1420 réponses à ce sujet

[Xilizhra]

Morocco Mole wrote...

And it wouldn't have happened if he was sent to a circle and got proper training

It would also not have happened if the Circle was so undesirable that his mother especially wanted to keep him out of it... or if he'd gotten proper training outside the Circle.

[cjones91]

Medhia Nox wrote...

And who says I don't?

The only difference is... when a mundane acts out - they throw a wild party. When a mage child throws a temper tantrum - Redcliff dies.

But - more cries of "equality" will surely cover up that disparity.

I propose mandatory Circle training for mage children then,however their parents can visit them if they want to.If the child reaches a certain age and has learned to control their powers then they are allowed to leave the Circle with a templar escort just in case.

[Medhia Nox]

@Xilizhra: I'm not sure what your point is.

When non-magical kid's parents die - they don't go around killing entire towns.

If mage parents were to take care of their children AND they were allowed to be free - any act committed by the child should be held against the parents. Any mage child that damages someone elses property - should be fines or jailtime for the parents. Any mage child who hurts or kills another person on the playground... or while being picked on - the parents should be jailed or executed.

Modifié par Medhia Nox, 24 octobre 2013 - 02:26 .

[Xilizhra]

Morocco Mole wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...
It would also not have happened if the Circle was so undesirable that his mother especially wanted to keep him out of it... or if he'd gotten proper training outside the Circle.

I'd say sending a child to the circle so he won't murder an entire village on accident is a better alternative than "mommy will be sad"

I'd say being sent to a place where they murder you on purpose if you study the wrong things (Irving was condoning entrapment, keep in mind) is problematic in and of itself. Among everything else.

When non-magical kid's parents die - they don't go around killing entire towns.

Neither do most mage children. See the Hawke family.

Modifié par Xilizhra, 24 octobre 2013 - 02:27 .

[Reaverwind]

Xilizhra wrote...

Morocco Mole wrote...

And it wouldn't have happened if he was sent to a circle and got proper training

It would also not have happened if the Circle was so undesirable that his mother especially wanted to keep him out of it... or if he'd gotten proper training outside the Circle.

Bah - you misinterpret the situation. The problem wasn't the Circle was undesirable, the problem was the mother didn't want to lose an heir, not to mention she didn't want it known magic ran in the family. She wanted her son to learn to hide what he was, not master it, remember? Redcliffe was a disaster waiting to happen.

Modifié par Reaverwind, 24 octobre 2013 - 02:27 .

[Xilizhra]

Reaverwind wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...

Morocco Mole wrote...

And it wouldn't have happened if he was sent to a circle and got proper training

It would also not have happened if the Circle was so undesirable that his mother especially wanted to keep him out of it... or if he'd gotten proper training outside the Circle.

Bah - you misinterpret the situation. The problem wasn't the Circle was undesirable, the problem was the mother didn't want to lose an heir, not to mention she didn't want it known magic ran in the family. She wanted her son to learn to hide what he was, not master it, remember? Redcliffe was a disaster waiting to happen.

Then the problem is more magophobic Andrastian claptrap.

[Medhia Nox]

@cjones91: I don't understand why families aren't allowed to visit - except perhaps that it would excite the developing emotions of the young mage.

Not only do I think families should be allowed - but I think "Circle Cities" should be developed where families can relocate to freely mingle with their mage children under supervision. Those families could sell Enchantments! while providing food and manufactured goods for the Circles.

I still would not allow non-Harrowed mages to leave these "City Circles" and yes, mage families would also be policed in a way.

[badboy64]

Medhia Nox wrote...

And who says I don't?

The only difference is... when a mundane acts out - they throw a wild party. When a mage child throws a temper tantrum - Redcliff dies.

But - more cries of "equality" will surely cover up that disparity.

He was trying to save his father and remember he possessed by a desire demon.:innocent: He could barely cast a minor spell(Jowan even said that) little alone summoning or bring back the dead.:innocent:

[Xilizhra]

And this is still a better alternative than an entire village being killed because of a child's inexperiance.

But better alternatives still can be found.

The Hawke family is not "most" mage children or familes. They are the special snowflake family of the protaganist. And even Bethany prefers circle life.

Very temporarily. She comes around by the end.

[Riverdaleswhiteflash]

Xilizhra wrote...

And this is still a better alternative than an entire village being killed because of a child's inexperiance.

But better alternatives still can be found.

We'll need to know a little bit more about how safe Rivain was before I decide that. (Unless you have evidence something else works?)

The Hawke family is not "most" mage children or familes. They are the special snowflake family of the protaganist. And even Bethany prefers circle life.

Very temporarily. She comes around by the end.

Doesn't she note that she might have thought differently under anyone besides Mere-death?

Modifié par Riverdaleswhiteflash, 24 octobre 2013 - 02:39 .

[Medhia Nox]

@badboy64: Doesn't change what he did.

I am not anti-mage - but what I am VERY much against, is - like in a situation like Redcliff - saying that Connor is the only relevant person. Poor Connor.

Presumably an entire major town in Ferelden was virtually wiped out by one mage child who accepted possession because he was trained by a moron.

People are acting like children don't disobey their parents.

How many parents overlook drug addiction?  Drug addiction isn't a demon with magical spells. 

Modifié par Medhia Nox, 24 octobre 2013 - 02:44 .

[dragonflight288]

The Hawke family is not "most" mage children or familes. They are the special snowflake family of the protaganist. And even Bethany prefers circle life.

You're right, the Hawke's were able to raise their children without the Chantry taking them away at birth. That's quite unusual.

[Xilizhra]

We'll need to know a little bit more about how safe Rivain was before I decide that. (Unless you have evidence something else works?)

Given the numerous horrible things that have happened within Circles, I doubt they qualify as all that safe to begin with.

Doesn't she note that she might have thought differently under anyone besides Mere-death?

Theoretically possible, will never be known. From what we see of the White Spire in Asunder, Ferelden was more of an exception than Kirkwall was.

Let's not forget Meredith's sister either.

Same scenario as Connor.

[dragonflight288]

Morocco Mole wrote...

Let's not forget Meredith's sister either.

An untrained mage who grew up outside the Circle? The event there seems commonplace so long as the mage remains untrained.

If raised by parents AND receive the necessary training, then the issue is severely diminished. 

[Riverdaleswhiteflash]

Xilizhra wrote...

We'll need to know a little bit more about how safe Rivain was before I decide that. (Unless you have evidence something else works?)

Given the numerous horrible things that have happened within Circles, I doubt they qualify as all that safe to begin with.

What I meant is that we don't know how many abominations went rampaging through Rivain.

Doesn't she note that she might have thought differently under anyone besides Mere-death?

Theoretically possible, will never be known. From what we see of the White Spire in Asunder, Ferelden was more of an exception than Kirkwall was.

Entirely possible. But that doesn't mean that a Circle can't be run well. Just that the Chantry fails at this more than they succeed. (Which, I suppose, is a good argument for the original premise of this thread.)

Let's not forget Meredith's sister either.

Same scenario as Connor.

Then the abomination in "Have You Seen Me?"

Modifié par Riverdaleswhiteflash, 24 octobre 2013 - 02:58 .

[Xilizhra]

What I meant is that we don't know how many abominations went rampaging through Rivain.

Then I suppose we shall see.

Entirely possible. But that doesn't mean that a Circle can't be run well. Just that the Chantry fails at this more than they succeed. (Which, I suppose, is a good argument for the original premise of this thread.)

I don't believe that a Circle can be run well with the Templar Order being what it is.

Then the abomination in "Have You Seen Me?"

What?

[EmperorSahlertz]

dragonflight288 wrote...

The Hawke family is not "most" mage children or familes. They are the special snowflake family of the protaganist. And even Bethany prefers circle life.

You're right, the Hawke's were able to raise their children without the Chantry taking them away at birth. That's quite unusual.

Malcolm was a Circle Mage though, so technically the trainning the Hawkes recieved would have been similar to, if not the same, as a Circle Mage.

[dragonflight288]

EmperorSahlertz wrote...

dragonflight288 wrote...

The Hawke family is not "most" mage children or familes. They are the special snowflake family of the protaganist. And even Bethany prefers circle life.

You're right, the Hawke's were able to raise their children without the Chantry taking them away at birth. That's quite unusual.

Malcolm was a Circle Mage though, so technically the trainning the Hawkes recieved would have been similar to, if not the same, as a Circle Mage.

This is evidence then that Circle mages can raise children without fear, if the children are propery trained should they be mages, and if the parent-mage is also trained. 

[Riverdaleswhiteflash]

Xilizhra wrote...

Entirely possible. But that doesn't mean that a Circle can't be run well. Just that the Chantry fails at this more than they succeed. (Which, I suppose, is a good argument for the original premise of this thread.)

I don't believe that a Circle can be run well with the Templar Order being what it is.

That doesn't mean that one can't be run well. Just that the current guards need to be reformed a lot.

Then the abomination in "Have You Seen Me?"

What?

There's a group of apostate mages that operate with relative autonomy from the Chantry due to bribing the Templars, and one of their apprentices turns to blood magic. The master tries to kill him, the apprentice goes abomination, and if the Warden hadn't stumbled onto the abomination by chance there's no telling how long it would have survived in (and knowing abominations, rampaged through) the wilderness.

[LobselVith8]

Morocco Mole wrote...

The Hawke family is not "most" mage children or familes. They are the special snowflake family of the protaganist. And even Bethany prefers circle life.

An apostate family, which isn't unprecedented, given the Mages Collective working with mages outside the Chantry. The Warden can even help protect apostates by working with this organization. Being apostates doesn't make the Hawke family 'special snowflakes' at all.

And I recall Circle mage Bethany saying that life in the Circle taught her that mages should be free.