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[agonis]

TurretSyndrome wrote...

agonis wrote...

Quite a risk, if you have to track down your offspring to kill it in the end, if things don´t go as planed...

The motivation for the US doesn´t need to be selfless. It seems selfless, of course but in the end it can be all grudging teeth-grinding: "F*** this! I won´t risk it! All be damned!" *and you die in a mighty Archdemon explosion*
Perhaps there are more epic ways to quit but surely not many...

That is a big "if", especially when you consider what Morrigan told you about the child. He is as innocent as any other child of his age. Maybe he has some power in him that makes him potentially dangerous(hmmm... killing someone for being potentially dangerous, deja vu anyone? ), still there is as much a chance of him becoming the next king of Ferelden. 

An Old God as the King of Ferelden, that would be legen-wait-for-it-dary!

You mean Morrigan is just bad at advertising?
The DARK Ritual. (So full of drama. Must be her upbringing.)
Morigan a lá: "But don´t worry, it will be perfectly normal, don´t mind the fur, and the scales, and the...oh dear... eyes?... It will grow out of it."

[vertigomez]

I did the US because 1) my (female) character was hella depressed and 2) asking Alistair to do it felt way, way too rapey. I have never been comfortable more-or-less blackmailing him into banging a woman he hates, to have a child he will NEVER see even though he himself is a bastard... that's not even taking into account what Morrigan's plans for the baby are.

[Gwydden]

agonis wrote...
You mean Morrigan is just bad at advertising?
The DARK Ritual. (So full of drama. Must be her upbringing.)
Morigan a lá: "But don´t worry, it will be perfectly normal, don´t mind the fur, and the scales, and the...oh dear... eyes?... It will grow out of it."

It is shady, and we are in the dark about it. Doesn't me it will most definitely have terrible consequences.

[Reznore57]

Well old gods are somekind of shapeshifters, so the poor innocent child might be able to turn into a dragon.
Besides what would happen if he gets tainted again?

[In Exile]

TheBlackAdder13 wrote...

Gwydden wrote...

I was aiming towards the US in my first game but eventually I relented to Loghain's pleas. The reasoning was pretty obvius: the OGB was a loose cannon, completely unpredictable, and it would have been completely irresponsible to go that route. Most of my character chose the DR, though, since most of them are pretty selfish (and somewhat irresponsible) people.

This. I have a hard time understanding why many Darik Ritualers don't grasp the full implications as to why the dark ritual could be such a cluster ****/terrible idea, regardless of who does it.  I'm actually surprised by the number of players who did it -- I feel like a lot of people are int he mindset that something can't be a bad thing just because your hero/PC is the one who does it. Aside from the fact that Morrigan and Flemeth's motives and plans are both completely opaque, what about brining the soul of an old god back into the world seems like a good idea?

The absolute worst case scenario here is... what, exactly? That the OGB is an insane god that commands an army of monsters and is hellbent on the complete eradication of all life on Thedas? Because that's the current thing we have to kill, and if we can kill that, then we can certainly kill the OGB. And given that the Warden could very well have also killed Flemeth at that point, even if we assume she can somehow come back, that basically means the two biggest possible threats are from the two things you've already had to kill. 

I just don't see what possible danger the OGB could actually pose if it's insane and evil. I'd have to be many times stronger than an archdemon to actually be threatening. 

[Gwydden]

mutant_anemone wrote...

I did the US because 1) my (female) character was hella depressed and 2) asking Alistair to do it felt way, way too rapey. I have never been comfortable more-or-less blackmailing him into banging a woman he hates, to have a child he will NEVER see even though he himself is a bastard... that's not even taking into account what Morrigan's plans for the baby are.

Well, those of my characters who did the DR did it themselves, but they were male, so I can see how that would be an issue. Though I'd say the Warden's life is worth a little sacrifice for Alistair.

[agonis]

Gwydden wrote...

agonis wrote...
You mean Morrigan is just bad at advertising?
The DARK Ritual. (So full of drama. Must be her upbringing.)
Morigan a lá: "But don´t worry, it will be perfectly normal, don´t mind the fur, and the scales, and the...oh dear... eyes?... It will grow out of it."

It is shady, and we are in the dark about it. Doesn't me it will most definitely have terrible consequences.

I hope it will have any consequences! It´s an exciting idea the writers (I believe it was Gaider) had and it would be a shame if it came to nothing because it´s to complicated to implement in DA:I.

[TurretSyndrome]

When Morrigan tells you that neither you nor Alistair will ever see the child, don't take her word for it. She would want to keep it that way, sure, but whether or not Alistair and his son's paths will cross, it's not up to her, it's up to fate(Bioware).

[agonis]

In Exile wrote...

TheBlackAdder13 wrote...

Gwydden wrote...

I was aiming towards the US in my first game but eventually I relented to Loghain's pleas. The reasoning was pretty obvius: the OGB was a loose cannon, completely unpredictable, and it would have been completely irresponsible to go that route. Most of my character chose the DR, though, since most of them are pretty selfish (and somewhat irresponsible) people.

This. I have a hard time understanding why many Darik Ritualers don't grasp the full implications as to why the dark ritual could be such a cluster ****/terrible idea, regardless of who does it.  I'm actually surprised by the number of players who did it -- I feel like a lot of people are int he mindset that something can't be a bad thing just because your hero/PC is the one who does it. Aside from the fact that Morrigan and Flemeth's motives and plans are both completely opaque, what about brining the soul of an old god back into the world seems like a good idea?

The absolute worst case scenario here is... what, exactly? That the OGB is an insane god that commands an army of monsters and is hellbent on the complete eradication of all life on Thedas? Because that's the current thing we have to kill, and if we can kill that, then we can certainly kill the OGB. And given that the Warden could very well have also killed Flemeth at that point, even if we assume she can somehow come back, that basically means the two biggest possible threats are from the two things you've already had to kill. 

I just don't see what possible danger the OGB could actually pose if it's insane and evil. I'd have to be many times stronger than an archdemon to actually be threatening. 

[Sarcasm] Which means that the wardens who are willing to rist the OGB may do so, because another war won´t be a problem. There are still some mages, elfes, humans and dwarfs left to fight it. Some will die of course, but surely not all. [/sarcasm]

To save one person, you are willing to risk countless others in a worst case scenario?

[TurretSyndrome]

agonis wrote...

I hope it will have any consequences! It´s an exciting idea the writers (I believe it was Gaider) had and it would be a shame if it came to nothing because it´s to complicated to implement in DA:I.

Honestly, I'm rooting for Bioware to make Alistair as the canon god child father. Just as in the comics where Alistair finds his father, it would be awesome if Alistair encounters his own son when he's all grown up. 

It would be Beowulf all over again.

[Gwydden]

agonis wrote...

[Sarcasm] Which means that the wardens who are willing to rist the OGB may do so, because another war won´t be a problem. There are still some mages, elfes, humans and dwarfs left to fight it. Some will die of course, but surely not all. [/sarcasm]

To save one person, you are willing to risk countless others in a worst case scenario?

Considering that we have no reason whatsoever to think that scenario will come to pass, yes.

[TurretSyndrome]

Gwydden wrote...


Well, those of my characters who did the DR did it themselves, but they were male, so I can see how that would be an issue. Though I'd say the Warden's life is worth a little sacrifice for Alistair.

If you can call loosing virginity to a wild beauty a sacrifice. 

[Gwydden]

TurretSyndrome wrote...

agonis wrote...

I hope it will have any consequences! It´s an exciting idea the writers (I believe it was Gaider) had and it would be a shame if it came to nothing because it´s to complicated to implement in DA:I.

Honestly, I'm rooting for Bioware to make Alistair as the canon god child father. Just as in the comics where Alistair finds his father, it would be awesome if Alistair encounters his own son when he's all grown up. 

It would be Beowulf all over again.

BioWare has already said it won't be chosing a canon for the US/DR decission, so I don't think there will be a canon father either. Plus, I believe differences depending on who he is can be easily implemented.

[agonis]

TurretSyndrome wrote...

agonis wrote...

I hope it will have any consequences! It´s an exciting idea the writers (I believe it was Gaider) had and it would be a shame if it came to nothing because it´s to complicated to implement in DA:I.

Honestly, I'm rooting for Bioware to make Alistair as the canon god child father. Just as in the comics where Alistair finds his father, it would be awesome if Alistair encounters his own son when he's all grown up. 

It would be Beowulf all over again.

All grown up will be a bit of a problem. The kid won´t be ten in DA:I. But I would look at the youtube videos if something like this is in the next game.:happy:

[In Exile]

agonis wrote...
[Sarcasm] Which means that the wardens who are willing to rist the OGB may do so, because another war won´t be a problem. There are still some mages, elfes, humans and dwarfs left to fight it. Some will die of course, but surely not all. [/sarcasm]

To save one person, you are willing to risk countless others in a worst case scenario?

Given that the Warden is the one person that actually is good enough to stop this blight in 4 months instead of 40 years, the Warden's existence seems to be the only thing that saves "countless" lives. If the Warden was "only" as good a hero as Garahel, it would have taken him or her 20 years to stop the Blight. 

Getting the OGB to come back 'round while the Warden is alive enough to skewer it silly is probably the best move for all of Thedas. 

Darkspawn chronicles showed us that w/o the Warden, the Archdemon wins in Ferelden. Alistair can handle the whole building an army thing - he just fails on the last, last task of actually stopping the dragon. So the unholy killing machine that is the Warden seems to be a pretty good thing to save. 

[Gwydden]

In Exile wrote...

Given that the Warden is the one person that actually is good enough to stop this blight in 4 months instead of 40 years, the Warden's existence seems to be the only thing that saves "countless" lives. If the Warden was "only" as good a hero as Garahel, it would have taken him or her 20 years to stop the Blight. 

Getting the OGB to come back 'round while the Warden is alive enough to skewer it silly is probably the best move for all of Thedas. 

Darkspawn chronicles showed us that w/o the Warden, the Archdemon wins in Ferelden. Alistair can handle the whole building an army thing - he just fails on the last, last task of actually stopping the dragon. So the unholy killing machine that is the Warden seems to be a pretty good thing to save. 

I would say Flemeth's machinations played no small part in the Blight's premature end.

[TurretSyndrome]

agonis wrote...

All grown up will be a bit of a problem. The kid won´t be ten in DA:I. But I would look at the youtube videos if something like this is in the next game.:happy:

No no, I'm not saying that an encounter such as that has to happen in Inquisition, I would actually prefer it if it didn't. What I meant by it is that it would be really cool if we could see it in the comics, novels or a movie etc, where it takes place another decade later, so that the child would grow up to be a man, and Alistair close to answering the Calling(as he'd be around 50 at that point). 

You could think of a lot of interesting things that could happen between them.

[agonis]

In Exile wrote...

Given that the Warden is the one person that actually is good enough to stop this blight in 4 months instead of 40 years, the Warden's existence seems to be the only thing that saves "countless" lives. If the Warden was "only" as good a hero as Garahel, it would have taken him or her 20 years to stop the Blight. 

Getting the OGB to come back 'round while the Warden is alive enough to skewer it silly is probably the best move for all of Thedas. 

Darkspawn chronicles showed us that w/o the Warden, the Archdemon wins in Ferelden. Alistair can handle the whole building an army thing - he just fails on the last, last task of actually stopping the dragon. So the unholy killing machine that is the Warden seems to be a pretty good thing to save. 

Many people have died falling of a chair. Or getting an heart attack. Or in a tavern brawl.
The power of the god-gamer to reload a save doesn´t make the Warde an "unholy killing machine".

[vertigomez]

Gwydden wrote...
Well, those of my characters who did the DR did it themselves, but they were male, so I can see how that would be an issue. Though I'd say the Warden's life is worth a little sacrifice for Alistair.

That's the kicker, though. Is the Warden's life REALLY worth it? Alistair doesn't want to go through with it initially; you have to persuade him. Given the opportunity, he will gladly give his life for a romanced Warden - that's his idea of a worthy sacrifice, NOT the Dark Ritual.

I just think it's messier than most people do... it's not just his life, it's his kid's now, this child who will not know his father just like Alistair didn't know Maric, who will grow up with the worst person in the world for a mother (from Alistair's point of view, I mean. I love Morrigan lol). I really think an Alistair who does the DR will eventually grow to resent the Warden who coerced him into doing it... and I say this as someone who has taken that option many times! Either that, or he'll just end up hating himself for it. He's so proud of being a Grey Warden... "in death, sacrifice."

I definitely think, as a male Warden, whether or not you're romancing Morrigan it's easier to do the DR than not. Because you have the option to pursue her and your child - Alistair and Loghain do not get that option, at least not that we see. You can try to be a father, whether this kid turns out to be an apocalypse baby or the savior of Thedas.

I've never had Loghain do it... I remember watching a clip on YouTube where he mentions thinking about his dead wife during the act LOL, but ehh I am not the expert. I'd actually be interested in a Loghain OGB... especially if big sister Anora is on the throne! 

[agonis]

TurretSyndrome wrote...

agonis wrote...

All grown up will be a bit of a problem. The kid won´t be ten in DA:I. But I would look at the youtube videos if something like this is in the next game.:happy:

No no, I'm not saying that an encounter such as that has to happen in Inquisition, I would actually prefer it if it didn't. What I meant by it is that it would be really cool if we could see it in the comics, novels or a movie etc, where it takes place another decade later, so that the child would grow up to be a man, and Alistair close to answering the Calling(as he'd be around 50 at that point). 

You could think of a lot of interesting things that could happen between them.

And I would buy it. I read a lot Dragon Age related stuff lately (because I hate writing my thesis<_<)
The art of the last three comic books was nice, though. I enjoyed reading them.

[In Exile]

agonis wrote...
Many people have died falling of a chair. Or getting an heart attack. Or in a tavern brawl.
The power of the god-gamer to reload a save doesn´t make the Warde an "unholy killing machine".

No. Killing everything in existence without breaking a sweat makes the Warden a killing machine. Given that the Warden got chomped on by dragons and lived, falling off chairs and tavern brawls aren't pretty dangerous. And for all we know an asteroid could hit Thedas and wipe it out, but that doesn't make resisting the blight pointless. 

[fchopin]

I think the answer is very simple op.

The wardens job was to kill the dragon so either the warden had to die or Alistair had to die.

If the warden did what Morrigan suggested then he would not be doing his job.

[Gwydden]

fchopin wrote...

I think the answer is very simple op.

The wardens job was to kill the dragon so either the warden had to die or Alistair had to die.

If the warden did what Morrigan suggested then he would not be doing his job.

Because? He still kills the dragon.

[agonis]

In Exile wrote...

agonis wrote...
Many people have died falling of a chair. Or getting an heart attack. Or in a tavern brawl.
The power of the god-gamer to reload a save doesn´t make the Warde an "unholy killing machine".

No. Killing everything in existence without breaking a sweat makes the Warden a killing machine. Given that the Warden got chomped on by dragons and lived, falling off chairs and tavern brawls aren't pretty dangerous. And for all we know an asteroid could hit Thedas and wipe it out, but that doesn't make resisting the blight pointless. 

Everybody in my party got chomped on by dragons. It´s quite hilarious to watch the dragon toss them all around like rag dolls and they just swollow some potion and are fit as ever.
Now if we had an gigantic army instead of a few companions and everybody died or got the taint during the events of DA:O except the Warden, then I would say: O my, that Warden sure is some killing machine.

But so, I think the Warden is a person with some skill, a lot of talent, a bunch of people guarding her/his back and an enormous amout of dumb luck.

[fchopin]

Gwydden wrote...

fchopin wrote...

I think the answer is very simple op.

The wardens job was to kill the dragon so either the warden had to die or Alistair had to die.

If the warden did what Morrigan suggested then he would not be doing his job.

Because? He still kills the dragon.

He kills the body of the dragon but the dragons soul goes in to the baby so it is not really dead.
You could be bringing a deadly enemy in the world that is much worse than the dragon so you would not be doing your job.