109 réponses à ce sujet

[OniGanon]

It's funny to see people talking about the Krysae like it was so much better before.

Guys... the only major difference between current and past Krysae is a 30% ROF nerf and removal of charge zoom.

The damage nerfs were reverted. The shield gate nerf was meaningless since it didn't change the number of shots required to kill anything. Ammo nerf was meaningless (you're going to take a clip mod anyway). The addition of recoil was meaningless because the gun never fired fast enough to care about recoil.

The gun is slightly slower. That's the difference between past and current Krysae.


That video? What you're seeing isn't so much the difference of the Krysae nerf. You're seeing the difference of the Tactical Cloak and Hunter Mode nerfs.

[Bolo Xia]

kaxas92 wrote...

baldmop wrote...

Destroyer and pre-nerf piranha was also a op kit .

Pre-nerf but post-buff Piranha, right?

The latter one was one of the most pointless balance changes I think.

there was so much whining when it was released about how bad it sucked.

so it was BSN that was behind the buff, Bioware was just trying to make people happy once again.

[Salarian Jesus]

Bolo Xia wrote...

kaxas92 wrote...

baldmop wrote...

Destroyer and pre-nerf piranha was also a op kit .

Pre-nerf but post-buff Piranha, right?

The latter one was one of the most pointless balance changes I think.

there was so much whining when it was released about how bad it sucked.

so it was BSN that was behind the buff, Bioware was just trying to make people happy once again.

Fair enough. One can't remember all BSN drama, right? 

[Clayless]

OniGanon wrote...

It's funny to see people talking about the Krysae like it was so much better before.

Guys... the only major difference between current and past Krysae is a 30% ROF nerf and removal of charge zoom.

The damage nerfs were reverted. The shield gate nerf was meaningless since it didn't change the number of shots required to kill anything. Ammo nerf was meaningless (you're going to take a clip mod anyway). The addition of recoil was meaningless because the gun never fired fast enough to care about recoil.

The gun is slightly slower. That's the difference between past and current Krysae.


That video? What you're seeing isn't so much the difference of the Krysae nerf. You're seeing the difference of the Tactical Cloak and Hunter Mode nerfs.

There's a reason why people are saying Pre-Nerf Krysae GI.

Also you're pushing it a bit if you think the current doorstop is anything but a shadow of its former self. Pre-Nerf Krysae could be used on non-Infiltrators. Even after the first two nerfs it could be used somewhat well on non-Infiltrator classes, but was by then vastly outclassed by other snipers. Then after the 3rd or 4th nerf it's hard to say it can be used on anything.

It's not even comparable to it's pre-nerf state.

[Kalas Magnus]

talon gi

[Zero132132]

Pre-nerf Krysae with pre-nerf Tactical Cloak & pre-nerf hunter mode on the GI.

[BridgeBurner]

Pre-nerf krysae on the GI.

People who still b*tch about the krysae being nerfed clearly don't understand just how retarded it really was.

[SpaceV3gan]

Flamer GT.

edit: Regarding the past I don't know, I wasn't around.

Modifié par SpaceV3gan, 10 novembre 2013 - 06:21 .

[RedJohn]

Pre nerf Destroyer with pre nerf Typhoon can be a good example.


Also Reegar with Incendiary ammo + Warp/ Incendiary Grenades/ Incinerate.

[OniGanon]

Robosexual wrote...
It's not even comparable to it's pre-nerf state.

Really? Well I'm about to compare it.

Pre Nerf Krysae
Damage: 664
ROF: 50RPM

Current Krysae
Damage: 616.8
ROF: 35RPM

Slightly less damage (doesn't mean much in practice; number of shots to kill target is the same). 30% less ROF. That's it. It's a bit slower. That's the difference between the current Krysae and this mythical BS fantasy wonderland Krysae you've all built up in your minds.

Everything else was from prenerf TC with 10% more damage + 15% more multiplicative Sniper Rifle damage, prenerf HM with 7.5% more damage, and prenerf Proximity Mine with multiplicative 5% more damage taken.

Modifié par OniGanon, 10 novembre 2013 - 06:32 .

[KalGerion_Beast]

That 30% less RoF, coupled with the small damage difference, should mean the pre-nerf was 50% more quicker at killing targets. I would say that's a significant drop in deeps.

664 x 50 = 33200 (assuming bottomless clip)

616.8 x 35 = 21588 damage per min (assuming bottomless clip)

Now obviously, they don't have bottomless clip, but the damage loss due to having to reload after 3 shots should be the same, right?

Modifié par IMaster757, 10 novembre 2013 - 06:39 .

[Stinja]

OniGanon wrote...

That's the difference between the current Krysae and this mythical BS fantasy wonderland Krysae you've all built up in your minds.

Dont forget enemy health has been buffed too... 

But did you actually play back then?  It was almost like firing missiles the effective damage vs a spawn of normal enemies.

[OniGanon]

On bosses, yes. Infantry die too fast for it to be an issue.

The Krysae was never much of a boss killer though at ~500ish shield and ~800ish armor DPS. So the nerf only made it go from 'bad at killing bosses' to 'really bad at killing bosses.'

Oh, and that small damage difference? Doesn't really exist because we didn't have Gears back then.

Stinja wrote...
But did you actually play back then?  It was almost like firing missiles the effective damage vs a spawn of normal enemies.

I've been playing on and off since release. I used the Krysae back then, and I still use it on a regular basis even now.

But I can see that the difference between now and then is less about the gun itself and more about the fact that: 1) Tactical Cloak was a lot more powerful and 2) the gun was so wildly popular that you had entire lobbies full of it.

The effect of the Krysae looks a lot worse when you have 4 people using it, spamming entire areas of the map with aoe damage and stagger. Even now, an entire lobby full of Infiltrators with Krysaes will make any Gold game vs Geth/Cerberus a hilarious cakewalk.

It's just that you'd have a hard time convincing 4 different random players to equip a Krysae these days, so it never happens.


Oh yeah, and to actually answer the OP:

Pre-nerf GI.

The Krysae looked so horrifying because it was being used by pre-nerf GIs. You think he's OP now? He used to do 17.5% more additive damage, 15% more multiplicative damage and made enemies take 5% more damage. Holy effing balls.

Modifié par OniGanon, 10 novembre 2013 - 06:59 .

[RedJohn]

OniGanon wrote...

Robosexual wrote...
It's not even comparable to it's pre-nerf state.

Really? Well I'm about to compare it.

Pre Nerf Krysae
Damage: 664
ROF: 50RPM

Current Krysae
Damage: 616.8
ROF: 35RPM

Slightly less damage (doesn't mean much in practice; number of shots to kill target is the same). 30% less ROF. That's it. It's a bit slower. That's the difference between the current Krysae and this mythical BS fantasy wonderland Krysae you've all built up in your minds.

Everything else was from prenerf TC with 10% more damage + 15% more multiplicative Sniper Rifle damage, prenerf HM with 7.5% more damage, and prenerf Proximity Mine with multiplicative 5% more damage taken.

LOL


You never used pre nerf krysae right?, because those numbers means nothing.

You can check any video of the pre nerf and go and try the same with the current one.

[Clayless]

OniGanon wrote...

Robosexual wrote...
It's not even comparable to it's pre-nerf state.

Really? Well I'm about to compare it.

Pre Nerf Krysae
Damage: 664
ROF: 50RPM

Current Krysae
Damage: 616.8
ROF: 35RPM

Slightly less damage (doesn't mean much in practice; number of shots to kill target is the same). 30% less ROF. That's it. It's a bit slower. That's the difference between the current Krysae and this mythical BS fantasy wonderland Krysae you've all built up in your minds.

Everything else was from prenerf TC with 10% more damage + 15% more multiplicative Sniper Rifle damage, prenerf HM with 7.5% more damage, and prenerf Proximity Mine with multiplicative 5% more damage taken.

- Damage reduced from [531.2-664.0] to [493.4-616.8]
- Rate of fire decreased from [50] to [35]
- Recoil Increased from [5.0] to [10.0]
- Zoom Recoil Increased from [3.0] to [5.0]
- Total ammo dropped from [9-21] to [9-18]
- Can no longer hold the fire button to zoom in the scope - now fires instantly
- Krysae no longer ignores enemy shield gates

If you think that damage is the only thing that affects dps and usability, and not the decreased fire rate, double the amount of recoil, reduced ammo, removal of the ability to shoot two bullets in quick succession and shield gate changes, then you don't really know what you're talking about.

It's not "mythical BS fantasy wonderland", it's just pure fact. You can even go and watch videos of the Krysae on non-GI's.

[FasterThanFTL]

Vintage Krysae ignored shield gate that is why it was godly, everything else is mostly insignificant.

[LuckyBullet95]

OniGanon wrote...

Robosexual wrote...
It's not even comparable to it's pre-nerf state.

Really? Well I'm about to compare it.

Pre Nerf Krysae
Damage: 664
ROF: 50RPM

Current Krysae
Damage: 616.8
ROF: 35RPM

Slightly less damage (doesn't mean much in practice; number of shots to kill target is the same). 30% less ROF. That's it. It's a bit slower. That's the difference between the current Krysae and this mythical BS fantasy wonderland Krysae you've all built up in your minds.

Everything else was from prenerf TC with 10% more damage + 15% more multiplicative Sniper Rifle damage, prenerf HM with 7.5% more damage, and prenerf Proximity Mine with multiplicative 5% more damage taken.

Actually the different is  15 rounds per minute (which is quite significant on a Sniper Rifle), twice the recoil, slightly less damage, the removal of the double shot mechanic and (most signifcantly) the removal of shieldgate ignorance (and an insignificant clip size decrease). The double-shot mechanic, shieldgate and the ROF nerf were the biggest differences. That being said. the Krysae is still a decent weapon, anyone who wanted to use it could without being hampered, at least not as much as some other weapons (Raptor for example) and it's a great ammo power applier.

Modifié par LuckyBullet95, 10 novembre 2013 - 06:54 .

[NeonFlux117]

TGI with a harrier x, incendiary rounds.

[OniGanon]

Robosexual wrote...

- Damage reduced from [531.2-664.0] to [493.4-616.8]
- Rate of fire decreased from [50] to [35]
- Recoil Increased from [5.0] to [10.0]
- Zoom Recoil Increased from [3.0] to [5.0]
- Total ammo dropped from [9-21] to [9-18]
- Can no longer hold the fire button to zoom in the scope - now fires instantly
- Krysae no longer ignores enemy shield gates

Damage difference is meaningless. Gear didn't exist back then. Use a Gear with at least +8% damage and the damage difference is gone.

Recoil difference is meaningless. Gun fires too slow to care about recoil, and it's not like you're dealing with a precision weapon here.

Ammo difference is meaningless. You're going to take a Clip mod, because nothing but Clip mod and Extended Barrel actually do anything for Krysae, therefore ammo is not an issue.

Shield gate nerf is meaningless. Does not change required number of shots to kill a target.

Loss of zoom double shot is a significant loss. Though, it does also mean you lose that 'break cloak and fail to fire for no appaent reason' crap that it used to do. That pissed me off so much that I'm inclined to count this as a positive, but I can understand disagreement here.

And that leaves the ROF loss, the major difference between now and then.


You guys like to claim I don't know what I'm talking about. I used the Krysae back then. I used it through every single nerf and buff. I still use it now. I never stopped using it. How many of you can claim the same?

Modifié par OniGanon, 10 novembre 2013 - 07:16 .

[LuckyBullet95]

OniGanon wrote...

Robosexual wrote...

- Damage reduced from [531.2-664.0] to [493.4-616.8]
- Rate of fire decreased from [50] to [35]
- Recoil Increased from [5.0] to [10.0]
- Zoom Recoil Increased from [3.0] to [5.0]
- Total ammo dropped from [9-21] to [9-18]
- Can no longer hold the fire button to zoom in the scope - now fires instantly
- Krysae no longer ignores enemy shield gates

Damage difference is meaningless. Gear didn't exist back then. Use a Gear with at least +8% damage and the damage difference is gone.

Recoil difference is meaningless. Gun fires too slow to care about recoil, and it's not like you're dealing with a precision weapon here.

Ammo difference is meaningless. You're going to take a Clip mod, because nothing but Clip mod and Extended Barrel actually do anything for Krysae, therefore ammo is not an issue.

Shield gate nerf is meaningless. Does not change required number of shots to kill a target.

Loss of zoom double shot is a significant loss. Though, it does also mean you lose that 'break cloak and fail to fire for no appaent reason' crap that it used to do. That pissed me off so much that I'm inclined to count this as a positive, but I can understand disagreement here.

And that leaves the ROF loss, the major difference between now and then.


You guys like to claim I don't know what I'm talking about. I used the Krysae back then. I used it through every single nerf and buff. I still use it now. I never stopped using it. How many of you can claim the same?

Me actually... But admittedly not in the same role, have used a few Krysae Infiltrators but it primarily gets used either for the lulz or on an ammo power detonator class if I feel like I'm using the Venom too much.

I agree with most of this post, however, on Platinum, moreso after the release of the Collector I feel like igonring Shieldgate would be a major bulletsaver, though admittedly in a limited capacity (Possessed Troopers, base Captains and higher healthed elite mooks (Pyros, Hunters, Phantoms)

Modifié par LuckyBullet95, 10 novembre 2013 - 07:29 .

[Clayless]

OniGanon wrote...

Damage difference is meaningless. Gear didn't exist back then. Use a Gear with at least +8% damage and the damage difference is gone.

Yes it did. If you're using +8% damage now you could just use +8% damage then.

Recoil difference is meaningless. Gun fires too slow to care about recoil, and it's not like you're dealing with a precision weapon here.

Double recoil isn't meaningless. Half the amount of recoil and a faster fire rate most definately isn't meaningles.

Ammo difference is meaningless. You're going to take a Clip mod, because nothing but Clip mod and Extended Barrel actually do anything for Krysae, therefore ammo is not an issue.

Almost insignificant, but still lower dps.

Shield gate nerf is meaningless. Does not change required number of shots to kill a target.

Shield gate nerf hit it hard. Good luck 2 shotting Pyro's now.

And that leaves the ROF loss, the major difference between now and then.

And all those other things, like recoil, damage and rate of fire.

You guys like to claim I don't know what I'm talking about. I used the Krysae back then. I used it through every single nerf and buff. I still use it now. I never stopped using it. How many of you can claim the same?

Me.

Modifié par Robosexual, 10 novembre 2013 - 07:33 .

[MetalDeggial]

The most OP thing, as in something that hits really hard and requires zero knowledge of the game to use? Pre-nerf Krysae, and currently the Flamer.

[Ferocious Panda]

Pre nerf krysae MQI was better than the GI I think

[BridgeBurner]

Robosexual wrote...

Shield gate nerf hit it hard. Good luck 2 shotting Pyro's now.

This is the biggest factor. The combination of damage loss and the removal of its ability to bypass shield gate meant that many enemy types would require a minimum of 3 shots. This also has repercussions in terms of ammo power damage (everyone went with incendiary) as there would be no bleed through damage in more instances.

Modifié par Annomander, 10 novembre 2013 - 07:38 .

[Salarian Jesus]

Ferocious Panda wrote...

Pre nerf krysae MQI was better than the GI I think

It is still a very good char/weapon combo.