128 réponses à ce sujet

[Plaintiff]

More gay male romance options, but I don't think delays are typically conducive to the addition of content. In my expeirence a delay means they're struggling with the work load they already have.

And, while I'm waiting, more information about the game; information about features, screencaps of locations and characters, gameplay footage.

Something that would demonstrate to me that they were making progress.

Modifié par Plaintiff, 31 octobre 2013 - 04:49 .

[Knight of Dane]

Plaintiff wrote...

More gay male romance options.

And, while I'm waiting, more information about the game; information about features, screencaps of locations and characters, gameplay footage.

Something that would demonstrate to me that they were making progress.

Something like a screenshot of Varric with his coat slighly more opened?

[Plaintiff]

Knight of Dane wrote...

Plaintiff wrote...

More gay male romance options.

And, while I'm waiting, more information about the game; information about features, screencaps of locations and characters, gameplay footage.

Something that would demonstrate to me that they were making progress.

Something like a screenshot of Varric with his coat slighly more opened?

No, that wouldn't qualify.

I would want more info about how the Keeps work, maybe introduce another party member and drop some hints about their role in the story. Some combat footage of the Rogue class, if there is a rogue class. More info about class systems and specialisations.

Modifié par Plaintiff, 31 octobre 2013 - 04:55 .

[Knight of Dane]

Wasn't there footage of them controlling Varric in combat? He's supposed to be a rogue.

[Plaintiff]

Knight of Dane wrote...

Wasn't there footage of them controlling Varric in combat? He's supposed to be a rogue.

He didn't do anything particularly interesting, and I'm more interested in Dual Wield combat, because that's how I roll.

But I don't think there is a delay. That there is vague uncertainty about the deadline doesn't concern me at this time. The deadline is still about a year away, anything could happen in that time. Uncertainty is natural for anyone who can't see the future.

[Fredward]

MissCurlsbel wrote...

Filament wrote...
If you had to explain the process to her, how would the question be disingenuous? It would simply be ignorant. I don't see the need to throw this kind of accusation around without giving the benefit of the doubt first.

I believe Mr. Gaider only meant to educate on this one. I don't think he meant any harm by it...

The word "disingenuous" is the clincher here. I don't think it's common knowledge that things would still be cut after two (potential) delays. Like Filament said it's ignorant not disengenuous. Of course it could have just been a poor choice of words. But I'd be lying if I said I didn't think Gaider had a backhanded way of speaking to people here on the BSN. Understandable given how acrid this place can get but it's certainly not always justified, this being a good example.

[Rodia Driftwood]

I'm pretty sure this has been suggested a kagillion times already, but can we get a new game plus?

[SirGladiator]

I think the key cause of the misunderstanding is that when the year-long delay was announced a while back, it was stated that because of the delay they now had time to add various races to the game. Nothing was mentioned of things being cut, only being added to the game. So now comes word of another 'possible' delay, it's only natural that folks would ask the question 'OK, so what are they going to use that time to add?' not 'what are they going to cut?' since from what we had already heard before, delay=time for more things to be added. Hearing DG's comments makes you wonder if things were also cut from the game because of the first delay as well, or only would be cut if they had to delay it a second time. It had never occured to me (or probably most folks here) that the delay could result in 'less' things in the game (of course that's probably because they explicitly stated that they were adding things to the game because of the delay, and never mentioned anything about cuts) , so news that a second delay would not only suck because we'd have to wait longer, but also because it would involve cuts in the game is doubly surprising and unfortunate. Here's hoping it doesn't come to that.

[RR1107]

I just hope Bioware takes as long as they need to make an excellent game, and not rush out with something that is buggy or isn't fun.

[Little Princess Peach]

the new duke nukem game was horrid and the devs that made that gave had a very long time to finish it and polish it off, but it seemed rushed non the less, I don't mind waiting for the game even if it is "polished" or not people will still find faults with the game and complain

[Fast Jimmy]

Rodia Driftwood wrote...

I'm pretty sure this has been suggested a kagillion times already, but can we get a new game plus?

Hide this post! Before crimsontearz sees it!

[Sylvius the Mad]

The Wolf Man wrote...

Pff. Define "talk". Gaider is rude when he decides to troll a thread. Someone even called him out on it earlier in this thread. 

Gaider is not rude.  He's often terse, but those aren't the same thing.

[zMataxa]

Sylvius the Mad wrote...

The Wolf Man wrote...

Pff. Define "talk". Gaider is rude when he decides to troll a thread. Someone even called him out on it earlier in this thread. 

Gaider is not rude.  He's often terse, but those aren't the same thing.

_____

^^ This.

[AutumnWitch]

The word "disingenuous" is the clincher here. I don't think it's common knowledge that things would still be cut after two (potential) delays. Like Filament said it's ignorant not disengenuous. Of course it could have just been a poor choice of words. But I'd be lying if I said I didn't think Gaider had a backhanded way of speaking to people here on the BSN. Understandable given how acrid this place can get but it's certainly not always justified, this being a good example.

I had planned on posting this in reply to another one of David’s posts but here seems as good as any.

When “appreciating” David I struggle between two different “hats” so to speak.

The first is incredibly appreciative of his work not so much as a writer but what he has been willing to include in the DA games, specifically the same gender romances. I have watched a few of his speeches and I am personally, really grateful that he is doing what he is doing. I have posted on before directly thanking him for a specific speech in which he tried to underscore the importance of something called “inclusion” in video games.  And I have posted here many times, sometimes emotionally, how meaningful it was to me to feel that sense of inclusion in the DA games. So as a person in my particular demographic I am willing to give David a huge berth in his behaviour just because I am so glad he and people like him are in the gaming industry.

However, “in real life” I also work at the executive level and well…let’s just say if I saw anyone who worked for me treating potential customers the way he treats some here, well there would be big issues with this person retaining their employment. And let’s face it, David does talk to many people on here with a certain amount of disrespect both directly and through some clearly, passive-aggressive repartee.

That being said, because of the specific industry he works in and frankly, the level at which he works at, he is given a very wide latitude to behave in what I consider, at best to be, “ an unprofessional manner” at times.

I suspect, that unless he ever actually attacks someone online in such a way that it is seen as especially egregious, like making fun of a disabled person or attacking someone because of their “protected status”, that his behaviour will never actually improve.

Bottom line, there is really nothing anybody can do about it other than ignore it and don’t feed the flames of discourse. Of course, if his postings upsets people that much they need to remember no one if forcing them post/read here at BSN.

[t0mm06]

David Gaider wrote...

Trista Hawke wrote...
But I really would not want to lose content in addition to waiting.

The march towards release involves cuts for every game, including every one we've made to date. There have always been cuts. All I was saying is that, were the date to slip, it would be because that process is ongoing-- we would be trying to finish the game, not adding in new content. That's called scope creep.

So asking "what ADDITIONAL stuff would we get for waiting?" is disingenuous. Were a delay to occur, what you would end up getting is a polished game as opposed to an unpolished one.

Either way, it hasn't happened. Our release date has not changed. If I'm forced to, I will end the thread with that statement so people don't run around spreading misinformation to those who don't know any better.

I'm guessing this is why in most interviews/statments we've seen or read you guys say that you're only going to reveal stuff that you've got working/implemented or that you are deffinatly going to add regardless (playable races, semi-open world ect) ?

[riverbanks]

t0mm06 wrote...
I'm guessing this is why in most interviews/statments we've seen or read you guys say that you're only going to reveal stuff that you've got working/implemented or that you are deffinatly going to add regardless (playable races, semi-open world ect) ?

That probably has more to do with expectations management, specially in a fandom as volatile and prone to overreaction as Bioware's.

Imagine if, early in development, they were talking about multiple playable races - but then for whatever reason (budget cuts, bumped release dates, we just can't do it within the time and resource frame we're given, whatever) those were cut out, and they had to come tell us "sorry guys, no more playable races after all"? This forum would implode with rage. People would burn the countryside with drama about evil horrible Bioware promising things and not delivering. Instead, they first told us what they knew they could get at the time -a human PC- and later, when they were certain that multiple races was a thing they were doing and had the receipts to show, they came out and told us the rest.

It's just an example, but that's the gist of it. By being cautious and announcing things only when they're 100% sure it's getting in, they keep our expectations checked - we know it's in the game because they know it's in the game.

[Maria Caliban]

hoorayforicecream wrote...

I've seen this brought up a few times, so I wanted to present an analogy for those who don't quite understand what's going on here.

Think about it as if you're a baker that's baking cupcakes for a customer's order. You know that the order is due in three days, and you need to deliver 100 cupcakes with peanut butter filling and dark chocolate icing with decorations... words written in the icing or something. You start the baking process, but realize one day into it that you won't be able to fill and frost all of the cupcakes in that time, because frosting them with the designs you made are taking a lot longer than expected. In addition, some of the cupcakes you frosted and filled are not done right (misspellings, or not enough filling, or broken). They will need to be remade.

You estimate you're going to need at least an extra day to finish filling and frosting all 100 of the cupcakes. So you go to your customer, and you present the following options:

1. 70 cupcakes filled and frosted by the deadline.
2. 100 cupcakes filled, but only 30 frosted by the deadline.
3. 80 cupcakes frosted, but only 40 of them filled by the deadline.
4. Delay the order for a day, delivering 100 frosted and filled cupcakes late. This will cost the customer more money, since you still need to pay the frosters and the fillers for their time. You do not have the operating budget to pay for them yourself out of pocket, which is why you must ask for more from the customer.

Imagine that the customer is actually not going to eat the cupcakes himself, but rather resell them at his coffee shop, along with other baked goods like muffins, cookies, alongside his fresh coffee.

Supposing that the customer decides to pay the additional money for the additional baking necessary for his order... would he expect to get any additional cupcakes, or additional decoration from them? It is unlikely to be so - the estimate is to complete just the initial order. Adding more to it would cost more, and would have to push the deadline out even further. That isn't something the customer is necessarily prepared for or wants. The customer may not be interested in adding more to the finished cupcake's design, he just wants the cupcakes he asked for. This is what often happens when a game is delayed.

The customer actually has an additional option available too - he can cancel his order. Under what circumstances would he do this? He knows he can't get a refund for the baking already done, and it will look bad to his customers if he already promised cupcakes but won't be able to offer to sell them, but if he doesn't have the money on hand to pay for more baking, he may just have to cut his losses, hoping to make up the rest on the sale of coffee and muffins. If the money he estimates he'll make from selling the cupcakes isn't higher than the additional money he has to pay to get the cupcakes finished, he will also probably cut his losses. He may decide to stop selling cupcakes altogether, if there are consistent problems with getting them made. This is often what happens when a game is cancelled.

Sometimes the customer cancels his order and the baker is left with a bunch of half-frosted, half-filled cupcakes. He believes that the finished cupcakes would sell and are fabulous, but he's got a limited amount of time before they start to go bad and he has to throw them away. So what does he do? He goes to other storefronts... cafes, ice cream shops, etc. to try to find a buyer for the abandoned cupcakes. Sometimes he does. Sometimes he cannot, and is forced to throw them out. This is what often happens when a game is dropped by a publisher, and tries to find another.

I hope this helps with the understanding. At the very least, I hope it makes people hungry.

I didn't finish reading this, but about half-way through I was like, "Damn, I want a cupcake."

Silfren wrote...

Gaider was quite calm and civil...

And off-topic.

The topic of the thread is 'what additional thing would you like in DA:I?' not 'Please tell me about video game development.'


When a developer makes an off-topic post in your thread, you can kiss your original thread topic good-bye. Skimming through the various pages, I can see only a handful of attempts to answer the original question.

Sure, I can understand why this would be frustrating to the thread starter. At this point, I'd suggest starting a new thread and writing a better original post.

Modifié par Maria Caliban, 02 novembre 2013 - 02:21 .

[Silfren]

Maria Caliban wrote...

Silfren wrote...

Gaider was quite calm and civil...

And off-topic.

The topic of the thread is 'what additional thing would you like in DA:I?' not 'Please tell me about video game development.'


When a developer makes an off-topic post in your thread, you can kiss your original thread topic good-bye. Skimming through the various pages, I can see only a handful of attempts to answer the original question.

Sure, I can understand why this would be frustrating to the thread starter. At this point, I'd suggest starting a new thread and writing a better original post.

Gaider addressed the OP's subject by informing her that there there is NO delay, and that were one to happen, it would mean things being cut, not added. The answer he gave might not have been a strict answer to the question, but it applied to it nonetheless.  There was nothing off-topic about it.  Regardless, whether he was OT or not is not the issue.  He was accused of being rude, which he most certainly was not.

Re: a post referring to the confusion, I think perhaps part of the problem is that maybe the original "delay" wasn't a delay so much as an extension.  Meaning, a delay occurs when you discover that you are not going to be able to finish the game as planned according to the original schedule, whereas an extension means you want to give yourself additional time in order to make the game you want.  I don't know if that's true or not, but there is a distinction, if a fine one. 

It needs to be emphasised that the article does NOT say that there will be a delay.  It doesn't even warn that there MAY be a delay.  It's just EA saying that they fully expect DA:I to be released on schedule while leaving themselves an out in case something happens to make that expectation change.  It's nothing more than a CYA maneuver so they can't be accused of lying later.

[Volus Warlord]

Tharja wrote...

the new duke nukem game was horrid and the devs that made that gave had a very long time to finish it and polish it off, but it seemed rushed non the less, I don't mind waiting for the game even if it is "polished" or not people will still find faults with the game and complain

Duke Nukem Forever is the exception more so than the rule. There were all sorts of nonsense going on that beyond a reasonable doubt won't happen with DA:I-delays, publisher swaps, funding cuts, etc.

[Wissenschaft]

Maria Caliban wrote...

Silfren wrote...

Gaider was quite calm and civil...

And off-topic.

The topic of the thread is 'what additional thing would you like in DA:I?' not 'Please tell me about video game development.'


When a developer makes an off-topic post in your thread, you can kiss your original thread topic good-bye. Skimming through the various pages, I can see only a handful of attempts to answer the original question.

Sure, I can understand why this would be frustrating to the thread starter. At this point, I'd suggest starting a new thread and writing a better original post.

The devs haven't derailed the topic, its titled "Uncertainty Over Fall 2014 Release". The OP then asks a question at the end of the post but its not the main topic of the post or a different title should have been picked.

The Devs have simply stated that theres no need to panic about the game being delayed and theres no point in wishing for more content to be added since when crunch time comes (and it always comes to any project) the last thing the devs will do is add even more content to their workload. This is simply the nature of completeing any long term project, at some point enough has to be enough and you wrap the project up, cutting any content that doesn't have enough time to be completed or has had trouble being fit within the game.


I call that on topic.

Modifié par Wissenschaft, 04 novembre 2013 - 04:44 .

[Wissenschaft]

Silfren wrote...
Re: a post referring to the confusion, I think perhaps part of the problem is that maybe the original "delay" wasn't a delay so much as an extension.  Meaning, a delay occurs when you discover that you are not going to be able to finish the game as planned according to the original schedule, whereas an extension means you want to give yourself additional time in order to make the game you want.  I don't know if that's true or not, but there is a distinction, if a fine one.  

 

It does seem to be an extension because Bioware was originally set to have no race selection in DA:I and now there is which is a big change to the game. I'm not sure what else has been added to the game but I imagine they shall also have more time to polish their game.

[BioFan (Official)]

David Gaider wrote...

Trista Hawke wrote...
So, I'm not here to gripe if the game's release *does* get pushed back. If it's pushed back, it's pushed back. Thus is life. However, IF THAT WERE THE CASE, can we reap the benefits of it being pushed back + the profits of EA's 2014 big hit releases? Can they add more to Dragon Age Inquisition if the fans are made to wait until 2015?

If the release date does slip, and that's IF, it will undoubtedly because we feel we need more time to make the game we currently have on our hands. At that point we will be cutting content that's not finished yet, not adding new content in. You will get less features, possibly some that were already mentioned would be removed, not new features thrown in as candy to "reward" you for the extra wait.

I am in no way complaining, I am just curious as to why (AGAIN IF, totally theorechtorical) content would be cut when there would be more time to work on it.