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[AndreaDraco]

draxynnus wrote...

A final piece of extrapolation: if the Archdemons are the Forgotten Ones having been released by the corruption of the Golden City, does this mean that it might also be possible to release the higher elven pantheon by a similar means? And would it necessarily be a good idea if it was possible?

I've long since caressed the idea that the Old Gods worshipped by the Tevinter Imperium were in fact the Forgotten Ones of the Elves (it's not uncommon for a culture to import the pantheon of another civilization, especially if perceived as more streamlined and/or superior). I don't know about Fen'harel being the Maker, since I really think that the Maker doesn't exist, but it could be an explanation. However, about the Golden City, I doubt that it was part of the lock - in Greek mythology, which clearly influenced the Elven pantheon, gods had a physical seat (Olympus), so I think it's likely that the Golden City was the seat of some Old Elven God, like Elgar'nan. Or it could also be the seat of something else entirely...

... However, David Gaider discarded many of these hypothesis, saying that the Old Gods and the Elven Gods were not the same, and that the Old Gods were almost alien entity, not created nor creators.

[EthanDirtch]

Another slightly different theory could be that the Golden City is in fact Arlathan itself, and that its destruction is what lead to the Magisters finding the Old Gods/Forgotten Ones, thus setting off into motion the First Blight.



And Andraste wasn't before the First Blight, I don't think. The first Blight was what? Almso 1300 years ago? The Grey Wardens were created 1200 years ago...at the time, all of Thedas was still part of the Imperium, I think, sans modern-day Ferelden (where it was the Alamarri who had to band together to drive out some Darkspawn during the Second Blight under...Hafter was it?...their first teyrn).

[draxynnus]

Stretching, football_punk...

AndreaDraco wrote...

draxynnus wrote...

A final piece of extrapolation: if the Archdemons are the Forgotten Ones having been released by the corruption of the Golden City, does this mean that it might also be possible to release the higher elven pantheon by a similar means? And would it necessarily be a good idea if it was possible?

I've long since caressed the idea that the Old Gods worshipped by the Tevinter Imperium were in fact the Forgotten Ones of the Elves (it's not uncommon for a culture to import the pantheon of another civilization, especially if perceived as more streamlined and/or superior). I don't know about Fen'harel being the Maker, since I really think that the Maker doesn't exist, but it could be an explanation. However, about the Golden City, I doubt that it was part of the lock - in Greek mythology, which clearly influenced the Elven pantheon, gods had a physical seat (Olympus), so I think it's likely that the Golden City was the seat of some Old Elven God, like Elgar'nan. Or it could also be the seat of something else entirely...

... However, David Gaider discarded many of these hypothesis, saying that the Old Gods and the Elven Gods were not the same, and that the Old Gods were almost alien entity, not created nor creators.

I'd be interested in seeing the exact wording of D.G's dismissal - there have been a few times when he's appeared to say something when he didn't really (for instance: when he says "elven gods" does he mean both sides of the pantheon or just the ones that were actually worshipped?)

[Emperor Iaius I]

EthanDirtch wrote...

Another slightly different theory could be that the Golden City is in fact Arlathan itself, and that its destruction is what lead to the Magisters finding the Old Gods/Forgotten Ones, thus setting off into motion the First Blight.

And Andraste wasn't before the First Blight, I don't think. The first Blight was what? Almso 1300 years ago? The Grey Wardens were created 1200 years ago...at the time, all of Thedas was still part of the Imperium, I think, sans modern-day Ferelden (where it was the Alamarri who had to band together to drive out some Darkspawn during the Second Blight under...Hafter was it?...their first teyrn).

Logically, she must be before the First Blight. Why would the Maker promise a paradise on Earth to the same people he allegedly cursed for defiling his Black City?

The guide's timeline places Andraste's death at 1025TE and the First Blight at 1199 TE--interestingly, the Chantry was founded just four years earlier (coincidence? I think not!).

However, just after the timeline, the detailed chronology places the First Blight at 800TE and the death of Andraste is still at 1025TE. Notably, the Andrastian hordes are described as a greater threat to the Imperium than the Blight. Also in the detailed timeline: Wardens founded in 890TE, and Dumat is finally slain in 992TE. A one hundred and ninety two year Blight: ouch. The Wardens do not convert to the Chantry until 1200TE, or 1:5 Divine.


What a mess.

[draxynnus]

Well, that first Blight would have to be the one where they found out just what it took to permakill an Archdemon. There may have been a few cases of the Archdemon being believed to have been killed only to come back. Over. And over. And over.



This does mean, however, that instead of being a continuous Blight, it may have been in pulses.

[Emperor Iaius I]

That depends on how long it takes the archdemon to recover from being soul-zapped into another darkspawn. We still don't know exactly what happens there.



I can't imagine the darkspawn just up and left, though. It took another eight years of warfare after Dumat's death to clean them out, after all.

[EthanDirtch]

hmm, I remember that Andraste and her followers only overtook the Imperium *after* a Blight significantly had weakened Tevinter. That's what I remember anyway, and I'm prone to remembering things wrong...but still, it just doesn't feel *right*. ~does research~

[Emperor Iaius I]

Perhaps it's something we need clarification from the writers about, since the same source directly contradicts itself.

[EthanDirtch]

hmm, http://dragonage.wik...m/wiki/Andraste



if Dragonage.wikia.com can be believed, Andraste was at least around during the First Blight, then she and her forces made their move shortly after.



We know two things for certain:

1. Andraste was born when Tevinter still ruled

2. Ferelden was not yet a proper nation, but still a smattering of Alamarri tribes



I still think they attacked the Imperium after it had already been significantly weakened by the Blight, as the article stated.

[Emperor Iaius I]

The timelines conflict, but they do both agree that Andraste could not have been around at the same time as the first Blight.



But who knows. This is probably further proof that the darkspawn are Andraste's fault.

[SusanStoHelit]

Emperor Iaius I wrote...

But who knows. This is probably further proof that the darkspawn are Andraste's fault.

This. I like it. It's simple and there's no evidence against it. It's all Andraste's fault.

Let us rise up against the Chantry and the Templars, and destroy the minions of the evil Andraste and cast down all her works.

Modifié par SusanStoHelit, 26 janvier 2010 - 07:06 .

[football_punk64]

haha, So I was unknowingly on to something. Im having a pretty good laugh right now.

[Maferath]

Something just occurred to me. Blood Magic allows one to open the Veil. If this magic originally came from the Elves... is it possible that the mages from Arlathann sent their own city into the Beyond (as they call it), as a last desperate move?...



The Darkspawn Taint being a curse inflicted on those puny humans when they tried to break in their pocket plane one thousand years later...





yeah... I think I'm actually going to stop there.

[Sylrien]

Well, with what we know about Blood Magic....and what we don't....anything can be possible. It would have a poetic irony if the second invasion of the imperium upon arlathan led to start of the blights. But it's conjecture, and it's fun. So there..