368 réponses à ce sujet

[Gwydden]

fchopin wrote...

He kills the body of the dragon but the dragons soul goes in to the baby so it is not really dead.
You could be bringing a deadly enemy in the world that is much worse than the dragon so you would not be doing your job.

We have no reason to believe that. Even Morrigan says that the child will be just a child, not an Old God in a human body. And even if he is, we don't know how untainted Urthemiel is like.

[fchopin]

Gwydden wrote...

fchopin wrote...

He kills the body of the dragon but the dragons soul goes in to the baby so it is not really dead.
You could be bringing a deadly enemy in the world that is much worse than the dragon so you would not be doing your job.

We have no reason to believe that. Even Morrigan says that the child will be just a child, not an Old God in a human body. And even if he is, we don't know how untainted Urthemiel is like.

We don't know but that means we are taking a chance and is it right for us to take a chance with other peoples lives when we made a promise to Duncan to do whatever it takes to kill the dragon?
 
Why would i believe anything Morrigan says?
Lets have a kid then i will go and you can not follow.

[Shadow Fox]

I don't like the US cause I can't import it into Awakening.

Modifié par Arcane Warrior Mage Hawke, 14 octobre 2013 - 11:59 .

[Gwydden]

fchopin wrote...

Gwydden wrote...

fchopin wrote...

He kills the body of the dragon but the dragons soul goes in to the baby so it is not really dead.
You could be bringing a deadly enemy in the world that is much worse than the dragon so you would not be doing your job.

We have no reason to believe that. Even Morrigan says that the child will be just a child, not an Old God in a human body. And even if he is, we don't know how untainted Urthemiel is like.

We don't know but that means we are taking a chance and is it right for us to take a chance with other peoples lives when we made a promise to Duncan to do whatever it takes to kill the dragon?
 
Why would i believe anything Morrigan says?
Lets have a kid then i will go and you can not follow.

Firstly, I don't remember promising anything to Duncan o_O. Secondly, if your Warden is good friends/lovers with Morrigan, you have reason to believe at least part of what she says. Thirdly, peopla have a tendency to assume that something terrible will come out of the DR. That's just being pessimistic xD.

[TurretSyndrome]

simfamSP wrote...

bEVEsthda wrote...

The answers to all those questions are up to you. Aren't they?
It was your Warden. If you role-played your Warden, you should know what went on in the head.

/thread.

My Warden was gay

Actually I wanted to wait before responding to that post, to see what reasons people would bring to the table before I make any comment. All I've seen from this is that there's really not much info the warden gets regarding the ritual.

In the end, all it would be is a mere possibility that things would go wrong, that is also assuming that Morrigan's intentions are evil. All the reasons people have provided are all based on assumptions that the ritual would bring some sort of great evil to the world.

And while it's true that my Warden could have had many reasons other than the risks that lie with the ritual, most of them in which the Warden wishes a reprieve from his/her life according to all the posts that I've read on this thread, and they find the US to be the best way out.

In my opinion, that is nowhere near a proper justification to choose the sacrifice. It's still unknown why Bioware who provided the backdoor which is the Dark Ritual chose to use the US and kill of their Warden. I'd be disappointed if their reasoning is something like "Keeping the Warden alive would bring more complications to the story".

Arcane Warrior Mage Hawke wrote...

I don't like the US cause I can't import it into Awakening.[smilie]http://social.bioware.com/images/forum/emoticons/crying.png[/smilie]

Now you can 

Modifié par TurretSyndrome, 15 octobre 2013 - 12:19 .

[Shadow Fox]

TurretSyndrome wrote...

simfamSP wrote...

bEVEsthda wrote...

The answers to all those questions are up to you. Aren't they?
It was your Warden. If you role-played your Warden, you should know what went on in the head.

/thread.

My Warden was gay

Actually I wanted to wait before responding to that post, to see what reasons people would bring to the table before I make any comment. All I've seen from this is that there's really not much info the warden gets regarding the ritual.

In the end, all it would be is a mere possibility that things would go wrong, that is also assuming that Morrigan's intentions are evil. All the reasons people have provided are all based on assumptions that the ritual would bring some sort of great evil to the world.

And while it's true that my Warden could have had many reasons other than the risks that lie with the ritual, most of them in which the Warden wishes a reprieve from his/her life according to all the posts that I've read on this thread, and they find the US to be the best way out.

In my opinion, that is nowhere near a proper justification to choose the sacrifice. It's still unknown why Bioware who provided the backdoor which is the Dark Ritual chose to use the US and kill of their Warden. I'd be disappointed if their reasoning is something like "Keeping the Warden alive would bring more complications to the story".

Arcane Warrior Mage Hawke wrote...

I don't like the US cause I can't import it into Awakening.[smilie]http://social.bioware.com/images/forum/emoticons/crying.png[/smilie]

Now you can 

Console player.

[Reznore57]

Well why would they keep the warden alive for people who didn't play him/her?
And what's the point of the OGB , when again people new to the franchise won't even know where this kid is coming from.

The less complication for new player , the better.

[ScarMK]

TurretSyndrome wrote...

Snip

You'll just be disappointed, because that's very likely to be their reason.

[kathic]

Trust the selfish and dangerous mage with the soul of being of immense power? No thanks. I'll just have Alister or myself fall on the blade and be a hero.

[Sasie]

Even if Morrigan could be trusted she is not as clever as she believes herself to be and the original plan wasn't even hers. What to say Flemeth didn't plan it all? Even in Origins it's easy to see that there are far too many unanswered questions for the Warden to believe that it's safe or even wise to do a ritual made by Flemeth.

On top of that I personally dislike how Morrigan try to emotionally blackmail the Warden if they are not interested in her plan and all out leave if you refuse to give in to her very unfair tactics. Not to mention if Loghain is recruited he is a perfect choice to sacrifice and there is no need for the dark ritual at all.

Modifié par Sasie, 15 octobre 2013 - 12:34 .

[TurretSyndrome]

Arcane Warrior Mage Hawke wrote...

Console player.

Ah. I'm sorry then.

fchopin wrote...


We don't know but that means we are taking a chance and is it right for us to take a chance with other peoples lives when we made a promise to Duncan to do whatever it takes to kill the dragon?
 
Why would i believe anything Morrigan says?
Lets have a kid then i will go and you can not follow.

Do not confuse the Archdemon for the Old God. The Old Gods are untainted dragons, which after being corrupted become Archdemons. Much like how mages become abominations when possessed by demons.

Therefore, the Old God's soul does not mean it is also the tainted Archdemon's soul. And from what Morrigan said, the child that she will conceive after the ritual will be free of taint, and will carry the essence of the Old God. 

[Shadow Fox]

TurretSyndrome wrote...

Arcane Warrior Mage Hawke wrote...

Console player.

Ah. I'm sorry then.

fchopin wrote...


We don't know but that means we are taking a chance and is it right for us to take a chance with other peoples lives when we made a promise to Duncan to do whatever it takes to kill the dragon?
 
Why would i believe anything Morrigan says?
Lets have a kid then i will go and you can not follow.

Do not confuse the Archdemon for the Old God. The Old Gods are untainted dragons, which after being corrupted become Archdemons. Much like how mages become abominations when possessed by demons.

Therefore, the Old God's soul does not mean it is also the tainted Archdemon's soul. And from what Morrigan said, the child that she will conceive after the ritual will be free of taint, and will carry the essence of the Old God. 

Well Dumat caused the Blight...

[l7986]

Barely even chose the Ultimate Sacrifice anymore. Mostly because my Warden likes living. I'll do the ritual with Morrigan, then in Witch Hunt I'll go through the mirror with her so I can guard/watch over her just in case she tries anything.

[Magdalena11]

I am too cynical. I do/don't do the DR for one reason - do I want to live to play Awakenings or am I am I after the achievement or glory of tossing away a warden or companion? The actual ritual smacks of blood magic and may be distasteful to some for that reason. Others may be turned off by a magic more ancient than the chantry or a distrust of Morrigan's motivations. Neither blood magic nor concern for getting bit on the butt later is much of a concern for me since it's a video game. All I really care about is whether it makes sense story-wise to refuse the ritual.

I plan on carrying over at least one save with the ritual having been performed and at least one without. The first playthrough I'll probably play one with a yes for DR. Since it's a video game, I wouldn't expect anyone else to care what my in-game decisions were any more than I do for them.

[TurretSyndrome]

Arcane Warrior Mage Hawke wrote...
Well Dumat caused the Blight...

The true cause of the taint, the Darkspawn and the Blights are the Magisters who stepped foot into the Golden City. The Darkspawn corrupt and wake the sleeping dragons, changing them into Archdemons, just as they would corrupt females of different races and turn them into Broodmothers. 

One can only assume that only dragons which carry the Old God souls can become Archdemons(otherwise Blights would occur a lot more frequently, especially in the current Dragon Age), and since they are so limited in their numbers(7), it takes the Darkspawn as long as 4 centuries to find and corrupt each of them. 

Ofcourse, I'm sure you're already well aware of all that, still, just wanted to point it out.

Modifié par TurretSyndrome, 15 octobre 2013 - 01:00 .

[Shadow Fox]

TurretSyndrome wrote...

Arcane Warrior Mage Hawke wrote...
Well Dumat caused the Blight...

The true cause of the taint, the Darkspawn and the Blights are the Magisters who stepped foot into the Golden City. The Darkspawn corrupt and wake the sleeping dragons, changing them into Archdemons, just as they would corrupt females of different races and turn them into Broodmothers. 

One can only assume that only dragons which carry the Old God souls can become Archdemons(otherwise Blights would occur a lot more frequently, especially in the current Dragon Age), and since they are so limited in their numbers(7), it takes the Darkspawn as long as 4 centuries to find and corrupt each of them. 

Ofcourse, I'm sure you're already well aware of all that, still, just wanted to point it out.

Was just pointing out Dumat tricked them into going according to that guy.

Basically TOGs were evil dicks.

Modifié par Arcane Warrior Mage Hawke, 15 octobre 2013 - 01:05 .

[Sanunes]

TurretSyndrome wrote...

 This is also a question I asked myself, when I first decided my Warden should do it. The only reasoning I could come up with was that it felt epic and wanted to thwart atleast one of the plans of the mysterious Flemeth and her daughter. 

But for obvious reasons, it never felt right for me. Why would anyone kill him/herself simply out of suspicion of some sorceress.? The implications of what castastrophe we might bring onto the world of Thedas always remained vague, atleast to me, as I played the game. Whatever they were, I was never able to feel that they justify a self sacrifice.

So, I'm really curious. What was going on in Bioware's canon Warden's head, when he/she decided they take such a drastic choice? What was going on through your(Bioware) heads when you opted for this ending, especially since you were the ones that introduced the Dark Ritual backdoor in the first place? 

Oh and I would welcome the community's own point of view on this as well, especially from those who chose the ending and still abide by it even after all these years, like me. 

I didn't read the thread, but from what I understand from previous BioWare posts is part of the reason for what they choose for the default option is based on the amount of knowledge required from the previous games for those choices, for the people they expect to be picking the default character have either not played/finished the first two games, so they don't want to make them feel required to play the first two game or go to the internet to find out about the different choices.

Of course I could be twisting what they have said.

[Gwydden]

Arcane Warrior Mage Hawke wrote...

Was just pointing out Dumat tricked them into going according to that guy.

Basically TOGs were evil dicks.

Considering how Dumat came out of that stunt, he either:

• Is stupid.
• Didn't know what stepping into the Black City would do.
• Wasn't really the one who told the magisters to go there, and they were tricked.

So there's really no reason to believe the Old Gods are evil.

[Gold Dragon]

Why all the "Gloom and Doom"?  End of the World prophecies?  Why?

Morrigan and Flemeth could equally as well be trying to save the world as destroy it, you know.

What, I as you, is stopping Bioware from Pulling a similar stunt as ME 3 did?  At the End of ME 3, Shepard is supposed to die to save the galaxy.  Bioware pulled a stunt, and if you A) chose the correct ending, and B ), gathered enough War Assets, Shepard would live.  Again I ask:  What is stopping Bioware from pulling this in Dragon Age?

The OGB will not appear (beyond a possible Codex entry or 3) in Inquisition.  But nothing has been said about the next game (or a fifth, if certain rumors I've heard about DA being 5 games long is true), assuming of course that the DR was done.

Possible Scenario: Final game boss (Archdemon level from Origins, Merideth/Orosino from DA 2, etc) requires the protagonist to die, BUT, if the Warden did/allowed the Ritual, the Man that grew up from the OGB would then take the sacrifice instead, which would have been Flemeth and Morrigan's plan the entire time (and I consider both to be manipulative B****es, btw), Put a final and complete end to a certain danger.

Just saying!  Bioware will do what they think best, regardless.


As for why the Ultimate Sacrifice, I have only one character, Kaliana Tabris, do it.  Reason: She wants to be with Nelaros again.  As for the sacrifice, I believe that, when the Archdemon travels thru the taint to possess another body, it tries to possess a body that already has a soul in it.  That soul rejects the OG, but the conflict kills the body, which is still attached to the Warden's soul.  The Warden's body can not handle this, and dies as a reult of the strain.  As the OG is now attached to a body that has again died, it no longer has the strength to travel the taint (the Soul gain such strength from the body), and dies as well.

This is my opinion/belief, believe as you wish.

Nelaros Dies so that Kaliana can live, even as she dies that a world can live.  And gains the reward she wishes as a result.

[Xilizhra]

Not only do I not want to die, I don't want Urthemiel to die either. The Old Gods are as much victims of the Blight as we are; just because it's a big scary dragon thing doesn't mean I won't save a soul from annihilation if possible.

[Shadow Fox]

Gwydden wrote...

Arcane Warrior Mage Hawke wrote...

Was just pointing out Dumat tricked them into going according to that guy.

Basically TOGs were evil dicks.

Considering how Dumat came out of that stunt, he either:

• Is stupid.
• Didn't know what stepping into the Black City would do.
• Wasn't really the one who told the magisters to go there, and they were tricked.

So there's really no reason to believe the Old Gods are evil.

If he didn't know the place was Taint Central I agree.

[Ryzaki]

My US wardens pick it because it's the one tried and tested way of ending a blight. That and they don't trust Morrigan as far as they can throw Shale.

That and some of them have little else to live for (particularly the human nobles) so they see it as a means to have their legacy and family name live on despite it being nearly or completely destroyed.

Edit: Also the warden did need a army to fight the archedemon true. But the archedemon also had a army. Soloing an army is idiocy.

Modifié par Ryzaki, 15 octobre 2013 - 01:26 .

[Gwydden]

Ryzaki wrote...

My US wardens pick it because it's the one tried and tested way of ending a blight. That and they don't trust Morrigan as far as they can throw Shale.

That and some of them have little else to live for (particularly the human nobles) so they see it as a means to have their legacy and family name live on despite it being nearly or completely destroyed.

Edit: Also the warden did need a army to fight the archedemon true. But the archedemon also had a army. Soloing an army is idiocy.

Your Wardens seem a little bit miserable xD. It must be my Tyrion Lannister like philosophy that life is full of possibilities, while death is final, but even if it is unintended, most of mine really like living. DC? He won't leave his family alone and he plans to show those nobles who's boss.  HM? Best year of his life so far, he's finally out of the Circle and has big plans for his future. HN? He won't be the last of the Couslands; he will carry on his family name, even if only to prove Howe wrong.

Modifié par Gwydden, 15 octobre 2013 - 01:38 .

[Reaverwind]

TurretSyndrome wrote...

 This is also a question I asked myself, when I first decided my Warden should do it. The only reasoning I could come up with was that it felt epic and wanted to thwart atleast one of the plans of the mysterious Flemeth and her daughter. 

But for obvious reasons, it never felt right for me. Why would anyone kill him/herself simply out of suspicion of some sorceress.? The implications of what castastrophe we might bring onto the world of Thedas always remained vague, atleast to me, as I played the game. Whatever they were, I was never able to feel that they justify a self sacrifice.

So, I'm really curious. What was going on in Bioware's canon Warden's head, when he/she decided they take such a drastic choice? What was going on through your(Bioware) heads when you opted for this ending, especially since you were the ones that introduced the Dark Ritual backdoor in the first place? 

Oh and I would welcome the community's own point of view on this as well, especially from those who chose the ending and still abide by it even after all these years, like me. 

I felt it was a horrific thing to do to an unborn child, and wanted no part of it.