368 réponses à ce sujet

[TurretSyndrome]

 This is also a question I asked myself, when I first decided my Warden should do it. The only reasoning I could come up with was that it felt epic and wanted to thwart atleast one of the plans of the mysterious Flemeth and her daughter. 

But for obvious reasons, it never felt right for me. Why would anyone kill him/herself simply out of suspicion of some sorceress.? The implications of what castastrophe we might bring onto the world of Thedas always remained vague, atleast to me, as I played the game. Whatever they were, I was never able to feel that they justify a self sacrifice.

So, I'm really curious. What was going on in Bioware's canon Warden's head, when he/she decided they take such a drastic choice? What was going on through your(Bioware) heads when you opted for this ending, especially since you were the ones that introduced the Dark Ritual backdoor in the first place? 

Oh and I would welcome the community's own point of view on this as well, especially from those who chose the ending and still abide by it even after all these years, like me. 

[bEVEsthda]

The answers to all those questions are up to you. Aren't they?
It was your Warden. If you role-played your Warden, you should know what went on in the head.

[Rawgrim]

bEVEsthda wrote...

The answers to all those questions are up to you. Aren't they?
It was your Warden. If you role-played your Warden, you should know what went on in the head.

This.

[Sylvius the Mad]

I had one Warden who did it because she saw it as a kind thing to do for the other Wardens. Another because he felt duty-bound to do it. And another was depressed, and viewed the Ultimate Sacrifice as an opportunity for release from his suffering.

[Gwydden]

I was aiming towards the US in my first game but eventually I relented to Loghain's pleas. The reasoning was pretty obvius: the OGB was a loose cannon, completely unpredictable, and it would have been completely irresponsible to go that route. Most of my character chose the DR, though, since most of them are pretty selfish (and somewhat irresponsible) people.

[Taleroth]

When I first played the game, I was always under the impression that one of the reason Morrigan took the child away was that the Warden's taint could corrupt it and restart the blight.

On replays I don't know where I got the idea, but the line of thinking is sensible. If the child gets exposed to taint, it could start it up all over again, without that pesky problem of centuries between blights.

Modifié par Taleroth, 14 octobre 2013 - 08:36 .

[bEVEsthda]

To give you some sort of perspective, none of my Wardens made the sacrifice. But the first came close. She was a city-elf and got dumped by Alistair. At first, her emotions were in such a disarray, that she leaned towards the ultimate sacrifice. "That will show 'em". Eventually, though, she hardened to a cold and bitter ****. One which didn't hesitate to use Alistair for Morrigan's plan. But if she had slightly different personality, I suppose she could have. And what was in her head, I've given.

[JCAP]

My main Warden only did it because he felt injustice. So much work, so much sacrifice only to kill himself in the end? He trusted Morrigan too, so it was a no-brainer for him.

The only warden that sacrificed himself was a dalish elf that just... "gave up". He just couldn't take it anymore.

[TurretSyndrome]

Sylvius the Mad wrote...

 And another was depressed, and viewed the Ultimate Sacrifice as an opportunity for release from his suffering.

I am pleasently surprised by this answer. This would be a very interesting cause. Although, I am a bit confused 
by the other two reasons you've provided. 

How would it be kind to other wardens if you choose to do it? If the Dark Ritual option wasn't present, then I'd understand, but you were given the opportunity to save everyone's lives, as well as yours. Not only that, but by choosing to live, you'd be a living icon to other wardens as well as your countrymen don't you think?

Same goes for the other warden you mentioned. His/her duty would be to defeat the Archdemon. In normal circumstances, death would be the price they pay, it is not part of the duty, atleast that's what I think of it. 

I hope I'm not sounding judgemental of your choices, I'm merely curious.

Modifié par TurretSyndrome, 14 octobre 2013 - 08:50 .

[Gwydden]

I guess it's something along the lines of the DR being irresponsible, but the Warden choses to perform the US him/herself instead of letting anyone died in his/her stead. It's something I considered for a character (the one I mentioned earlier) but never really manifested.

[Wulfram]

bEVEsthda wrote...

The answers to all those questions are up to you. Aren't they?
It was your Warden. If you role-played your Warden, you should know what went on in the head.

He's asking about the "default" Warden for DA:I, for people who don't import, which is a Dalish warden who did the US.

Though I'm fairly sure the default is US mainly so they don't need to worry about them.

My US warden basically did it because Tevinter Old Gods are bad, from an Andrastean point of view, so keeping the soul of one around doesn't look like a good idea, and Morrigan gives no adequate explanation of why it would be a good thing - Morrigan's reticence seems to imply she doesn't think that the Warden would in fact approve of her intentions.  And one life is a really cheap price to stop the blight - if they weren't willing to pay that price they wouldn't have done all the other nigh-on suicidal things that took them to this point.

And the Warden's in command so it's her responsibility, not Alistair's.  Plus maybe a certain amount of being too heroic, and her self image being too tied up in seeing herself as a hero, for her own good

Modifié par Wulfram, 14 octobre 2013 - 08:51 .

[Reznore57]

First time I played I wanted to make the US , well I didn't want my pc to die obviously but what Morrigan asked was really shady.
I was trying to protect the world or something ,so saving the soul of a being that could be "evil" or used for things I wouldn't agree with didn't really appeal to me.

But then , Alistair went all stupid and sacrifice himself.
I was pissed off (I was supposed to be the hero afterall ) and slightly devastated during the party afterward ,everyone cheering up while I was mourning my LI was a bit off.

So I just replayed the same character and did the Dark ritual (well Alistair did it , it probably felt better than getting his soul crushed).
Besides I grew fond of Morrigan , so it's really hard to tell her that I don't trust her .

Anyway , I can imagine not wanting to.
In theory , Riordan is supposed to sacrifice himself , and as a warden , you're supposed to end the Blight at any cost even if it means dying.

[agonis]

The Ultimate Sacrifice didn´t feel so very ultimate to me... There you wander around for a year trying to save everybody from the blight and then when it is obvious that this will cost either your life (big surprise) or your integrity... how is that a difficult choice? The same with letting Alistair do it. He became king in my playtrough. My character wasn´t keen on sacrificing himself but how was he supossed to let Alistair die, if he has so much to rebuild in Ferelden... Life is not everything, I believe.

[Gwydden]

agonis wrote...

The Ultimate Sacrifice didn´t feel so very ultimate to me... There you wander around for a year trying to save everybody from the blight and then when it is obvious that this will cost either your life (big surprise) or your integrity... how is that a difficult choice? The same with letting Alistair do it. He became king in my playtrough. My character wasn´t keen on sacrificing himself but how was he supossed to let Alistair die, if he has so much to rebuild in Ferelden... Life is not everything, I believe.

Actually, it kinda is.

[TheKomandorShepard]

Even my pure good characters didn't do that and alistair did ritual.Well morri said in witch hunt that ritual was only way to the end or something like that.I don't trust her i will hang her along with leliana and flemeth.

I wonder what negative consequences ritual will have.

[Medhia Nox]

I did it because I didn't trust Morrigan and because I found the Dark Ritual to be cowardice and I wasn't playing a coward... it's called "the DARK ritual".

I find using childbirth as a way to stay alive disgusting. I couldn't believe Morrigan would ever be a good mother even if somehow this turned out to be just a child. I don't use children as currency.

And... I wasn't going to ask someone else to die for those beliefs.

And... because everyone dies, not just Grey Wardens who have a perfectly long life. Choosing how you die is something I can respect.

----

@Gwydden: When someone says "life is not everything" - a lot of times they mean "my indivdual life".

Modifié par Medhia Nox, 14 octobre 2013 - 09:03 .

[bEVEsthda]

Wulfram wrote...

He's asking about the "default" Warden for DA:I, for people who don't import, which is a Dalish warden who did the US.

Though I'm fairly sure the default is US mainly so they don't need to worry about them.

The way one would have to treat that would be the same as in real life. We don't really know why people do extreme things. Sometimes we can speculate in some clues, but we don't know how they exactly relate. We also don't know, cannot know or understand the state of mind.

So the Dalish Warden did it. <shrugs> Beats me why, and I'll never know.

[Reznore57]

Medhia Nox wrote...

I find using childbirth as a way to stay alive disgusting. I couldn't believe Morrigan would ever be a good mother even if somehow this turned out to be just a child. I don't use children as currency.

Yes , the fact that a child is on the line also make it hard.
You don't know what will happen to him , she said he will be "innocent" .
But what's that even supposed to mean when he has an old god soul?
Is he going to be his own person or just a vessel for another being?
She obviously had a plan in mind with the soul , I think it goes beyond preserving an ancient power .
If the kid survive ,somehow I don't imagine he has a shiny future waiting for him.

[Gwydden]

Medhia Nox wrote...

@Gwydden: When someone says "life is not everything" - a lot of times they mean "my indivdual life".

It's still all any of us have. It's hard for me to find throwing it away for no good reason a virtue. I agree the US is a good reason, but personally? Had it really been me there, I would have taken the DR without much forethought.

[TurretSyndrome]

Ah, so while some felt that the Dark Ritual was a cheap way to escape death, others felt that their suspicions of Morrigan's offer were justification enough to deny it.

I suppose that's how I felt the first time I played the game, but then after seeing how my Warden has done a lot more good by taking the offer and choosing to live than he could by dying, I had a change of heart(trust me, I stuck with my US Warden for quite a while).

Having said that, IF the consequences of performing the ritual are unchangeably disastrous, then that would be quite a blow to me as a player.

That doesn't mean I'd immediately switch to US wardens at that point, as I know that my warden didn't really have much to go on, on the matter. He was, after all an in-game character who's choices were only limited to the amount of information he collects throughout the game. Especially since both Flemeth and Morrigan were annoyingly dodgy at every point in the game.

[Kalas Magnus]

i did it because it is the way others have done it before me.
the darkspawn find an old god.
corrupt it.
bring on the blight.
a warden slays the archdemon.
repeat until all gods are dead.
and then the wardens will finally be able to wipe out the remaining remaining darkspawn.

[TurretSyndrome]

Gwydden wrote...

Medhia Nox wrote...

@Gwydden: When someone says "life is not everything" - a lot of times they mean "my indivdual life".

It's still all any of us have. It's hard for me to find throwing it away for no good reason a virtue. I agree the US is a good reason, but personally? Had it really been me there, I would have taken the DR without much forethought.

And that was exactly my thought! We can say as many things as we want, sitting in front of a screen, but what would we do if it were actually us, right there at that time?

[Fast Jimmy]

TurretSyndrome wrote...

Gwydden wrote...

Medhia Nox wrote...

@Gwydden: When someone says "life is not everything" - a lot of times they mean "my indivdual life".

It's still all any of us have. It's hard for me to find throwing it away for no good reason a virtue. I agree the US is a good reason, but personally? Had it really been me there, I would have taken the DR without much forethought.

And that was exactly my thought! We can say as many things as we want, sitting in front of a screen, but what would we do if it were actually us, right there at that time?

You should be playing the game as if the choices you make are the ones your character would make in that situation. That is, quite literally, the definition of roleplaying. 

[Gwydden]

Fast Jimmy wrote...

You should be playing the game as if the choices you make are the ones your character would make in that situation. That is, quite literally, the definition of roleplaying. 

I'm the first one to agree, but isn't reflection part of what comes out of roleplaying. Facing a moral conflict with different characters and see what comes out of it? And maybe at some point, wonder what you would do if you were in said characters place, incredible fighting skill included, as an exercise?

[TurretSyndrome]

Fast Jimmy wrote...


You should be playing the game as if the choices you make are the ones your character would make in that situation. That is, quite literally, the definition of roleplaying. 

That was a rhetorical question. My point was, when I myself am faced with such a decision, my instinct of self-preservation would kick in. Even if I am selfless, I would not throw away my life just because something bad might happen later on.

Modifié par TurretSyndrome, 14 octobre 2013 - 09:27 .