1420 réponses à ce sujet

[cjones91]

EmperorSahlertz wrote...

Yes, some Abominations can and will always happen. But when you can actually prevent some of them, save human lives, wouldn't you? Or would you just let these people die and just go "meh", even though you knew you could have done something to save them?
Should the Netherlands not build levees to try and mitigate the damages of flood? Should they leave their people to die, just because SOME floods will always happen?

That's why I will always advocate several templar bases post around the major points In Thedas.Several patrols would be done once a week into surrounding villages to make sure there are no abominations about.

[cjones91]

Riverdaleswhiteflash wrote...

cjones91 wrote...

Riverdaleswhiteflash wrote...

cjones91 wrote...

That is not what she implied.Silfren said that you can't always prevent a disaster even if you do everything right and sometimes abomination attacks will happen.

As for the last part of your post.....I have a suggestion:Let's lock up everyone including mages because clearly they are all dangerous.Sounds ridiculus does'nt it?So is expecting every mage to deal with being locked up for simply existing.

Locking up all mages sounds less ridiculous than locking everyone up. Especially since mages are a minority and the only ones capable of going abomination. So even assuming the mage wasn't inclined to abuse his/her powers there's more reason to lock mages up than anyone else, and its a good deal more practical than 1984ing the population with medieval technology levels.

Non mages can become abominations as well,such as the ones in Asunder.

Bearing in mind that I've never read Asunder, I can tell you categorically that the things in it were either possessed mages or not abominations. That's literally in the setting's definition of abomination.

Abominations are technically the result of a demon possessing someone whether they are dead or alive.For example Revenants are dead powerful warriors who are possessed by either Pride or Desire demons.

[Riverdaleswhiteflash]

cjones91 wrote...

Riverdaleswhiteflash wrote...

cjones91 wrote...

Riverdaleswhiteflash wrote...

Locking up all mages sounds less ridiculous than locking everyone up. Especially since mages are a minority and the only ones capable of going abomination. So even assuming the mage wasn't inclined to abuse his/her powers there's more reason to lock mages up than anyone else, and its a good deal more practical than 1984ing the population with medieval technology levels.

Non mages can become abominations as well,such as the ones in Asunder.

Bearing in mind that I've never read Asunder, I can tell you categorically that the things in it were either possessed mages or not abominations. That's literally in the setting's definition of abomination.

Abominations are technically the result of a demon possessing someone whether they are dead or alive.

No they aren't.

[Hellion Rex]

cjones91 wrote...

Riverdaleswhiteflash wrote...

cjones91 wrote...

Riverdaleswhiteflash wrote...

cjones91 wrote...

That is not what she implied.Silfren said that you can't always prevent a disaster even if you do everything right and sometimes abomination attacks will happen.

As for the last part of your post.....I have a suggestion:Let's lock up everyone including mages because clearly they are all dangerous.Sounds ridiculus does'nt it?So is expecting every mage to deal with being locked up for simply existing.

Locking up all mages sounds less ridiculous than locking everyone up. Especially since mages are a minority and the only ones capable of going abomination. So even assuming the mage wasn't inclined to abuse his/her powers there's more reason to lock mages up than anyone else, and its a good deal more practical than 1984ing the population with medieval technology levels.

Non mages can become abominations as well,such as the ones in Asunder.

Bearing in mind that I've never read Asunder, I can tell you categorically that the things in it were either possessed mages or not abominations. That's literally in the setting's definition of abomination.

Abominations are technically the result of a demon possessing someone whether they are dead or alive.For example Revenants are dead powerful warriors who are possessed by either Pride or Desire demons.

Technically no. Abominations are when a person with magical capabiltiies is possessed.
"An abomination is a creature created when a demon possesses a living being with magical abilities"
Taken from the wiki. The wording is very technical.

Edit: D*mn you riverdaleswhiteflash. 'd

Modifié par eluvianix, 25 octobre 2013 - 03:09 .

[Jaison1986]

Abomination or not, Revenants are just as deadly, if not more.

[cjones91]

eluvianix wrote...

cjones91 wrote...

Riverdaleswhiteflash wrote...

cjones91 wrote...

Riverdaleswhiteflash wrote...

cjones91 wrote...

That is not what she implied.Silfren said that you can't always prevent a disaster even if you do everything right and sometimes abomination attacks will happen.

As for the last part of your post.....I have a suggestion:Let's lock up everyone including mages because clearly they are all dangerous.Sounds ridiculus does'nt it?So is expecting every mage to deal with being locked up for simply existing.

Locking up all mages sounds less ridiculous than locking everyone up. Especially since mages are a minority and the only ones capable of going abomination. So even assuming the mage wasn't inclined to abuse his/her powers there's more reason to lock mages up than anyone else, and its a good deal more practical than 1984ing the population with medieval technology levels.

Non mages can become abominations as well,such as the ones in Asunder.

Bearing in mind that I've never read Asunder, I can tell you categorically that the things in it were either possessed mages or not abominations. That's literally in the setting's definition of abomination.

Abominations are technically the result of a demon possessing someone whether they are dead or alive.For example Revenants are dead powerful warriors who are possessed by either Pride or Desire demons.

Technically no. Abominations are when a person with magical capabiltiies is possessed.
[color=rgb(213,212,212)">"An ] is a creature created when a [/color]demon possesses a living being with magical abilities"
Taken from the wiki. The wording is very technical.

Then explain beings like Revenants?They are clearly possessed by powerful demons and can use magical abilities because of that.A single Revenant can wipe out entire armies just a abomination so they should count as one.

[EmperorSahlertz]

The fact that the Pride Demon possessing the ruler of Kaiten was an Abomination simply means that the ruler of Kaiten was an apostate.

[Hellion Rex]

cjones91 wrote...

eluvianix wrote...

cjones91 wrote...

Riverdaleswhiteflash wrote...

cjones91 wrote...

Riverdaleswhiteflash wrote...

cjones91 wrote...

That is not what she implied.Silfren said that you can't always prevent a disaster even if you do everything right and sometimes abomination attacks will happen.

As for the last part of your post.....I have a suggestion:Let's lock up everyone including mages because clearly they are all dangerous.Sounds ridiculus does'nt it?So is expecting every mage to deal with being locked up for simply existing.

Locking up all mages sounds less ridiculous than locking everyone up. Especially since mages are a minority and the only ones capable of going abomination. So even assuming the mage wasn't inclined to abuse his/her powers there's more reason to lock mages up than anyone else, and its a good deal more practical than 1984ing the population with medieval technology levels.

Non mages can become abominations as well,such as the ones in Asunder.

Bearing in mind that I've never read Asunder, I can tell you categorically that the things in it were either possessed mages or not abominations. That's literally in the setting's definition of abomination.

Abominations are technically the result of a demon possessing someone whether they are dead or alive.For example Revenants are dead powerful warriors who are possessed by either Pride or Desire demons.

Technically no. Abominations are when a person with magical capabiltiies is possessed.
[color=rgb(213,212,212)">"An ] is a creature created when a [/color]demon possesses a living being with magical abilities"
Taken from the wiki. The wording is very technical.

Then explain beings like Revenants?They are clearly possessed by powerful demons and can use magical abilities because of that.A single Revenant can wipe out entire armies just a abomination so they should count as one.

However, revenants are demons that possess the fallen. "Revenants are powerful or pride demons inhabiting the corpses of the fallen" --- Wiki

Modifié par eluvianix, 25 octobre 2013 - 03:14 .

[cjones91]

Jaison1986 wrote...

Abomination or not, Revenants are just as deadly, if not more.

Yeah,Revenants can wipe out entire platoons and have the power of the Desire or Pride demon possessing them.I figured they should be counted as a abomination since they use their own abilities and those of the demon.

[EmperorSahlertz]

cjones91 wrote...

eluvianix wrote...

cjones91 wrote...

Riverdaleswhiteflash wrote...

cjones91 wrote...

Riverdaleswhiteflash wrote...

cjones91 wrote...

That is not what she implied.Silfren said that you can't always prevent a disaster even if you do everything right and sometimes abomination attacks will happen.

As for the last part of your post.....I have a suggestion:Let's lock up everyone including mages because clearly they are all dangerous.Sounds ridiculus does'nt it?So is expecting every mage to deal with being locked up for simply existing.

Locking up all mages sounds less ridiculous than locking everyone up. Especially since mages are a minority and the only ones capable of going abomination. So even assuming the mage wasn't inclined to abuse his/her powers there's more reason to lock mages up than anyone else, and its a good deal more practical than 1984ing the population with medieval technology levels.

Non mages can become abominations as well,such as the ones in Asunder.

Bearing in mind that I've never read Asunder, I can tell you categorically that the things in it were either possessed mages or not abominations. That's literally in the setting's definition of abomination.

Abominations are technically the result of a demon possessing someone whether they are dead or alive.For example Revenants are dead powerful warriors who are possessed by either Pride or Desire demons.

Technically no. Abominations are when a person with magical capabiltiies is possessed.
[color=rgb(213,212,212)">"An ] is a creature created when a [/color]demon possesses a living being with magical abilities"
Taken from the wiki. The wording is very technical.

Then explain beings like Revenants?They are clearly possessed by powerful demons and can use magical abilities because of that.A single Revenant can wipe out entire armies just a abomination so they should count as one.

Demons have acess to magical Abilities regardless of host. But a Revenant is NOT an Abomination. A mundane possessed by a demon is NOT an Abomination.

[Hellion Rex]

cjones91 wrote...

Jaison1986 wrote...

Abomination or not, Revenants are just as deadly, if not more.

Yeah,Revenants can wipe out entire platoons and have the power of the Desire or Pride demon possessing them.I figured they should be counted as a abomination since they use their own abilities and those of the demon.

They are posssessing the dead though, not the living.

[Riverdaleswhiteflash]

cjones91 wrote...


Then explain beings like Revenants?They are clearly possessed by powerful demons and can use magical abilities because of that.A single Revenant can wipe out entire armies just a abomination so they should count as one.

Exactly. They have powerful magic because of the demon. Abominations have that and the mage's magic.

[Hellion Rex]

EmperorSahlertz wrote...

cjones91 wrote...

eluvianix wrote...

cjones91 wrote...

Riverdaleswhiteflash wrote...

cjones91 wrote...

Riverdaleswhiteflash wrote...

cjones91 wrote...

That is not what she implied.Silfren said that you can't always prevent a disaster even if you do everything right and sometimes abomination attacks will happen.

As for the last part of your post.....I have a suggestion:Let's lock up everyone including mages because clearly they are all dangerous.Sounds ridiculus does'nt it?So is expecting every mage to deal with being locked up for simply existing.

Locking up all mages sounds less ridiculous than locking everyone up. Especially since mages are a minority and the only ones capable of going abomination. So even assuming the mage wasn't inclined to abuse his/her powers there's more reason to lock mages up than anyone else, and its a good deal more practical than 1984ing the population with medieval technology levels.

Non mages can become abominations as well,such as the ones in Asunder.

Bearing in mind that I've never read Asunder, I can tell you categorically that the things in it were either possessed mages or not abominations. That's literally in the setting's definition of abomination.

Abominations are technically the result of a demon possessing someone whether they are dead or alive.For example Revenants are dead powerful warriors who are possessed by either Pride or Desire demons.

Technically no. Abominations are when a person with magical capabiltiies is possessed.
[color=rgb(213,212,212)">"An ] is a creature created when a [/color]demon possesses a living being with magical abilities"
Taken from the wiki. The wording is very technical.

Then explain beings like Revenants?They are clearly possessed by powerful demons and can use magical abilities because of that.A single Revenant can wipe out entire armies just a abomination so they should count as one.

Demons have acess to magical Abilities regardless of host. But a Revenant is NOT an Abomination. A mundane possessed by a demon is NOT an Abomination.

Difference is that revenants are possessed dead, not living people.

[EmperorSahlertz]

The difference is that it isn't an Abomination even if the host had been living...... A revenant is the possessed corpse of a powerful warrior, not a mage. Had it been the possessed corpse of a powerful mage, then it would have been an Arcane Horror, and in this case had the subject been alive, it would have been an Abomination.

[Hellion Rex]

EmperorSahlertz wrote...

The difference is that it isn't an Abomination even if the host had been living...... A revenant is the possessed corpse of a powerful warrior, not a mage. Had it been the possessed corpse of a powerful mage, then it would have been an Arcane Horror, and in this case had the subject been alive, it would have been an Abomination.

I am fully aware of  that. I am just disputing what the others were saying primarily because a revenant isn't even a possessing a live person.

[Medhia Nox]

@EmperorSalhertz: Actually - it's possible that a mage "possessed" by a demon isn't an abomination in the truest sense either.

I'd like to know what those meaty faced "abominations" in the DA:O Circle tower were... I believe they were "True" abominations. And those are different - they're a fusion of demon and mage - something new. They say so - a natural evolution of what all mages are to become (according to them).

While a possessed individual seems different.

The truth is - Connor could have been using his own magical capacity to do what he did to Redcliff, all it would take is the demon knowing his capabilities. I've never had the impression that mages in Thedas "learn" spells - but rather that they "uncover inherent capabilities".

[Reaverwind]

Medhia Nox wrote...

@EmperorSalhertz: Actually - it's possible that a mage "possessed" by a demon isn't an abomination in the truest sense either.

I'd like to know what those meaty faced "abominations" in the DA:O Circle tower were... I believe they were "True" abominations. And those are different - they're a fusion of demon and mage - something new. They say so - a natural evolution of what all mages are to become (according to them).

While a possessed individual seems different.

The truth is - Connor could have been using his own magical capacity to do what he did to Redcliff, all it would take is the demon knowing his capabilities. I've never had the impression that mages in Thedas "learn" spells - but rather that they "uncover inherent capabilities".

Accodring to the lore, those mutated abominations occur due to a weaker demon's inability to adapt to their new state. Stronger demons are able to retain the possessed mage's original shape. 

[Hellion Rex]

Reaverwind wrote...

Medhia Nox wrote...

@EmperorSalhertz: Actually - it's possible that a mage "possessed" by a demon isn't an abomination in the truest sense either.

I'd like to know what those meaty faced "abominations" in the DA:O Circle tower were... I believe they were "True" abominations. And those are different - they're a fusion of demon and mage - something new. They say so - a natural evolution of what all mages are to become (according to them).

While a possessed individual seems different.

The truth is - Connor could have been using his own magical capacity to do what he did to Redcliff, all it would take is the demon knowing his capabilities. I've never had the impression that mages in Thedas "learn" spells - but rather that they "uncover inherent capabilities".

Accodring to the lore, those mutated abominations occur due to a weaker demon's inability to adapt to their new state. Stronger demons are able to retain the possessed mage's original shape. 

That makes sense. Connor was able to retain his shape due to being held by a pretty powerful desire demon. 

[Hellion Rex]

Medhia Nox wrote...

@EmperorSalhertz: Actually - it's possible that a mage "possessed" by a demon isn't an abomination in the truest sense either.

I'd like to know what those meaty faced "abominations" in the DA:O Circle tower were... I believe they were "True" abominations. And those are different - they're a fusion of demon and mage - something new. They say so - a natural evolution of what all mages are to become (according to them).

While a possessed individual seems different.

The truth is - Connor could have been using his own magical capacity to do what he did to Redcliff, all it would take is the demon knowing his capabilities. I've never had the impression that mages in Thedas "learn" spells - but rather that they "uncover inherent capabilities".

You bring up a good point. And demons would be able to unlock a mage's hidden potential and perhaps supercharge them as well.

[Boycott Bioware]

Demons, demons...everywhere...

Recently, i have this thinking that demons and spirit are just symbolic in DA, they shown them visually but they are not real.Those demons and spirit representing values, positive and negative value.

In Anders case, it shown that Justice is not a being, it's Anders himself. The demons and spirits are the person themselves. Look at Bartrand, he did the killings and all those notorious things are not on behest of Demon, he's just super crazy, like Meredith. If not Demon who make them like that then what?

Demons and Spirits are creatures of the Fade, the Fade is the land of illusions, so if they come into real world, they can't be real. Only Mages who can make them look real because Mages have strong connection to the Fade. They seems like "summoning Demons" while actually they just materialize their evilness in real world in the shape of "Demons"

But what about the undead?

If demons are real and want to possess the living, why they choose to possess the dead? Why not they just possess all the dead in Thedas and making zombie apocalypse? So i think undeads are not possessed by demons or spirit, they are animated by some telekinetic energy, or remote controlled..or just a product of anomalies

just a thought

[LOLandStuff]

If demons are just illusions, then what's that killing you? A heart attack?

[Silfren]

Qistina wrote...

Demons, demons...everywhere...

Recently, i have this thinking that demons and spirit are just symbolic in DA, they shown them visually but they are not real.Those demons and spirit representing values, positive and negative value.

In Anders case, it shown that Justice is not a being, it's Anders himself. The demons and spirits are the person themselves. Look at Bartrand, he did the killings and all those notorious things are not on behest of Demon, he's just super crazy, like Meredith. If not Demon who make them like that then what?

Demons and Spirits are creatures of the Fade, the Fade is the land of illusions, so if they come into real world, they can't be real. Only Mages who can make them look real because Mages have strong connection to the Fade. They seems like "summoning Demons" while actually they just materialize their evilness in real world in the shape of "Demons"

But what about the undead?

If demons are real and want to possess the living, why they choose to possess the dead? Why not they just possess all the dead in Thedas and making zombie apocalypse? So i think undeads are not possessed by demons or spirit, they are animated by some telekinetic energy, or remote controlled..or just a product of anomalies

just a thought

Not a really tenable one, though.  Bioware isn't going to pull a stunt like this; it's amateurish writing and it would cheapen the whole experience.

It's already clearly established why demons possess the dead: they don't understand how the mortal world works, and sometimes they possess dead bodies thinking that they're possessing living persons. 

It is NOT shown that Justice is not a being, if, going by the rest of this, you are trying to suggest he doesn't or never existed.  I'm not sure where you're getting this at all.  There's a huge question as to whether Justice is the same being he was prior to the merger, or whether he's been twisted into Vengeance, or he and Anders became a new being altogether, but Justice himself definitely was a being in his own right prior to their fateful decision to join together.
Also, that Bartrand and Meredith did what they did while under the influence of the idol doesn't stand as an argument for whether demons and spirits are real or just illusions.  I can't begin to understand why you're using Bartrand's actions to defend your theory about Fade denizens not being real.

There's a difference between being a "land of illusions" and being an imagnary world.  The Fade isn't solid and immutable in the same way that the mortal world is, but that does NOT mean that the world itself is an illusion in the sense of being totally imaginary.  The creatures living in it are decidedly real.

Modifié par Silfren, 25 octobre 2013 - 06:30 .

[Riverdaleswhiteflash]

Medhia Nox wrote...

I've never had the impression that mages in Thedas "learn" spells - but rather that they "uncover inherent capabilities".

What is learning, if not that?

[Androme]

Riverdaleswhiteflash wrote...

Androme wrote...

 No real reason. People hate on the chantry because the chantry represents authority and the ''status-quo''. Most people on these forums are young teenagers in their rebellious years who goes mad whenever they see something representing those two things, very comparable to the deity ''Saradomin'' in the game RuneScape, despite simply wanting to protect people, he's the most hated deity

While I haven't actively paid attention in quite some time, isn't Guthix the one who found the antidote to the poison both Saradomin and Zamorak were using to devestating effect on each other's armies?

I think you might be refering to Guthix stopping the ''God Wars'' (which Zamorak started) by banishing the gods, and establishing the ''Edicts of Guthix'' which prevented the gods from interfering with the world.. Or? I'm pretty much into the lore of the game but I haven't ever heard of that antidote and poison thing you're talking about 

Edit: Also quite recently Jagex has started actually focusing on the lore of RuneScape, which unfortunately involves alot of retcons and new lore so you might remember the RuneScape lore very differently from how it is today.

Modifié par Androme, 25 octobre 2013 - 08:08 .

[Riverdaleswhiteflash]

Androme wrote...

Riverdaleswhiteflash wrote...

Androme wrote...

 No real reason. People hate on the chantry because the chantry represents authority and the ''status-quo''. Most people on these forums are young teenagers in their rebellious years who goes mad whenever they see something representing those two things, very comparable to the deity ''Saradomin'' in the game RuneScape, despite simply wanting to protect people, he's the most hated deity

While I haven't actively paid attention in quite some time, isn't Guthix the one who found the antidote to the poison both Saradomin and Zamorak were using to devestating effect on each other's armies?

I think you might be refering to Guthix stopping the ''God Wars'' (which Zamorak started) by banishing the gods, and establishing the ''Edicts of Guthix'' which prevented the gods from interfering with the world.. Or? I'm pretty much into the lore of the game but I haven't ever heard of that antidote and poison thing you're talking about 

That I know he did. As for the poison, I think I read something about that somewhere but don't really remember it well.

As for the Edit... well, I'm used to that kind of thing. When I started Dragon Slayer it was just a simple "Dragon's over here, kill it for no reason" quest. Then they actually added a backstory, gave a reason the map was scattered... that kind of thing. All before I finished the quest. Then there's what the Warcraft Games did to the lore around how Gul'dan died. And you can't really say Bioware's never done this.

Modifié par Riverdaleswhiteflash, 25 octobre 2013 - 08:23 .