67 réponses à ce sujet

[MassivelyEffective0730]

Once more, a demonstration of the highly subjective opinion by txgoldrush. Mainly subjective in that he holds his own opinion on a higher level than anyone else's. He likes it therefore it must be right.

[txgoldrush]

MassivelyEffective0730 wrote...

Once more, a demonstration of the highly subjective opinion by txgoldrush. Mainly subjective in that he holds his own opinion on a higher level than anyone else's. He likes it therefore it must be right.

oh boy the mob on this thread hate the ending, they must be right.



And yeah, I do believe you anti enders don't get it, it shows as you miss the point of the story time and time again. You miss the clear foreshadowing, you miss conflict identification and the reasons why their is conflict, you miss the themes, etc.

Modifié par BioWareMod03, 14 novembre 2013 - 09:20 .

[JasonShepard]

I disagree that "Control of others, and associated conflict" is the MAIN theme of the series, although I do agree that it's a major theme.

What is the main theme though? I don't have an immediate answer to that, which to me suggests that there might not be one. I'll come back with a more thought out response later.

[MassivelyEffective0730]

txgoldrush wrote...

MassivelyEffective0730 wrote...

Once more, a demonstration of the highly subjective opinion by txgoldrush. Mainly subjective in that he holds his own opinion on a higher level than anyone else's. He likes it therefore it must be right.

oh boy the mob on this thread hate the ending, they must be right.

just giving you smug anti enders a taste of your own medicine.

And yeah, I do believe you anti enders don't get it, it shows as you miss the point of the story time and time again. You miss the clear foreshadowing, you miss conflict identification and the reasons why their is conflict, you miss the themes, etc.

I didn't say a word about the ending. That's a strawman to say it about me.

No, I was talking about you. You're holding your own viewpoint as infallible and incapable of being disproven. And coupled with that, you're dismissing any argument against you as ridiculous, thus making an appeal to ridicule fallacy. Your argument really isn't taken seriously anymore, especially considering that your also post has been repeated ad nauseum constantly. 

You've proven your not one to be listened too. You've stated your opinion, and others have moved on. I suggest you move on. Or is it hard to accept that people are "wrong" on the internet?

Modifié par MassivelyEffective0730, 14 novembre 2013 - 12:22 .

[Steelcan]

Heroism

[trenq]

Steelcan wrote...

Heroism

Characterization

[dreamgazer]

trenq wrote...

Steelcan wrote...

Heroism

Characterization

Character enhancement through the heroic deeds of sacrifice. 

[Steelcan]

dreamgazer wrote...

trenq wrote...

Steelcan wrote...

Heroism

Characterization

Character enhancement through the heroic deeds of sacrifice. 

And skimpy outfits, dont forget those...

[Rusty Sandusky]

Steelcan wrote...

dreamgazer wrote...

trenq wrote...

Steelcan wrote...

Heroism

Characterization

Character enhancement through the heroic deeds of sacrifice. 

And skimpy outfits, dont forget those...

Working for ESPN, wait wrong thread...

[GreyLycanTrope]

txgoldrush wrote...
No, you missed what I just said, so let me repeat it.

However, the theme is NOT about resolving these conflicts, ONLY that they happen.

and

[b]And in the end, Shepard him or herself has to control the destiny of others to achieve victory, but here is the difference....he or she is mindful of thoughts and feelings, especially Paragon.

There is a reason why Shepard is wary of synthesis, even when he or she isn't rebuking it, it gives him or her pause unlike the first two options.

I didn't miss it I disagree with it, you can very much resolve these conflicts on a number of occasions, or do we not have the option to release the Rachni onto the galaxy? What the player does with the the concept of conflicts and self determinism can very much effect how that theme plays out, so no your assertion is wrong.

Modifié par Greylycantrope, 14 novembre 2013 - 01:46 .

[CaptainBlackGold]

In the psychology of learning, there is an empirically demonstrable phenomenon where humans tend to find patterns, relationships and connections between random events. Even when subjects are shown that such patterns do not exist, many continue to insist that the patterns are real.

This to me is what happens when we try to find a "theme" for the Mass Effect series. The major plot points, decisions, moral problems, etc., were created by committee/business factors and therefore do not have any necessary connection with each other. Mass Effect Two contradicts Mass Effect One. The very problem the "Catalyst" insists is insolvable, in Mass Effect Three is the very issue we resolved with EDI and the Geth. The plot points/lore contradict each other because there is no real overarching theme to which all the constituent parts contribute.

Attempts to find such connections/themes are simply another example of humans imposing a pattern on random events. Sorry guys, just enjoy the ride and forget about how great it could have been....

[ImaginaryMatter]

MassivelyEffective0730 wrote...

Once more, a demonstration of the highly subjective opinion by txgoldrush. Mainly subjective in that he holds his own opinion on a higher level than anyone else's. He likes it therefore it must be right.

Ya, I'm getting that impression. I was going to post another more detailed response but then realized there would be no point; if the writers themselves wrote down what they thought the main themes were and they disagreed (which seems likely given what interviews and such are available on the subject) we'll probably get a post about how writer intentions don't mean anything. I like discussing, not throwing myself against the wall.

[txgoldrush]

MassivelyEffective0730 wrote...

txgoldrush wrote...

MassivelyEffective0730 wrote...

Once more, a demonstration of the highly subjective opinion by txgoldrush. Mainly subjective in that he holds his own opinion on a higher level than anyone else's. He likes it therefore it must be right.

oh boy the mob on this thread hate the ending, they must be right.

just giving you smug anti enders a taste of your own medicine.

And yeah, I do believe you anti enders don't get it, it shows as you miss the point of the story time and time again. You miss the clear foreshadowing, you miss conflict identification and the reasons why their is conflict, you miss the themes, etc.

I didn't say a word about the ending. That's a strawman to say it about me.

No, I was talking about you. You're holding your own viewpoint as infallible and incapable of being disproven. And coupled with that, you're dismissing any argument against you as ridiculous, thus making an appeal to ridicule fallacy. Your argument really isn't taken seriously anymore, especially considering that your also post has been repeated ad nauseum constantly. 

You've proven your not one to be listened too. You've stated your opinion, and others have moved on. I suggest you move on. Or is it hard to accept that people are "wrong" on the internet?

No, you just can't tell the difference from FACT and opinion.

The main theme I posted is a FACT. Why? Because the conflicts revolve around that theme, not just the conflict with the Reapers but the foundation of the entire Mass Effect universe.

Sorry, it is people here that just want to ignore the truth. I dismiss arguments against me because they are simply wrong. Why should I concede to wrong arguments?

And no, the anti enders built quite the strawman.

[txgoldrush]

Greylycantrope wrote...

txgoldrush wrote...
No, you missed what I just said, so let me repeat it.

However, the theme is NOT about resolving these conflicts, ONLY that they happen.

and

And in the end, Shepard him or herself has to control the destiny of others to achieve victory, but here is the difference....he or she is mindful of thoughts and feelings, especially Paragon.

There is a reason why Shepard is wary of synthesis, even when he or she isn't rebuking it, it gives him or her pause unlike the first two options.

I didn't miss it I disagree with it, you can very much resolve these conflicts on a number of occasions, or do we not have the option to release the Rachni onto the galaxy? What the player does with the the concept of conflicts and self determinism can very much effect how that theme plays out, so no your assertion is wrong.

Ok, listen to what I said again.

However, the theme is NOT about resolving these conflicts, ONLY that they happen.

This is a general statement for ALL playthroughs, like saying the main theme of Jade Empire is that disturbing the natural order leads to corruption and new problems. See I incorporated both Open Palm and Closed Fist paths here. as both deal with the problem differently, or in this case, can make it worse.

Yes, you can resolve some, but you can't resolve all. And many of these conflicts you DON'T resolve as the conflict has ended and you are left to deal with the fallout, or that the conflict meets a violent or tragic end without you.

All throughout the series, you can and will control the destinies of others to fulfill your objective. The ending is no different. The Paragon just does less damage. And Arrival really throws your argument away.

And really, the themes of the ending was foreshadowed all throughout ME3, through the conversations with many of the characters. Javik's FOB dialogue FORESHADOWS the ending. Victory is not won without cost and difficult decisions still lie ahead.

Modifié par txgoldrush, 14 novembre 2013 - 08:44 .

[txgoldrush]

CaptainBlackGold wrote...

In the psychology of learning, there is an empirically demonstrable phenomenon where humans tend to find patterns, relationships and connections between random events. Even when subjects are shown that such patterns do not exist, many continue to insist that the patterns are real.

This to me is what happens when we try to find a "theme" for the Mass Effect series. The major plot points, decisions, moral problems, etc., were created by committee/business factors and therefore do not have any necessary connection with each other. Mass Effect Two contradicts Mass Effect One. The very problem the "Catalyst" insists is insolvable, in Mass Effect Three is the very issue we resolved with EDI and the Geth. The plot points/lore contradict each other because there is no real overarching theme to which all the constituent parts contribute.

Attempts to find such connections/themes are simply another example of humans imposing a pattern on random events. Sorry guys, just enjoy the ride and forget about how great it could have been....

Are you sure you resolved the conflict of organics and synthetics with EDI and the Geth?

So suddenly, all organics would not be afraid of EDI? Yes, the crew, outside Javik, is comfortable with EDI and EDI seeks to understand organics (hell, she proves the Catalyst point that synthetics seek perfection through understand), but would all organics embrace her? I think not.

And do not ignore the doubts that the Geth and Quarian peace will last, which some of the characters do have.

You are seeing contradictions that just aren't there.

Modifié par txgoldrush, 14 novembre 2013 - 08:54 .

[AresKeith]

We just don't get it you guise

[SDW]

Sooo ... you haven't replied to the conclusion that "dictatorship is bad if you lack empathy and is good as long as you have it", by reformulating your idea of the main theme.
And that a renegade Shepard (who has proven a lack of empathy over and over again) choosing Control then must doom the galaxy to neverending bad dictatorship.
If that's really what the game wants to teach, Mass Effect has a disturbing theme.

[BioWareMod02]

 Sorry, when it comes to insults and also derailing on purpose it has to end. My wrath is upon this thread (and some of you) and this is getting locked.

https://encrypted-tb...xMJa2GYJvbINslw

Modifié par BioWareMod03, 14 novembre 2013 - 09:24 .