283 réponses à ce sujet

[Estelindis]

Reznore57 wrote...

I would say the theme may be more about "Power".
What if mortals had the powers of gods in their hands(magic ) , what would happen?
How would they shape things , destroy , abuse , control, try to understand this?

I think Gods in this settings are figure heads , we may meet lesser Gods (like Archdemons) and wonder well who cared about their Godlike status?
Let's kill them (or preserve with the Dark Ritual)...

The Dark Ritual is very interesting.  At least some of the power involved in the Dark Ritual comes from the nature of a Grey Warden, and a Warden gains that nature through the darkspawn blood, lyrium and archdemon blood they receive during the Joining.  Assuming that the religious and historical lore we have is correct (which it may not be), that element of the ritual ultimately comes from the Old Gods (archdemon blood), the magisters (first darkspawn), or the Maker (if the darkspawn are marked by the Maker in some way).  The lyrium is common enough to mages generally that it seems unlikely to be the pivotal component.  Anyway, if an old god is killed or preserved by the Ritual, it's at least partially through power from one of these sources.  I really find this intriguing.

Actually, the Dark Ritual is, in my opinion, one of the most fascinating of all the mysteries of Thedas.  I am incredibly keen to find out what's been at work all this time.

[AresKeith]

The Xand wrote...

Ravensword wrote...

It really doesn't seem like the Maker actually exists.

That's likely going to be the big reveal. Hope so anyway, because the Maker is already boring to nonexistent already. Needs a revamp or to be removed.

Or Bioware is just gonna leave it ambigous and up to the players like they want

[Dave of Canada]

AresKeith wrote...

Or Bioware is just gonna leave it ambigous and up to the players like they want

A fictional religion based off faith? Surely you jest!

[AresKeith]

Dave of Canada wrote...

I don't understand why people need to bring their real-world vendetta against organized religion in a video game.

The same reason why people feel to need to bring other real-world issues into video games

[Reznore57]

Estelindis wrote...

The Dark Ritual is very interesting.  At least some of the power involved in the Dark Ritual comes from the nature of a Grey Warden, and a Warden gains that nature through the darkspawn blood, lyrium and archdemon blood they receive during the Joining.  Assuming that the religious and historical lore we have is correct (which it may not be), that element of the ritual ultimately comes from the Old Gods (archdemon blood), the magisters (first darkspawn), or the Maker (if the darkspawn are marked by the Maker in some way).  The lyrium is common enough to mages generally that it seems unlikely to be the pivotal component.  Anyway, if an old god is killed or preserved by the Ritual, it's at least partially through power from one of these sources.  I really find this intriguing.

Actually, the Dark Ritual is, in my opinion, one of the most fascinating of all the mysteries of Thedas.  I am incredibly keen to find out what's been at work all this time.

Yep , I'm ready to happily throw all my theory out the door.
I hope the Inquisitor will be involved in more "mystical" stuff , not too over the top ...
But I really liked the quest for Andraste Ashes  for example .
I wish I could play Brother Genitivi sometimes ,he's one of the coolest character in Thedas.

[sandalisthemaker]

<----------

[Boycott Bioware]

Herr Uhl wrote...

Qistina wrote...

In DA:O, players might not aware that they are not playing as Andrasterian or human, that is why there are some who cry on why Alistair dump their Dalish Warden...

That has nothing to do with Andrastianism.

Yes it does, it is an effect of the game....the whole time it is about human and human religion/custom, even the player forget that they are not playing as human that supposed to have different view on things. Surely the human will not want non-human as Queen, and Andrasterian don't want "infidel" or whatever you want to call it ruling them

But the player being deluded with 70% of the game that is about human and Andrasterians, there is not much that build a strong non human and non Andrasterian into non human character. The game is bias. Every character you meet will dictate you with Andrasterian religion, you don't get your own race or religion perspective on things

Religion is a sensitive issue, but the player totally not aware of the sensitivity because the game never show about that

Modifié par Qistina, 05 novembre 2013 - 01:55 .

[Schneidend]

Qistina wrote...

Yes it does, it is an effect of the game....the whole time it is about human and human religion/custom, even the forget that they are not playing as human that supposed to have different view on things. Surely the human will not want non-human as Queen, and Andrasterian don't want "infidel" or whatever you want to call it ruling them

But the player being deluded with 70% of the game that is about human and Andrasterians, there is not much that build a strong non human and non Andrasterian into non human character. The game is bias. Every character you meet will dictate you with Andrasterian religion, you don't get your own race or religion perspective on things

My Cousland was an atheist from the start of DA:O to the end. The game always gives you an option to tell priestsesses that you think their religion is dumb.

[Boycott Bioware]

In DA2, there is Qunari that have their own religion, there is a unrest from fanatical Chantry and fanatical Elves...but the player is always Human and Andrasterian, the game is biased. The player only either

i. stay neutral as possible
ii. become Chantry supporter and fanatic

See that? Everything in DA2 is bias toward other religions in the game. Hawke in the end will have to eliminate races of other religion to keep the peace. The player never aware of the sensitivity because the player have only one sided view on things

The things about Mages for example, is totally based on Chantry doctrine. DA2 is about either you support the Chantry religion or you doubt the religion.

i. Support the Templar/Meredith means you support the religion
ii. Support Mages means you against the religion

But not all players aware of that

[Boycott Bioware]

Schneidend wrote...
My Cousland was an atheist from the start of DA:O to the end. The game always gives you an option to tell priestsesses that you think their religion is dumb.

It doesn't matter if your character is an atheist or what not, you can insult all the religion in the game but the game will never let you change peoples view and becoming atheist like your character, you have no power to change

[Estelindis]

Qistina wrote...

It doesn't matter if your character is an atheist or what not, you can insult all the religion in the game but the game will never let you change peoples view and becoming atheist like your character, you have no power to change

And when can an Andrastian player character convert a companion or NPC who doesn't believe in the Maker to believe in the Chant of Light?

[Boycott Bioware]

Estelindis wrote...
And when can an Andrastian player character convert a companion or NPC who doesn't believe in the Maker to believe in the Chant of Light?

Doesn't need to, because the premise is about the believe of The Maker, Andraste and Chant of Light...either your character believe in it or not is not a factor

For example, in Mage Origin, Gregoir and Irving will dictate you about the religion, you may agree or not agree but can do nothing about it

[AresKeith]

Qistina wrote...

Schneidend wrote...
My Cousland was an atheist from the start of DA:O to the end. The game always gives you an option to tell priestsesses that you think their religion is dumb.

It doesn't matter if your character is an atheist or what not, you can insult all the religion in the game but the game will never let you change peoples view and becoming atheist like your character, you have no power to change

Ok and?

[Boycott Bioware]

AresKeith wrote...
Ok and?

And so whatever your character point of view about the religion not effecting anything

[wolfhowwl]

No one pays attention to fedora tipping Reddit-tier atheists in our world, why would Thedas be any different?

[AutumnWitch]

I personally hate the fact that people try to make parallels to the Christian god like somehow it is more legitimate than other gods of legends. The bottom line is, unless a "god" comes down from heaven and reveals him/her/it self "the maker" in the DA universe and the Christian gods are both just concepts that people of that world/universe use to answer things that are currently unanswerable, to lean on in times when hope is needed and give a world of cruelty and sadness a sense of order and redemption.

So instead of getting over serious about this god or that god people should just enjoy this rich fantasy universe that DA has given us and enjoy it for the escapism and entertainment in which it was designed for.

Just stop taking things so seriously and enjoy life because as far as we know, its the only one we have!

[Star fury]

Qistina wrote...

AresKeith wrote...
Ok and?

And so whatever your character point of view about the religion not effecting anything

In fact I would want Thedas folk burning your character for atheism, because freedom of religion is anomal for Medieval society.

[Ravensword]

wolfhowwl wrote...

No one pays attention to fedora tipping Reddit-tier atheists in our world, why would Thedas be any different?

Thedas doesn't have the Internet?

[Dayze]

Star fury wrote...

Qistina wrote...

AresKeith wrote...
Ok and?

And so whatever your character point of view about the religion not effecting anything

In fact I would want Thedas folk burning your character for atheism, because freedom of religion is anomal for Medieval society.

True it was an anomally but it did exist in a few countries.

[Dayze]

Estelindis wrote...

Dayze wrote...

Also I think most of the people involved in this discussion are of the religious bent.

As for why people who are religious might be defensive about "The Maker" and the Chantry; simply any argument that can be made towards a religious organization and entity, if its a good one can ultimately be applied to another religion.

It's very possible to spend a couple of hours reading the Dragon Age codex and know all there is publically to know about the religions of Thedas.  You could spend a whole lifetime studying real world religions and still not know even 1% of everything there is publically to know.  Competence in the former field of knowledge should not be presumed to grant competence in the latter.

unbentbuzzkill wrote...

Perhaps the name is suppose to be The Baker, yeah that makes more sense.

Baker's breath!  

Its still a fear that religious types can hold and a not unfounded one; to some extent its just a matter of cut and paste.

Make an argument against a religious organization based on faith that is based on attacking the nature of faith or some other basic aspect of religious or mythologies and it could come back to them.

Though thinking about it; we don't really know much about The Chantry or the Canticles of Light or the general myths of Thedas......by comparision we have the entirety of the bible to read, a pretty strong history of many countries and incidents, philosphical writings of people from many religions in the real world.

We actually have a "much" better, indepth and easily gotten sources of information for most religions in existance as to any of the religions in Thedas.

And hell; if your just talking about one religion all you really need is the bible, koran or whatever depending on the mythology n question.

Though to get a good understanding of the religion you would need to read an incredible amount of social records etc..... 

[Dayze]

unbentbuzzkill wrote...

But his/her name is The Maker! If he/she isn't god what is it? Perhaps the name is suppose to be The Baker, yeah that makes more sense.

Who knows; maybe "The Maker" is all that is left of the original entity like a fractured broken shard of what used to be.

Maybe the Maker burned out 99.999% of its power making Thedas.

Maybe "The Maker" is simply a powerful spirit of creation and due to how Spirits can be somewhat confused at times actually ended up thinking it was the creator of Thedas due to a combination of dreams and people/things telling it that it was?

Or perhaps the Maker will turn out to be an incredibly high level Pride Demon that can't be bothered with reality because it is simply so below it?

[Star fury]

Dayze wrote...

Star fury wrote...

Qistina wrote...

AresKeith wrote...
Ok and?

And so whatever your character point of view about the religion not effecting anything

In fact I would want Thedas folk burning your character for atheism, because freedom of religion is anomal for Medieval society.

True it was an anomally but it did exist in a few countries.

Care to elaborate?

[Dayze]

Star fury wrote...

Dayze wrote...

Star fury wrote...

Qistina wrote...

AresKeith wrote...
Ok and?

And so whatever your character point of view about the religion not effecting anything

In fact I would want Thedas folk burning your character for atheism, because freedom of religion is anomal for Medieval society.

True it was an anomally but it did exist in a few countries.

Care to elaborate?

Off-hand I remember there was at least one pagan country in Europe that had some religious freedom, didn't like christians but on a whole was okay with the concept.

I "think" some Muslim countries were someone okay with religious freedom.

To give any thing more I'm going to have go and look it up again, so if you really want me too I'll try and find it.

[Star fury]

Dayze wrote...

Star fury wrote...

Dayze wrote...

Star fury wrote...

Qistina wrote...

AresKeith wrote...
Ok and?

And so whatever your character point of view about the religion not effecting anything

In fact I would want Thedas folk burning your character for atheism, because freedom of religion is anomal for Medieval society.

True it was an anomally but it did exist in a few countries.

Care to elaborate?

Off-hand I remember there was at least one pagan country in Europe that had some religious freedom, didn't like christians but on a whole was okay with the concept.

I "think" some Muslim countries were someone okay with religious freedom.

To give any thing more I'm going to have go and look it up again, so if you really want me too I'll try and find it.

Yeah, I think you mean Cathars and Arab Haliphate but they were still religious and did not tolerate atheism. Most of Europe and Asia were still fanatical and fought countless religious wars.