45 réponses à ce sujet

[IceTrey1987]

Problems I had with the ME3 journal were mostly Citadel side quests. Some aren't that clear on which part of the citadel you need to go to and what you need to do. Nothing too terrible.

[Ryzaki]

cap and gown wrote...

At first I was rather annoyed that the journal didn't tell be where to go to deliver something, or whether I had gotten some item yet, but then I figured out you are just supposed to use the map function to see if there is anyone of interest. After that, I decided that the current system actually makes more sense. Did you you find an artifact? Who knows, check the map! Simple. People have become frustrated because BW didn't really explain that the map was now essentially part of your journal.

That and you now have to go back to the Citadel to check the map to see if you have the item. It adds an unnecessary second step. (and if you don't have said Item back to scanning with you.)

[cap and gown]

Ryzaki wrote...

That and you now have to go back to the Citadel to check the map to see if you have the item. It adds an unnecessary second step. (and if you don't have said Item back to scanning with you.)

I think it is generally a good idea to go back to the Citadel after every non-N7 quest. Dialogue advances, meet-ups happen, new quests become available, old quests can be finished up.

[Armass81]

Yes its really bad, i have no idea why they couldnt fix it, even with a patch.

Citadel map helps you find the persons tough.

[AlanC9]

Ryzaki wrote...
No he at least gives you the system.

I'll take your word for it. I suppose we could work out the percentages for fetch quests that tell you the location and fetch quests that don't. My impression is that it's only a small minority that give you a location.

So what I shouldn't do sidequests unless I want to take time to scan each and every system to 100%?

Why are you doing the fetch quests if you don't want cash and WAs?  Or if you do want cash and WAs, why aren't ypu scanning too?

Is this one of those OCD things where you're compelled to work on stuff because it's in the journal?

[cap and gown]

AlanC9 wrote...

Is this one of those OCD things where you're compelled to work on stuff because it's in the journal?

I find many players have this desire to clean up their journal. I know I do to a distrubingly large extent. You see many of the same  complaints in the Skyrim forums where players wish they could get quests out of their journal they don't wish to do. I was one of them.:innocent:

[AlanC9]

cap and gown wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...
That and you now have to go back to the Citadel to check the map to see if you have the item. It adds an unnecessary second step. (and if you don't have said Item back to scanning with you.)

I think it is generally a good idea to go back to the Citadel after every non-N7 quest. Dialogue advances, meet-ups happen, new quests become available, old quests can be finished up.

I imagine this was the design intent. The "fetch quests" aren't really quests per se, they're a way to add rewards for listening to Citadel ambient conversations and add character to the scanning. I think we're supposed to just pick them up along the way without making any particular effort to complete them.

Which may indicate another one of those disconnects between Bio's design approach and Bio's fans. 

[clarkusdarkus]

The game was as basic as they come, I blame action mode, Why delve into a journal when there's cover shooting to be had, I'll put it along with not being able to import my shepard and eing told to buy dlc at the end as my reasonings for losing faith in Bioware. I can forgive endings as such but the lack of care or polish just reeks from them lately similar to copy n paste dungeons in DA2. Scrolling up from the bottom all the time on that journal was annoying as hell.

[sr2josh]

Nashtalia wrote...

i think the ME3 journal was too simplistic compaired to the first two

Which is really strange since games usually get more complex as a trilogy progresses.

[AlanC9]

lf it's a complex game you want, you shouldn't be asking for a journal in the first place. It's a crutch so you don't have to remember things yourself. 

Modifié par AlanC9, 19 novembre 2013 - 04:45 .

[AlexMBrennan]

http://www.nerfnow.com/comic/image/567

[Linkenski]

That's a sad banner. The RPG additions in ME3 felt like a copout because they decided to nerf other things that worked fine before, most notably the dialogue wheel... and the journal. (that's not RPG elements though)

I hope Bioware generally has the idea that people dislike a lot of the fundamental changes they made with ME3 and that they're not just gonna be like "well, let's just bring in the autodialogue and the one-note journal again for ME4"

The more complex it is the better. There has to be some streamlining, but for the love of god, make it managable. Also, who the f*ck ever played Action mode? Why do they want a largely story-driven game to appeal to the CoD-is-the-only-game-in-existence gamers? Mass Effect will NEVER be that game or its name shouldn't be Mass Effect /rant

Makai81 wrote...

Nashtalia wrote...

i think the ME3 journal was too simplistic compaired to the first two

Which is really strange since games usually get more complex as a trilogy progresses.

There's a difference between gaming trilogies and movie trilogies. Stories get more complex as things progress usually (note that ME3 shat on this) but for the most part gameplay elements often get streamlined, so everything requires less know-how and is more compatible for people to jump right-in. It's a damn shame though.

Modifié par Linkenski, 19 novembre 2013 - 08:42 .

[Eryri]

I did find it odd that the usefulness of the journal was so much less than it was in ME2, or even ME1. You'd think that something fairly simple like this would improve with each iteration. The fact that it always opened at the wrong place was really quite irritating. In the end, I used the map more often to find out where I need to go.

[dreamgazer]

Let's not pretend as if ME1 and ME2 were some bastions of "complexity", though. Mass Effect has always been a straighforward, railroaded, cover-based space shooter with mild role-playing variations based on player input.

And yeah, in some areas ME3 is more complex than ME2, which is appreciated.

[AlanC9]

Linkenski wrote...

That's a sad banner. The RPG additions in ME3 felt like a copout because they decided to nerf other things that worked fine before, most notably the dialogue wheel... and the journal. (that's not RPG elements though)

I hope Bioware generally has the idea that people dislike a lot of the fundamental changes they made with ME3 and that they're not just gonna be like "well, let's just bring in the autodialogue and the one-note journal again for ME4"

Which fundamental changes are those?

The more complex it is the better. There has to be some streamlining, but for the love of god, make it managable. Also, who the f*ck ever played Action mode? Why do they want a largely story-driven game to appeal to the CoD-is-the-only-game-in-existence gamers? Mass Effect will NEVER be that game or its name shouldn't be Mass Effect /rant

Bio knows exactly who played Action mode, unless they were really incompetent with their data collection. Not just how many, but also what else they play.  So don't sweat it. Either Action mode won't come back because you're right, or it will come back because you're wrong.

Edit: I meant don't worry about Bio getting the design decision wrong. Feel free to worry about the ME playerbase not being what you'd like it to be.

There's a difference between gaming trilogies and movie trilogies. Stories get more complex as things progress usually (note that ME3 shat on this) but for the most part gameplay elements often get streamlined, so everything requires less know-how and is more compatible for people to jump right-in. It's a damn shame though.

ME1 required more know-how?Really? I remember more busywork, but it was all simple. And ME2 was simpler than ME3, wasn't it?

Edit: I may be marking ME1 down a bit far because of the way most of its systems fall apart at high levels.

Modifié par AlanC9, 19 novembre 2013 - 09:07 .

[CronoDragoon]

Linkenski wrote...
The more complex it is the better. There has to be some streamlining, but for the love of god, make it managable. Also, who the f*ck ever played Action mode? Why do they want a largely story-driven game to appeal to the CoD-is-the-only-game-in-existence gamers? Mass Effect will NEVER be that game or its name shouldn't be Mass Effect /rant

I see quite a few names in the MP forum that never come to the story forum, so clearly ME can appeal to people not in it primarily for the story. It's not your call to tell others what they should like about Mass Effect.

The only reason is if you think Action Mode caused auto-dialogue. There's zero evidence for this, and everything BioWare has said sums to "we did auto-dialogue because we thought it made for better cutscenes" and hence a better story, not that they cared less about story and therefore included auto-dialogue.

As for AD's inclusion in future games, Weekes in discussing DA mentioned how the fans' dislike was noted and taken into account for DA3.

Modifié par CronoDragoon, 19 novembre 2013 - 09:18 .

[Andrew Lucas]

I just scan every planet and then check the Citadel map to finish the quest, anyway ME3 journal isn't good...

[AlanC9]

CronoDragoon wrote...

The only reason is if you think Action Mode caused auto-dialogue. There's zero evidence for this, and everything BioWare has said sums to "we did auto-dialogue because we thought it made for better cutscenes" and hence a better story, not that they cared less about story and therefore included auto-dialogue.

I can see why Bio went that route. Now that I'm replaying ME2, I'm noticing just how pointless a lot of my uses of the dialogue wheel are. Sometimes the only thing I'm doing is choosing whether or not to hit all of the investigate options. Sometimes deciding to ask a question, or not ask it, is worthwhile for RP. Sometimes it isn't.

I suppose a common theme of recent Bio designs is that they haven't shown much interest in maintaining illusions.

Modifié par AlanC9, 19 novembre 2013 - 10:46 .

[SilJeff]

It is the proof needed to show the game was rushed. That, the ending, and the completely useless turret section on Rannoch show rushing.

I bet if they had time to not rush, we'd have a journal that is actually helpful, but eh... I still think the game was great overall, but definitely rushed.

I actually made my own journal for the game similar to Teryx's Galactic Checklists for ME1 and ME2. That way I will never need to look at the in game one. Still ticks me off about that glitch that forces the journal to start at a random mission rather than at the top

[favoritehookeronthecitadel]

The journal was terrible, really. I wish there was like, you know, a way to have little side quests that actually had an effect on the sqaud. Like impressing Liara/Ashley and get them in dat bed.

[voteDC]

AlanC9 wrote...

So what if the journal doesn't tell you where to go? The map tells you what you need to know, and if you're not at the map what does it matter where you're going?

(OK, except for two or three fetch quests.)

I'm just not seeing when this is actually a problem.

Edit: of course, I'm old enough to remember the days when you you had to write yor own damn journal.

It is more a manner of what the Journal in ME3 isn't, than what it is.

Compared to the journal in the first two games it feels somewhat 'basic'. It provides the bare minimum of information on a quest, compared to the previous versions which guided you step by step through them.