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[MassivelyEffective0730]

Lizardviking wrote...

MassivelyEffective0730 wrote...

StreetMagic wrote...

Rasofe wrote...
That would make Zaeed the defender of mankind because his response to the asari is "Look me in the eye and say that again." Presumably if they did he'd kill them where they stood.

I don't know much about Sanders. There's some novels about her and Anderson but I never read them.

Zaeed is. He's a badass human who survived the worst Terminus could throw at him. That's something worth celebrating. But yet, he doesn't like Cerberus either. He can't recall how many he's killed. Heh. He's brutal, but he's very much in the middle ground, as far racial stuff goes.

I get the feeling he doesn't hate Cerberus for what they are or what they do so much as they've probably pissed him off multiple times. As soon as they forward him credits though, he's back on their side. 

I always got the impression him killing Cerberus operatives was just plain business.

Pretty much. That's why I like him.

[MassivelyEffective0730]

Well, I did do my detailed analysis on why I believe Ashley was a terrible combatant. That was fun.

[Ryzaki]

Rasofe wrote...

I'm too indifferent towards Zaeed. I like how he has his own Renegade interrupts and a lot of personality, but he and Shepard are mostly just acquaintances. Similarly with Kasumi, but my tissue with her is that I don't really know why she's on the mission... kind of like I don't know why people keep potted plants around. It doesn't hurt, but why?

You never know when you're gonna need someone who always gets out alive.

Kasumi is on there because she's a hacker and you never know when it'll come in handy (you can recruit her before Legion and Tali are even options). Least that's why my Shep recruited her. And Zaeed was a merc who survived ridculous odds valuable on a SM and in a Reaper war.

Plus Zaeed's voice is awesome.

[Ryzaki]

MassivelyEffective0730 wrote...
Pretty much. That's why I like him.

? His quest makes it sound like they did something to ****** him off. But that was the game where I blew up the base does he say something different if you saved the base?

[Rasofe]

Yeah, but I get very DnD vibes from Kasumi. She's a thief. Her special ability is backstab.
And because she's paid DLC a lot of people - including myself - will have already beaten the game before meeting her.

[Steelcan]

Ryzaki wrote...

MassivelyEffective0730 wrote...
Pretty much. That's why I like him.

? His quest makes it sound like they did something to ****** him off. But that was the game where I blew up the base does he say something different if you saved the base?

I think they are talking about his talk in ME2 about it

[Ryzaki]

Freaking laggy internet

Modifié par Ryzaki, 23 novembre 2013 - 01:13 .

[Ryzaki]

Rasofe wrote...

Yeah, but I get very DnD vibes from Kasumi. She's a thief. Her special ability is backstab.
And because she's paid DLC a lot of people - including myself - will have already beaten the game before meeting her.

Oooh I meant you wanted an in-universe explanation.

Out of universe she's funny and brings some much needed levity to the crew.

@Steel: Ooooh yeah in that case he's being a typical merc

[Ryzaki]

Rasofe wrote...

Yeah, but I get very DnD vibes from Kasumi. She's a thief. Her special ability is backstab.
And because she's paid DLC a lot of people - including myself - will have already beaten the game before meeting her.

Oooh I meant you wanted an in-universe explanation.

Out of universe she's funny and brings some much needed levity to the crew.

@Steel: Ooooh yeah in that case he's being a typical merc

[Rasofe]

Yeah, I'm not saying she's grating. In ME2 I only found Jack grating and only in one of my playthroughs.
Don't know if she's that funny though. Like I said, I'm largely indifferent.

[Ryzaki]

I found Jack grating on all my playthroughs but nothing wrong with just not liking a character they're not all everyone's cup of tea.

It'd be nice if you weren't defaulted to buddy buddy with someone just because they survived the previous games but *shrug*.

[oQUETZALCOATLo]

StreetMagic wrote...

For a last game, last big war, last hurrah, last everything..they left out a lot of character depth for others. Not just the VS. This was not the way you say "goodbye" to a galaxy you spent 7 years in. By just having more Liara.

I agree entirely. Liara got LOTSB and a whole ton of content in ME3. The other character relationships and romances seemed like simple inconveniences especially  the VS. When I played ME3 I felt like Ashley was a DLC character. Liara comes to Shepard's cabin about three times for no reason. Ashley just shows up for the romance. And I feel like I shouldn't complain because Ashley wasn't the only one with missing content. I hear Miranda has close to nothing and with all the little time devoted to Tali, she might as well not be there.

[oQUETZALCOATLo]

iakus wrote...

Rasofe wrote...
Don't know about everyone else, but my disapproval of Ashley isn't because she doesn't trust Shepard, I can safely say it only got to that point in my later playthroughs. I don't like Ash because my Shepard was going to be an anthropocentrist, kind of like the Illusive Man and Miranda, but Ash isn't like that. She's just xenophobic. Then she complains about Cerberus for basically following through on the "sic your dog on them and run" philosophy while they at least evaluate the situation and have a clear goal in mind. It's a pretty rubbish goal, sure, but there's reason involved. Ashley's attitude is unreasonable, it's tied to a conflict that happened in the dawn of the ME universe humanity and an injustice that was forced on her by the Alliance and not by the aliens. Also, the way she just shrugs of any insults you throw at her but goes insane if she thinks you're an item and unfaithful pisses me off.

She doesn't like Cerberus because they go to violent extremes to see to their goals, trampling humans and aliens alike.  Far beyond "look out for your own people first", they slaughter fellow humans as quickly as aliens.

"They claim to stand for humanity, and do this to their own people"

Ashley's views were that humanity needs to stand strong on its own, not be dependant on outside forces like the Council.

And the "dawn of the ME universe for humanity" was less than forty years earlier.  Still a living memory for humanity and a sore spot for both humans and turians

I agree entirely

[Iakus]

oQUETZALCOATLo wrote...

I agree entirely. Liara got LOTSB and a whole ton of content in ME3. The other character relationships and romances seemed like simple inconveniences especially  the VS. When I played ME3 I felt like Ashley was a DLC character. Liara comes to Shepard's cabin about three times for no reason. Ashley just shows up for the romance. And I feel like I shouldn't complain because Ashley wasn't the only one with missing content. I hear Miranda has close to nothing and with all the little time devoted to Tali, she might as well not be there.

Ash felt more like a DLC character than Javik did.

Pretty sad, when you think about it

[oQUETZALCOATLo]

StreetMagic wrote...

jtav wrote...

Kaidan actually gets at least one standout moment after Jacob's mission. The problem is that Jay and strong female characters don't mix.

Plus, he's a Liara fan himself. I can't find the article now about his opinions, but he was espousing about how she embodies all the perfect qualities of a female in it. Shows just how unqualified he is to write someone like Miranda and Ash.. he doesn't even respect women like them to begin with.

Who are you reffering to?

[Ryzaki]

StreetMagic wrote...

oQUETZALCOATLo wrote...

StreetMagic wrote...

jtav wrote...

Kaidan actually gets at least one standout moment after Jacob's mission. The problem is that Jay and strong female characters don't mix.

Plus, he's a Liara fan himself. I can't find the article now about his opinions, but he was espousing about how she embodies all the perfect qualities of a female in it. Shows just how unqualified he is to write someone like Miranda and Ash.. he doesn't even respect women like them to begin with.

Who are you reffering to?

Jay Watamuniak

Wait...that's why Miranda's as interesting as watching paint dry?

I don't mind her having regrets but spending the whole game worrying about her sister was stupid. (I actually prefer the idea of being able to "paragon" her a bit) but heck she gave you like nothing to help with your mission.

Modifié par Ryzaki, 23 novembre 2013 - 01:37 .

[oQUETZALCOATLo]

iakus wrote...

oQUETZALCOATLo wrote...

I agree entirely. Liara got LOTSB and a whole ton of content in ME3. The other character relationships and romances seemed like simple inconveniences especially  the VS. When I played ME3 I felt like Ashley was a DLC character. Liara comes to Shepard's cabin about three times for no reason. Ashley just shows up for the romance. And I feel like I shouldn't complain because Ashley wasn't the only one with missing content. I hear Miranda has close to nothing and with all the little time devoted to Tali, she might as well not be there.

Ash felt more like a DLC character than Javik did.

Pretty sad, when you think about it

Completely, and to make matters worse, when you finally get another Ashley scene in the Citadel DLC the writers basically throw a huge middle finger at you and make what you hoped to be Ashley's redemption where you'd get some actual content in that wasn't either bugged or tiny compared to other characters, a moment that would show you that she's just as important or even better than the more time consuming options, really turn out to be a pointless scene where Shepard and Ashley go drinking and get interrupted half way in by a gangy batarian and his vorcha friend.
Every other romance got an apartment invite, and all this content punched into Citadel so you could get some closure, everyone excluding Ash.

[Rasofe]

Hah, that reminds me. On my very, very, VERY first playthrough of Mass Effect I had set Enter as my use key, so I got a bug when I tried to talk to Kaidan. I didn't find out about his stories about Rahna, or his turian trainer, or anything else until much later.

So it's just so funny that even from the very first playthrough he ended up being my absolute favourite character.
That's really why I've never felt the need to complain about characters like Liara or Garrus getting more spotlight, or Miranda and Kaidan getting hardly any content for ME3. Some characters in the trilogy managed to have such a tremendous impact despite getting almost no time to do so. I'm not saying I wouldn't like to have had more of them in the game, but its just that...
Some of these things are kind of random. Who you'll end up liking, who you wont. What mood you're in when you're playing, what expectations you have from the characters. It raises a whole lot of questions about how human beings function as social beings and how they gauge each other.

I'm just saying regardless of people's opinions about this, the way that Mass Effect did use its characters and the reactions of players is a very interesting subject.

Modifié par Rasofe, 23 novembre 2013 - 01:42 .

[oQUETZALCOATLo]

oQUETZALCOATLo wrote...

iakus wrote...

oQUETZALCOATLo wrote...

I agree entirely. Liara got LOTSB and a whole ton of content in ME3. The other character relationships and romances seemed like simple inconveniences especially  the VS. When I played ME3 I felt like Ashley was a DLC character. Liara comes to Shepard's cabin about three times for no reason. Ashley just shows up for the romance. And I feel like I shouldn't complain because Ashley wasn't the only one with missing content. I hear Miranda has close to nothing and with all the little time devoted to Tali, she might as well not be there.

Ash felt more like a DLC character than Javik did.

Pretty sad, when you think about it

Completely, and to make matters worse, when you finally get another Ashley scene in the Citadel DLC the writers basically throw a huge middle finger at you and make what you hoped to be Ashley's redemption where you'd get some actual content in that wasn't either bugged or tiny compared to other characters, a moment that would show you that she's just as important or even better than the more time consuming options, really turn out to be a pointless scene where Shepard and Ashley go drinking and get interrupted half way in by a gangy batarian and his vorcha friend.
Every other romance got an apartment invite, and all this content punched into Citadel so you could get some closure, everyone excluding Ash.

And actually thinking back to it, near the end of this scene Shepard says "rain check", but this never happens. Now doesn't everytime other than this that a character says "rain check" this actually happens and they follow through with their original plans?

[Ryzaki]

StreetMagic wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...
Wait...that's why Miranda's as interesting as watching paint dry?

I don't mind her having regrets but spending the whole game worrying about her sister was stupid. (I actually prefer the idea of being able to "paragon" her a bit) but heck she gave you like nothing to help with your mission.

Yeah..

In the first game, I believe it was Weekes and Walters who wrote her. And now Walters writes her in the new Foundation comic. Seems to be back to her cooler femme fatale self.

Explains so much.

I was hoping the choose between introducing her to her sister/not would lead to a paragoning/not so much for that.