486 réponses à ce sujet

[Reorte]

Sad, this was a sensible discussion about its pros and cons and but been hijacked by those who trot out "lalala butthurt!" every time MEHEM is mentioned.

Modifié par Reorte, 18 octobre 2013 - 12:36 .

[Grand Admiral Cheesecake]

David7204 wrote...

Given your very 'internet-esque' diction that clearly reflects an awful lot of...investment, I would say, in such culture, I'm guessing you pulled them off a forum. So I think I would be more annoyed by you saying you made them up. Because that way I would suspect you to be lying.

David Satire and Snark happen because there are people like me in the world. People who are willing to make the cutting remark, fire the witty retort, and discuss the taboo topics.

This makes you feel powerless David and that is why you make yourself the champion of heroism because you cannot accept the power people like me have over you.

Modifié par Grand Admiral Cheesecake, 18 octobre 2013 - 12:42 .

[Br3admax]

David7204 wrote...

If people think the ending is bad enough that MEHEM is better, that's fine. I can understand that.

However, the problem is when people claim people that MEHEM is good. That MEHEM is a perfect ending or something close to it. That MEHEM is how ME 3 should have ended!

Now, of course, some people who support MEHEM will deny that left and right. They'll claim MEHEM is nothing but a mod for the endings, not designed to be 'perfect,' not designed to solve any of a problems.

But the evidence points otherwise.

What evidence? The evidence of what people claim is supposedly good. You look over posts of what people think would be a 'perfect ending' to ME 3, and they're overwhelmingly functionally identical to MEHEM. Shepard and everyone survives. The Reapers are ignored or handwaved because Shepard is just that awesome. Every problem is solve by the Crucible being some EMP or some other easy-peasy brainless solution that is of course narratively ridiculous.

Uh..yeah..that's true I guess. That's a really good point, to be honest. 

Personally, I don't care one way or the other. It's just another ending to me. All of them pretty pointless and ignorable. 

[Br3admax]

Inquisitor Recon wrote...

I miss the weekly "the ending has left me horribly depressed" thread.

Much better than the now weekly, "I finally moved on" thread or the "Why doesn't it make sense," thread.

[Grand Admiral Cheesecake]

Br3ad wrote...

Inquisitor Recon wrote...

I miss the weekly "the ending has left me horribly depressed" thread.

Much better than the now weekly, "I finally moved on" thread or the "Why doesn't it make sense," thread.

I miss Bill Casey most of all.

[Cainhurst Crow]

David7204 wrote...

If people think the ending is bad enough that MEHEM is better, that's fine. I can understand that.

However, the problem is when people claim people that MEHEM is good. That MEHEM is a perfect ending or something close to it. That MEHEM is how ME 3 should have ended!

Now, of course, some people who support MEHEM will deny that left and right. They'll claim MEHEM is nothing but a mod for the endings, not designed to be 'perfect,' not designed to solve any of a problems.

But the evidence points otherwise.

What evidence? The evidence of what people claim is supposedly good. You look over posts of what people think would be a 'perfect ending' to ME 3, and they're overwhelmingly functionally identical to MEHEM. Shepard and everyone survives. The Reapers are ignored or handwaved because Shepard is just that awesome. Every problem is solve by the Crucible being some EMP or some other easy-peasy brainless solution that is of course narratively ridiculous.

David7204 wrote...

The problem is the hypocrisy from
countless players that ignore extremely serious problems in MEHEM that
they would practically devote their lives to complaining about if they
were in the actual game.

Why can't you post this sensibly more often? I'd love to sit down and have a coffee with this david.

Cthulhu42 wrote...

I'm actually rather baffled by MEHEM, as I don't see it offering anything significant that High-EMS Destroy doesn't.

That's easy, everyone loves seeing someone get their self insert fanfiction animated. "This is admiral author avatar, here to be the only ship that helps you guys defeat the reapers while big bad hackett runs away."

[Cainhurst Crow]

Miscellaneous Mind wrote...

Bill Casey was something else. Every time he comes up, I have to post this:

The Ballad of Bill Casey

You know him and synthesis should have just worked out their problems and gotten back together.

Their break out didn't do anything for him.

[spirosz]

But I want Jack.

[Dean_the_Young]

I don't mind people enjoying MEHEM has head-canon wish fulfillment. I find it silly, underwhelming, and far more flawed than its advocates would like it to be taken (words of 'serious' and 'superior quality' have been used in the past), but then I find a lot of fanfiction projects like that. People find the same with my head-canon fanfiction projects. Tastes differ.

I get annoyed when people begin using MEHEM (or Indoctrination Theory, or other headcanon) as actual canon and begin demanding that others, posters or Bioware, respect their headcanon as canon and begin to object to anything else that doesn't take conform to it.

People confusing personal fantasy with canon. That annoys me. Feel free to build up and elaborate your head canon or what-if preferences as much as you desire- don't start demanding me to take part or acknowledge your delusions as equally valid.

[Xilizhra]

Grand Admiral Cheesecake wrote...

David7204 wrote...

Given your very 'internet-esque' diction that clearly reflects an awful lot of...investment, I would say, in such culture, I'm guessing you pulled them off a forum. So I think I would be more annoyed by you saying you made them up. Because that way I would suspect you to be lying.

David Satire and Snark happen because there are people like me in the world. People who are willing to make the cutting remark, fire the witty retort, and discuss the taboo topics.

This makes you feel powerless David and that is why you make yourself the champion of heroism because you cannot accept the power people like me have over you.

I don't see you making single posts that attract the attention of practically everyone in the thread, so... who has power over whom?

Anyway, I'm in two minds about MEHEM. On the one hand, it breaks canon and sort of robs the climax of any narrative weight because it makes everything far too easy. On the other hand, it's leaps and bounds better than Destroy, and I appreciate that it was created due to people who didn't think that synthetic genocide was acceptable, and can appreciate what it was made to do anyway. I don't use it myself, though I've been tempted.

[SlottsMachine]

J. Reezy wrote...

Grand Admiral Cheesecake wrote...

David7204 wrote...

Given your very 'internet-esque' diction that clearly reflects an awful lot of...investment, I would say, in such culture, I'm guessing you pulled them off a forum. So I think I would be more annoyed by you saying you made them up. Because that way I would suspect you to be lying.

David Satire and Snark happen because there are people like me in the world. People who are willing to make the cutting remark, fire the witty retort, and discuss the taboo topics.

This makes you feel powerless David and that is why you make yourself the champion of heroism because you cannot accept the power people like me have over you.

I see what you did there...

DO YOU FEEL IN CHARGE?

[Ravensword]

General Slotts wrote...

J. Reezy wrote...

Grand Admiral Cheesecake wrote...

David7204 wrote...

Given your very 'internet-esque' diction that clearly reflects an awful lot of...investment, I would say, in such culture, I'm guessing you pulled them off a forum. So I think I would be more annoyed by you saying you made them up. Because that way I would suspect you to be lying.

David Satire and Snark happen because there are people like me in the world. People who are willing to make the cutting remark, fire the witty retort, and discuss the taboo topics.

This makes you feel powerless David and that is why you make yourself the champion of heroism because you cannot accept the power people like me have over you.

I see what you did there...

DO YOU FEEL IN CHARGE?

Does this give you power over your heroism or characterization?

[CynicalShep]

Well, this threat went well...


To contribute to the spirit of this thread, I'll just add a ridiculous analogy. MEHEM to me is a bit similar to a big homemade d*ldo. I can appreciate the effort you put into it and I'm glad you enjoy it but don't try to shove it down my throat unless you're ready to deal with the consequences.

To paraphrase that - I realize that someone worked his socks off for free to make it. Props to that guy/guys, whoever they are. It's inferior in quality when compared to the original (imo) but it had pretty big limitations. I'm glad that you like it and it made your experience more enjoyable but don't try to convince me that it's the best thing since sliced bread unless you're ready to hear me tell you why it's not.

Modifié par CynicalShep, 18 octobre 2013 - 04:02 .

[FlamingBoy]

Starting out an argument with "I don't get variable X" is not a good way create an argument, It implies ignorance and closed mindedness. You handicap your argument as soon as its out the gate.

Personal opinion on mehem, it was made with more passion from the fan base than the entire me3 combined. With significantly less resources.

[dreamgazer]

Homemade dildos, Twilight Zone and David talking sensibly?

Frame this one, BSN. It's a winna.

[Nightwriter]

jtav wrote...

I'll never install it because it makes an already linear game more linear. But there are lots of mods I don't install. What I hate is the fan culture around it. Bringing it up in discussions about the canonical endings. Treating it as if it were canon by demanding BW respect it in future games. I write fanwork. I've come up with what I think are clever ways for Shep to survive the Control and Synth endings. But when people want to talk about the endings I can shift back to referring to them as dead/might as well be. Some MEHEM advocate can't or won't treat it as a mod.

I don't see anything wrong with them bringing it up in ending discussions, so long as they aren't trying to say MEHEM is an authentic BioWare ending.

[AcidwireX]

Nightwriter wrote...

jtav wrote...

I'll never install it because it makes an already linear game more linear. But there are lots of mods I don't install. What I hate is the fan culture around it. Bringing it up in discussions about the canonical endings. Treating it as if it were canon by demanding BW respect it in future games. I write fanwork. I've come up with what I think are clever ways for Shep to survive the Control and Synth endings. But when people want to talk about the endings I can shift back to referring to them as dead/might as well be. Some MEHEM advocate can't or won't treat it as a mod.

I don't see anything wrong with them bringing it up in ending discussions, so long as they aren't trying to say MEHEM is an authentic BioWare ending.

To be fair, calling it an 'authentic bioware ending' would be an insult.

[CynicalShep]

AcidwireX wrote...

Nightwriter wrote...

jtav wrote...

I'll never install it because it makes an already linear game more linear. But there are lots of mods I don't install. What I hate is the fan culture around it. Bringing it up in discussions about the canonical endings. Treating it as if it were canon by demanding BW respect it in future games. I write fanwork. I've come up with what I think are clever ways for Shep to survive the Control and Synth endings. But when people want to talk about the endings I can shift back to referring to them as dead/might as well be. Some MEHEM advocate can't or won't treat it as a mod.

I don't see anything wrong with them bringing it up in ending discussions, so long as they aren't trying to say MEHEM is an authentic BioWare ending.

To be fair, calling it an 'authentic bioware ending' would be an insult.

let me guess: an insult to MEHEM?

[Iakus]

Darth Brotarian wrote...

That's easy, everyone loves seeing someone get their self insert fanfiction animated. "This is admiral author avatar, here to be the only ship that helps you guys defeat the reapers while big bad hackett runs away."

0/10

[AcidwireX]

CynicalShep wrote...

AcidwireX wrote...

Nightwriter wrote...

jtav wrote...

I'll never install it because it makes an already linear game more linear. But there are lots of mods I don't install. What I hate is the fan culture around it. Bringing it up in discussions about the canonical endings. Treating it as if it were canon by demanding BW respect it in future games. I write fanwork. I've come up with what I think are clever ways for Shep to survive the Control and Synth endings. But when people want to talk about the endings I can shift back to referring to them as dead/might as well be. Some MEHEM advocate can't or won't treat it as a mod.

I don't see anything wrong with them bringing it up in ending discussions, so long as they aren't trying to say MEHEM is an authentic BioWare ending.

To be fair, calling it an 'authentic bioware ending' would be an insult.

let me guess: an insult to MEHEM?

Thought that was pretty obvious.

[CynicalShep]

AcidwireX wrote...

CynicalShep wrote...

AcidwireX wrote...

Nightwriter wrote...

jtav wrote...

I'll never install it because it makes an already linear game more linear. But there are lots of mods I don't install. What I hate is the fan culture around it. Bringing it up in discussions about the canonical endings. Treating it as if it were canon by demanding BW respect it in future games. I write fanwork. I've come up with what I think are clever ways for Shep to survive the Control and Synth endings. But when people want to talk about the endings I can shift back to referring to them as dead/might as well be. Some MEHEM advocate can't or won't treat it as a mod.

I don't see anything wrong with them bringing it up in ending discussions, so long as they aren't trying to say MEHEM is an authentic BioWare ending.

To be fair, calling it an 'authentic bioware ending' would be an insult.

let me guess: an insult to MEHEM?

Thought that was pretty obvious.

Only if you absolutely loathe ME3's ending AND never touched any other Bioware games. Otherwise the only thing obvious is your exaggeration/trolling. 

[Ieldra]

RatThing wrote...
I don't hate MEHEM, modders can do what they like. It's the idea that people want a cheesy Hollywood ending for the game that bothers me. It's not relevant for this game but for future Mass Effect games probably.

I get the impression my most people who like MEHEM and talk about it a lot that there are indeed many people who want a cheesy Hollywond ending, and I'd take any bet that this impression is entirely correct.

IMO it doesn't bode well for future stories if Bioware takes that impression away from the discussion, and that's the reason why I am critical of MEHEM. Otherwise, I don't have any strong feelings about it. It's a mod I don't use.

Modifié par Ieldra2, 18 octobre 2013 - 10:51 .