters that happened in later games. However this sort of thing came off as more of an influence by EA. We know sex sells, and EA wants to achieve as many sales is possible. It's entirely possible it was Bioware's decisions to "upgrade" Ashley in many different ways, but I'm not inclined to believe that.

I see what you mean but I can't help but notice that the climax for all romances always revolves around the love scenes. I just hope that would change (however big as a fools hope that may be). I love the way BW handled Alistair's character because of small things like him giving me the flower.

A small gesture, of the kind that I hope would be replicated a lot more in videogames (not just Bioware's).

I believe Bioware has incredibly talented people and would just love for them to be able to actually apply their craft without having people who think they "know" what's best, dictate how it should be handled

[Angrywolves]

Feel good about the sarcasm 1214.
shrugs.
Just my opinion .
I'm kinda surprised this thread didn't explode .
Maybe Gaider's recent threats to ban players from the BSN scared some romance haters from posting their opinions.
But it's still early.
smiles .