486 réponses à ce sujet

[CronoDragoon]

I don't have MEHEM installed and never will. I will always choose to accept canon possibilities over fan fiction.

That being said, I have no real reason to hate on MEHEM's existence or others' decision to make it the ending to their story. No MEHEM users I have seen have suggested that it is an official canon possibility or that others who choose not to use MEHEM "should" use it because it's better. They very clearly state that it's a personal decision to believe in an unofficial ending than accept the current ones.

Which, when we're talking about a work of fiction, is something I find to be acceptable and even healthy. It's taking the idea of "don't like it? make something better" and applying it. I've read a lot of crappy fan fiction in my earlier days, and some good stuff. Fan fiction, on the whole, can be a very liberating and cathartic exercise. There's nothing wrong with creation borne out of frustration of others' works, and indeed I can think of many writers who began writing because of dissatisfaction with what they were reading.

I don't find a game mod to be any different. It's a different form of fan fiction, one that improves someone's enjoyment of the game. So long as they recognize the personal nature of their ending and don't suggest that it is as legitimate as BioWare's for others, then I don't see the issue.

[Kel Riever]

MEHEM is fine. I wish it was available for Console.

Instead I have to unplug my xBox after "The best seats in the house" line.

If I could get in my xBox and install the MEHEM ending, I would.

[Ledgend1221]

It's because the internet is where idiots live.

Like me.

[The Night Mammoth]

I don't really understand it either. Even if I were on PC I probably wouldn't use MEHEM, but I have nothing against it. Comments

I put no stock into complaints that it shatters the sanctity of the original work. It doesn't, first off, since it's an entirely optional PC exclusive that uses in game assets, but I don't really believe keeping some work of fiction whole and intact. It's a meaningless principle to me.

[Chashan]

CronoDragoon wrote...

Which, when we're talking about a work of fiction, is something I find to be acceptable and even healthy. It's taking the idea of "don't like it? make something better" and applying it. I've read a lot of crappy fan fiction in my earlier days, and some good stuff. Fan fiction, on the whole, can be a very liberating and cathartic exercise. There's nothing wrong with creation borne out of frustration of others' works, and indeed I can think of many writers who began writing because of dissatisfaction with what they were reading.

I don't find a game mod to be any different. It's a different form of fan fiction, one that improves someone's enjoyment of the game. So long as they recognize the personal nature of their ending and don't suggest that it is as legitimate as BioWare's for others, then I don't see the issue.

I've also seen a more fundamental opposition to any type of 'mod' surface along with such...strong 'disagreement', going off into legalese territory of copyrights, author ownership and what not.

The Night Mammoth wrote...

I put no stock into complaints that it shatters the sanctity of the original work. It doesn't, first off, since it's an entirely optional PC exclusive that uses in game assets, but I don't really believe keeping some work of fiction whole and intact. It's a meaningless principle to me.

There's that too. Such unmalleable frameworks don't exist in the wide world of story-telling anyhow, with many works picking up earlier ones and 're-interpreting' them, theme-wise or wholesale. They be epics of far antiquity, adaptations from one medium to another, etc.

To quote a rather neutral comment on MEHEM:

While too much of a cookie-cutter happy end for some, it gave the necessary closure to those who had given up on an otherwise near-perfect trilogy of games.

And ultimately, I'll allow that diction when it comes to expressing opinions on the finale should have, by all rights, tempered by now, on all sides of the divided opinion on it.

[RatThing]

I don't hate MEHEM, modders can do what they like. It's the idea that people want a cheesy Hollywood ending for the game that bothers me. It's not relevant for this game but for future Mass Effect games probably.

[Deverz]

I appreciate what MEHEM does and how people may prefer it over the actual endings, but like you, I could never choose it over the real ones. Even though I personally don't like the endings, adding a fan-created ending never crossed my mind, tbh. Especially when that sort of ending was never intended by the creators.

That's just my take on it. Different strokes for different folks.

Modifié par Deverz, 17 octobre 2013 - 04:15 .

[jtav]

I'll never install it because it makes an already linear game more linear. But there are lots of mods I don't install. What I hate is the fan culture around it. Bringing it up in discussions about the canonical endings. Treating it as if it were canon by demanding BW respect it in future games. I write fanwork. I've come up with what I think are clever ways for Shep to survive the Control and Synth endings. But when people want to talk about the endings I can shift back to referring to them as dead/might as well be. Some MEHEM advocate can't or won't treat it as a mod.

[wright1978]

Given the high levels of animosity that still exist regarding the existing endings, i'm not at all surprised there is a degree of animosity towards a mod that offers a different alternative. Personally i adore MEHEM as it saved Mass Effect for me as imo the existing endings are delivered in such a trainwreck manner that without MEHEM to fix it i'd have uninstalled all 3 ME games from my PC.

[shodiswe]

It doesn't make it any better imo. Shepard lives and I guess the Geth and EDI lives, the Reaper slaves are killed of.
The end game and story isn't really "improved". It just get more Disney like.

It's kind of the "independenceday movie" all over again. You kill all the bad guys with ease and everyone lives happily ever after.

It's not that I hate it but it's not interesting. Saving the AI's and synthetics does make the setting better than Destroy if you want an interesting game in the future sicne it will make the "Universe" more diverse and interesting.

I wanted a good, dramatic, interesting, interactive endgameplay where warassets and chocies mattered, a happy disney ending doesn't add any of this. I'm not against happy. I just wanted it to be more intriguing and variable as the story progressed.

[Mathias]

shodiswe wrote...

It doesn't make it any better imo. Shepard lives and I guess the Geth and EDI lives, the Reaper slaves are killed of.
The end game and story isn't really "improved". It just get more Disney like.

Will people stop referring to happy endings as a "Disney" ending? What the hell? Is it suppose to be some subtle insult or attempt to discredit those that want a more emotional and uplifting ending? 

Do people realize that Disney is not the only company that has ever attempted a happy ending? I recall that the two most highly regarded and beloved trilogies ever made both had happy endings.

[Iakus]

shodiswe wrote...

It doesn't make it any better imo. Shepard lives and I guess the Geth and EDI lives, the Reaper slaves are killed of.
The end game and story isn't really "improved". It just get more Disney like.

Well, except for the billions that have already died.  Including several of Shepard's friends and allies.

Why does not slaughtering synthetics wholesale suddenly make the ending "Disney"?

It's kind of the "independenceday movie" all over again. You kill all the bad guys with ease and everyone lives happily ever after.

Well, except for the trashed colonies, Palaven, Thessia, and Earth getting curb-stomped, the Citadel wrecked, the relays damaged.  And again, teh billions of deaths, both at the Reapers' hands 9err, tentacles) and Cerberus.

It's not that I hate it but it's not interesting. Saving the AI's and synthetics does make the setting better than Destroy if you want an interesting game in the future sicne it will make the "Universe" more diverse and interesting.

I'd say a galaxy that has to work together to rebuild what was broken and finding their own path without Reaper influence, including maintaining peace between organics and synthetics, to be very interesting.

Forced tragedy adds nothing to it.

I wanted a good, dramatic, interesting, interactive endgameplay where warassets and chocies mattered, a happy disney ending doesn't add any of this. I'm not against happy. I just wanted it to be more intriguing and variable as the story progressed.

Modding can only do so much in this very mod-unfriendly game.  Sure I'd like more of an Earn Your Happy Ending.  But I'll take nonsensical and happy over nonsensical and tragic.

Besides, the latest version will have a Low EMS outcome as well. 

[Iakus]

Mdoggy1214 wrote...

Will people stop referring to happy endings as a "Disney" ending?

maybe they don't know what movies Disney has made?

[CronoDragoon]

iakus wrote...

Well, except for the billions that have already died.  Including several of Shepard's friends and allies.

Why does not slaughtering synthetics wholesale suddenly make the ending "Disney"?

He said more Disney, which it undoubtedly is if by Disney he meant happy.

Well, except for the trashed colonies, Palaven, Thessia, and Earth getting curb-stomped, the Citadel wrecked, the relays damaged.  And again, teh billions of deaths, both at the Reapers' hands 9err, tentacles) and Cerberus.

Except that type of destruction happens in Independence Day, too, so it's still exactly like Independence Day.

Which is not a diss unless you want it to be. I love Independence Day, but it's no doubt a B-movie Hollywood ending; about par for course for the ME series. It's the mystical organic/synthetic Catalyst stuff at the end that feels out of place with Mass Effect.

Modifié par CronoDragoon, 17 octobre 2013 - 04:59 .

[teh DRUMPf!!]

I don't *hate* MEHEM. If that was the ending we got the first time around, I probably would have been okay with it -- "okay" would still be a little underwhelming, given my high expectations going in, but still an improvement over the original cut.


I do find myself mildly annoyed by it, however. It's overrated, IMO, and overrated things tend to bother me a bit.

[Bardox9]

I liked the ends as they were written in the extended version. To me MEHEM is just people telling writers who built one of the best RPGs out there that they don't know what they are doing. A story is not suppose to end exactly the way you thought it would. It's suppose to end the way the writers want it to end.

If you want Shepard to live then make the right decisions. If you want EDI and the Geth to live then make the right decisions. Don't cry because the results of the decisions you made through out the trilogy sucked.

[GreyLycanTrope]

An optional unofficial mod that no one is forced to install? Don't get the hate myself. I get that it might not be up to the preferences or standards of some people again they're not forced to install it so *shrugs* no idea.

Modifié par Greylycantrope, 17 octobre 2013 - 04:55 .

[RiouHotaru]

I don't mind the MEHEM, but to be honest, having seen the videos for it, I can't say I'd ever use it. It attempts to force a Dark Energy-based plot to be relevant in the finale when there's no build up or any clue. If anything the entire conversation with the Catalyst-replacement feels random as hell.

Not to mention the MEHEM to my knowledge can't account for the Leviathan DLC and the information provided there. I applaud their effort to create a "better" ending, but I honestly prefer what we got.

[Splinter Cell 108]

There's a reason people hate it and it is the same stupid reason people don't like some mods in the nexus. I've said this before and I'll say it again, they don't like it because:

1. It isn't made by BioWare so its "bad"
2. It doesn't meet their standards
3. x or y isn't how they would like it to be, so again its "bad"
4. It's not lore friendly (ironic since it seems to remove all the nonsense that the other endings had)

I think its funny that people get angry and hate on this mod, a mod which are always optional. Maybe people just don't want those of us who think the ending was garbage to have our own ending. In my opinion I think MEHEM is the only reason the whole Mass Effect series is alive on PC.

[JamesFaith]

Well, there should be few reason why people "hate" it.

1. Supporters of MEHEM are using it as weapon against people who like endings. When some people here constantly bashing thing you like and connecting it with "MEHEM is superior, MEHEM is only right ending, MEHEM is better then crap you like, MEHEM this and MEHEM that... It isn't surprising that people react on it hostily after some time.

2. Double standards of some MEHEM supporters: harsh critic of ME3 endings = OK, harsh critic of MEHEM = hate.

I personally don't consider MEHEM good, but I don't hate it and appreciate work behind it. But I´m still annoyed by how some people here pushing MEHEM as superb solution of ME3 problems in too many discussions and attacking me with it.

[Chashan]

RiouHotaru wrote...

I don't mind the MEHEM, but to be honest, having seen the videos for it, I can't say I'd ever use it. It attempts to force a Dark Energy-based plot to be relevant in the finale when there's no build up or any clue. If anything the entire conversation with the Catalyst-replacement feels random as hell.

Not to mention the MEHEM to my knowledge can't account for the Leviathan DLC and the information provided there. I applaud their effort to create a "better" ending, but I honestly prefer what we got.

That would be 'MEEM', the project MrFob hisself prefers.

And frankly, if MrFob decides to continue with that particular project, I'd give that scenario rather a shot than going through the original 'catalyst' again. As your point about no build-up/clue is even truer for the vanilla finale, from where I stand.

And the Leviathan DLC information, vague as it is, can be safely treated as fun-facts to know about the origins of the Reapers. Not meeting the 'intelligence' in person certainly didn't detract from my personal enjoyment.

[RiouHotaru]

Chashan wrote...

RiouHotaru wrote...

I don't mind the MEHEM, but to be honest, having seen the videos for it, I can't say I'd ever use it. It attempts to force a Dark Energy-based plot to be relevant in the finale when there's no build up or any clue. If anything the entire conversation with the Catalyst-replacement feels random as hell.

Not to mention the MEHEM to my knowledge can't account for the Leviathan DLC and the information provided there. I applaud their effort to create a "better" ending, but I honestly prefer what we got.

That would be 'MEEM', the project MrFob hisself prefers.

And frankly, if MrFob decides to continue with that particular project, I'd give that scenario rather a shot than going through the original 'catalyst' again. As your point about no build-up/clue is even truer for the vanilla finale, from where I stand.

And the Leviathan DLC information, vague as it is, can be safely treated as fun-facts to know about the origins of the Reapers. Not meeting the 'intelligence' in person certainly didn't detract from my personal enjoyment.

Really?  I stand corrected then, I assumed the two projects were one and the same.  My apologies.

As for the Leviathan DLC, eh, I disagree.  But then it's clear we're of two different stances.  Still, I can understand how you feel about it.  I just wish we'd gotten Leviathan first before the EC.

[KwangtungTiger]

JamesFaith wrote...

Well, there should be few reason why people "hate" it.

1. Supporters of MEHEM are using it as weapon against people who like endings. When some people here constantly bashing thing you like and connecting it with "MEHEM is superior, MEHEM is only right ending, MEHEM is better then crap you like, MEHEM this and MEHEM that... It isn't surprising that people react on it hostily after some time.

2. Double standards of some MEHEM supporters: harsh critic of ME3 endings = OK, harsh critic of MEHEM = hate.

I personally don't consider MEHEM good, but I don't hate it and appreciate work behind it. But I´m still annoyed by how some people here pushing MEHEM as superb solution of ME3 problems in too many discussions and attacking me with it.

The same could be said for Bioware fanboys who cant take criticism towards ME3.

Respect the fact that the people for MEHEM put so much of their own time and effort into it. You dont have to like it but hating to just hate it for the sake of Bioware is kinda childish.

I dont personally have it downloaded and harbor no extreme negative or positive feelings for ME3 so take it for what you will.........

[Splinter Cell 108]

JamesFaith wrote...

2. Double standards of some MEHEM supporters: harsh critic of ME3 endings = OK, harsh critic of MEHEM = hate.
.

I don't think this is the same, on one hand the original endings are not optional, you can't choose to get rid of them even if you don't like them, well at least if you don't have PC you can't. I doubt anyone who gets MEHEM will have a high opinon of the endings. If they tell others that they are stupid because they chose the original endings, that's another story. I don't know if someone does this or not but I haven't seen it, However, I do see the opposite of that way more often. 

[Reorte]

JamesFaith wrote...

2. Double standards of some MEHEM supporters: harsh critic of ME3 endings = OK, harsh critic of MEHEM = hate.

Considering the resources available and what they have to work with I don't see double standards. MEHEM is far more constrained, purely by the practical limitations of trying to mod a game never intended for modding, and without the resources of BioWare. The ME3 endings on the other hand had a massively less constrained canvas to work with.