1238 réponses à ce sujet

[Hellion Rex]

Darth Brotarian wrote...

For the love of all things innocent wnd pure, let it endalready. Let this stupid ideology war just end.

How would I solve it? Rocks fall, everyone died. Its the ending this war both needs and deserves.

Hardly. Stupid ideology aside, this same war type of war is still fought in a large number of contexts. You cannot just ignore it.

[Cainhurst Crow]

Mages and templars should look downa giant hole and see something shiny, jump in to try and get it, and all end up impaled on shiny jewel encrusted stalagmites.

[Hellion Rex]

Darth Brotarian wrote...

Mages and templars should look downa giant hole and see something shiny, jump in to try and get it, and all end up impaled on shiny jewel encrusted stalagmites.

Your choice. I highly doubt you will be given such an option.

[Cainhurst Crow]

Mages and templars should both do a bunch of flourishing moves, only to have some guy in slacks and a hat shoot them both with a revolver.

[Hellion Rex]

Darth Brotarian wrote...

Mages and templars should both do a bunch of flourishing moves, only to have some guy in slacks and a hat shoot them both with a revolver.

And since you just drew blood, you just gained a new maleficar.

However, I do want that cowboy hat for my new Inquisitor.

[Cainhurst Crow]

Mages and templars should end up accidently knocked into a giant sand mouth pit by a blind man bumbling into them during a much more interesting brawl.

[Lotion Soronarr]

eluvianix wrote...
Ship them all to an island? I guarantee you that the majority would fight you until the very end.

A guarantee based on what?

Kill all mages? You would have even bigger Veil tears from all this carnage and magic overuse

Carnage? Nope, there's not enough mages for their deaths to cause that.
Magical veil tears? Well, they can do that already so....

[TheKomandorShepard]

eluvianix wrote...



Kill all mages? You would have even bigger Veil tears from all this carnage and magic overuse

Not at all mages are minority if wars didn't tear veil so death of mages won't

[Hellion Rex]

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

eluvianix wrote...
Ship them all to an island? I guarantee you that the majority would fight you until the very end.

A guarantee based on what?

Kill all mages? You would have even bigger Veil tears from all this carnage and magic overuse

Carnage? Nope, there's not enough mages for their deaths to cause that.
Magical veil tears? Well, they can do that already so....

A guarantee? Lotion, think about that for a second. What person, never mind a mage, would suffer being shipped off to an island?

Carnage. Even with fewer numbers than Templar Order, if they were pool their magic, they could annihilate many in the blink of an eye.
Yes, magical veil tears. Then you have both demons AND pissed off mages to contend with.

[HiroVoid]

eluvianix wrote...

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

eluvianix wrote...
Ship them all to an island? I guarantee you that the majority would fight you until the very end.

A guarantee based on what?

Kill all mages? You would have even bigger Veil tears from all this carnage and magic overuse

Carnage? Nope, there's not enough mages for their deaths to cause that.
Magical veil tears? Well, they can do that already so....

A guarantee? Lotion, think about that for a second. What person, never mind a mage, would suffer being shipped off to an island?

Carnage. Even with fewer numbers than Templar Order, if they were pool their magic, they could annihilate many in the blink of an eye.
Yes, magical veil tears. Then you have both demons AND pissed off mages to contend with.

....*raises hand for the first option*.

I mean, unless its snake island, or some island where I'm guaranteed to die, I could understand, but if we're going there with the intention of building a community, that wouldn't be too bad.  Definitely better than dying and my life just ending there.

[Lord Raijin]

eluvianix wrote...

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

The point that you have no idea about history or how comparisons work?

Mages are segregated because they are PROVENLY dangerous - for both their safety and the safety of others. This is no false prejudice or some instance of bigotry.

We do not deny that mages are dangerous, but you can hardly expect people not to resent being locked up in a Tower their whole lives. A gilded cage is still a cage.

Ok as a pro-mage I confess that mages are dangerous... but can the pro-templars here also admit that the non-mages (Templars/seekers) can be dangerous too? If so should they be segregated as well? Mages are people, not animals.

TheKomandorShepard wrote...
agree and thats first sane argument but mages brought that on themselves

 and how exactly did the mages brought it all upon themselves? That that just insane.

[Hellion Rex]

Lord Raijin wrote...

eluvianix wrote...

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

The point that you have no idea about history or how comparisons work?

Mages are segregated because they are PROVENLY dangerous - for both their safety and the safety of others. This is no false prejudice or some instance of bigotry.

We do not deny that mages are dangerous, but you can hardly expect people not to resent being locked up in a Tower their whole lives. A gilded cage is still a cage.

Ok as a pro-mage I confess that mages are dangerous... but can the pro-templars here also admit that the non-mages (Templars/seekers) can be dangerous too? If so should they be segregated as well? Mages are people, not animals.

TheKomandorShepard wrote...
agree and thats first sane argument but mages brought that on themselves

 and how exactly did the mages brought it all upon themselves? That that just insane.

Meh, they will probably use the Blight or Tevinter as "unrefutable" evidence, yet again.<_<

Edit: However, while Sekkers and Templars are dangerous, they also cannot make a person spontaneously combust with their mind.

Modifié par eluvianix, 22 novembre 2013 - 09:14 .

[Plaintiff]

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

The point that you have no idea about history or how comparisons work?

Mages are segregated because they are PROVENLY dangerous - for both their safety and the safety of others. This is no false prejudice or some instance of bigotry.

Nobody is "proven" anything until they act.

Restricting people in any way for their potential to possibly cause harm is absurd in every single respect, and the scale of this imaginary potential damage is irrelevent. The mere base concept is moronic.

By your ridiculous logic, bodybuilders could be placed under surveillance because their potential punches would hurt people more than a normal punch. And IT professionals should be kept away from computers because of the potential damage they could do to the computer systems that govern so much of our lives.

Once you start locking people up for what they might do, you already exist in a fascist state.

[Lord Raijin]

Lotion Soronnar wrote...
They can resent it all they want.
It won't change their nature. They cannot have the exact same lives as everyone else, because they are not like everyone else.

Also, it's not for their whole lives. Proven mages can frequently go out.

Knight-Captain Cullen what are you doing on the internet?

[HiroVoid]

I've always thought RedCliffe was the best in-game evidence presented so far. If you want a writer's perspective argument though, Gaider and others have already written that they want it to be a grey area rather than a one-sided one, so at least don't be surprised if there's a lot of deaths and other acts as a result of total mage freedom since the writers have said otherwise. Of course, most people I've seen arguing here are generally in favor of some reformation of the circles.

[Hellion Rex]

HiroVoid wrote...

I've always thought RedCliffe was the best in-game evidence presented so far. If you want a writer's perspective argument though, Gaider and others have already written that they want it to be a grey area rather than a one-sided one, so at least don't be surprised if there's a lot of deaths and other acts as a result of total mage freedom since the writers have said otherwise. Of course, most people I've seen arguing here are generally in favor of some reformation of the circles.

I will take a strong reformation of the Circles if possible. I only advocate total freedom if there is no other way.

[Hellion Rex]

Lord Raijin wrote...

Lotion Soronnar wrote...
They can resent it all they want.
It won't change their nature. They cannot have the exact same lives as everyone else, because they are not like everyone else.

Also, it's not for their whole lives. Proven mages can frequently go out.

Knight-Captain Cullen what are you doing on the internet?

The Cullen line is way overpicked, and I do not believe it necessarily a viable one by which to judge the entire order.

[HiroVoid]

eluvianix wrote...

HiroVoid wrote...

I've always thought RedCliffe was the best in-game evidence presented so far. If you want a writer's perspective argument though, Gaider and others have already written that they want it to be a grey area rather than a one-sided one, so at least don't be surprised if there's a lot of deaths and other acts as a result of total mage freedom since the writers have said otherwise. Of course, most people I've seen arguing here are generally in favor of some reformation of the circles.

I will take a strong reformation of the Circles if possible. I only advocate total freedom if there is no other way.

Still, I wonder how well that goes with all people since that still means taking kids away from their families at a young age and locking them in the circle until they have learned what they need to know well enough?

[Hellion Rex]

Plaintiff wrote...

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

The point that you have no idea about history or how comparisons work?

Mages are segregated because they are PROVENLY dangerous - for both their safety and the safety of others. This is no false prejudice or some instance of bigotry.

Nobody is "proven" anything until they act.

Restricting people in any way for their potential to possibly cause harm is absurd in every single respect, and the scale of this imaginary potential damage is irrelevent. The mere base concept is moronic.

By your ridiculous logic, bodybuilders could be placed under surveillance because their potential punches would hurt people more than a normal punch. And IT professionals should be kept away from computers because of the potential damage they could do to the computer systems that govern so much of our lives.

Once you start locking people up for what they might do, you already exist in a fascist state.

Shall we begin this deadly dance again, my friend?

[HiroVoid]

eluvianix wrote...

Lord Raijin wrote...

Lotion Soronnar wrote...
They can resent it all they want.
It won't change their nature. They cannot have the exact same lives as everyone else, because they are not like everyone else.

Also, it's not for their whole lives. Proven mages can frequently go out.

Knight-Captain Cullen what are you doing on the internet?

The Cullen line is way overpicked, and I do not believe it necessarily a viable one by which to judge the entire order.

Plus, it's true.  Mages aren't like other people.  Anyone who concedes for the need for a reformed circle is still admitting that mages are different enough that some form of circle is needed especially for them.

[Hellion Rex]

HiroVoid wrote...

eluvianix wrote...

HiroVoid wrote...

I've always thought RedCliffe was the best in-game evidence presented so far. If you want a writer's perspective argument though, Gaider and others have already written that they want it to be a grey area rather than a one-sided one, so at least don't be surprised if there's a lot of deaths and other acts as a result of total mage freedom since the writers have said otherwise. Of course, most people I've seen arguing here are generally in favor of some reformation of the circles.

I will take a strong reformation of the Circles if possible. I only advocate total freedom if there is no other way.

Still, I wonder how well that goes with all people since that still means taking kids away from their families at a young age and locking them in the circle until they have learned what they need to know well enough?

I do not have all the answers. If I did, Lord knows this conflict would have been fixed without this mess. All I can do is to follow my own gut instinct, my own beliefs, and act accordingly.

[Lord Raijin]

eluvianix wrote...
Meh, they will probably use the Blight or Tevinter as "unrefutable" evidence, yet again.<_<

Edit: However, while Sekkers and Templars are dangerous, they also cannot make a person spontaneously combust with their mind.

I'm sure they'll use it, but not all mages follows the culture of the Tevinter. They just want to be left alone like the situation with Hawke.

And as far as Seekers and Templars (coughcoughKnightCommanderMeredithcoughcough) oh and (coughcoughLordSeekercoughcough)

[Hellion Rex]

HiroVoid wrote...

eluvianix wrote...

Lord Raijin wrote...

Lotion Soronnar wrote...
They can resent it all they want.
It won't change their nature. They cannot have the exact same lives as everyone else, because they are not like everyone else.

Also, it's not for their whole lives. Proven mages can frequently go out.

Knight-Captain Cullen what are you doing on the internet?

The Cullen line is way overpicked, and I do not believe it necessarily a viable one by which to judge the entire order.

Plus, it's true.  Mages aren't like other people.  Anyone who concedes for the need for a reformed circle is still admitting that mages are different enough that some form of circle is needed especially for them.

I really wish he would have qualified that line a bit better. In the sense that while mages indeed have capacity to do more than the average mundane, they are still people subject to fears, emotions, hopes, and dreams.

[HiroVoid]

As far as red templars go, they'll need to be destroyed and their source of lyrium wiped out if their state of mind in the demo says anything. I don't think I've actually seen anyone(maybe the occasional troll post?) defend the red templars from what we've seen.

[Hellion Rex]

Lord Raijin wrote...

eluvianix wrote...
Meh, they will probably use the Blight or Tevinter as "unrefutable" evidence, yet again.<_<

Edit: However, while Sekkers and Templars are dangerous, they also cannot make a person spontaneously combust with their mind.

I'm sure they'll use it, but not all mages follows the culture of the Tevinter. They just want to be left alone like the situation with Hawke.

And as far as Seekers and Templars (coughcoughKnightCommanderMeredithcoughcough) oh and (coughcoughLordSeekercoughcough)

Meredith was bats*** crazy, and hardly represents the Order in my mind. The Lord Seeker had his motivations, due to his time in Tevinter, and I can sympathize, even though I do not agree with how he treats Andrastian mages.