252 réponses à ce sujet

[Armass81]

StreetMagic wrote...

spirosz wrote...

What's written and what can be executed in terms of budget and time management in relation to developing a game are two very, very different things that most of you seem to forget.

We don't forget it. But the pressure they had to meet are unrealistic for this type of game in the first place. The first Mass Effect took 4 years. This only got 2 and it's twice the size. DAO got a whopping 7 years (although I think it went through many iterations and genre ideas). It can be blamed on EA specifically, not the reality of "game development" in general. EA has been accused of overworking employees before. I doubt this was any different.

Its funny tough when i look at the first game, it seems like a 90 % complete game to me even when they took so much time to finish it. Recently played through it and youll really notice some things, like the general blandness of the environments which feel like they arent finished with some things just slapped randomly on everywhere(like the copy paste bases and the general areas) and the texture popping, especially on consoles. Dont get me wrong there are great places in the game like the presidium which is beatiful, but some other areas are ugly as hell with mostly empty rooms and bland walls, they just feel unfinished.

Planet exploring aint that great either, its just a ball of rock or a wasteland with different colors time and time again. Well thats how most worlds out there are, true, but even on living world theres no animals or rivers, no bushes or trees, its just mountains and same wasteland with green. And the copypaste bases really dont help. Its great that you get to explore, but I wish it was really more exciting and visually different, this feels like its mineral gathering straight from Star Control 2 only in 3d form, and even in that game it felt more intresting when it was simply a pixel minigame. Id rather take 8 side missions with vastly different environments and life, thans 30 with the same recycled environments and places. More Grissom Academy and Rachni Planet type of side missions, less generic base number 23s where you shoot random merc and pirates for this and that reason!

The inventory seems like a mess too and the combat is like they werent sure what they wanted to do with it. Its kinda of a chore to play through the first game IMO these days, gameplay wise it just doesnt cut it. It definately shows both age and sloppiness in parts, but its still a very decent game and the best in atmosphere out of the three. The others look better and play better again IMO, but the way they feel, you get that somethings off right from the beginning of ME2. Story went into really odd directions there... they had no clue what to do... not good. 

Modifié par Armass81, 23 novembre 2013 - 03:04 .

[ruggly]

Ieldra2 wrote...



*The relays were only destroyed in Destroy
*Synthesis was described as "You may combine the synthetic and the organic." "We synthetics will become more like you, and organic life will become like us." None of that "unified DNA" nonsense. The "add your essence" bit was still in, but what followed was "The resulting chain reaction will transform both of our kind."
*Control didn't mention you dying. It said "you will take control of the Reapers and continue the cycle as you see fit".


Note that there were three different versions of the script in variable states of completeness, some much older than others. Some plots varied between the versions. In one the Catalyst was called the "Guardian" and in the oldest version the third option was described as "Shepard becomes one with the Reapers".

I have to wonder what exactly it means to become one with the reapers.  Does Shepard still die, or 'die' in that scenario?

[dreamgazer]

oQUETZALCOATLo wrote...

Do you think the bigger Mass Effect 3 that would have attempted to be the best in the series would have been stupid or unbelieveably amazing and it frustrates you to know that it didn't go as planned?

There's a mix of interesting and stupid going on in there, so who knows. 

[oQUETZALCOATLo]

ImaginaryMatter wrote...

Cheezus, that list makes it seem like an entirely different game.

agreed

[Daemul]

The stuff with Leng and choosing between the VS ans Liara seems to be from the very early script. I remember reading a later version of the script where during the Cerberus Coup you actually had to choose between Liara, who would be a mandatory squadmate for this misson, and the 2nd squadmate you brought along.

This was to be the perfect trap, seeing as people would bring their LI or favourite squadmate along as the 2nd, I can see why this was scrapped though, it was heavily stacked against Liara.

[oQUETZALCOATLo]

AlanC9 wrote...

oQUETZALCOATLo wrote...

the endings actually mattered
all characters had bigger conversations, interactions, relationship moments, and romances

What are these statements based on?

Sure, there was dialogue written  that Bio didn't end up implementing, but that's been true for every Bio game ever.

And what's the source for Leviathan not being DLC in the original plan?

in the original script it mentions the "intelligence" and his creators and actually he wasn't some holographic star child. He was a giant machine that you would fight

[Br3admax]

I'm imagining the reaction that the fanbase would have to this. I think that BioWare made the right decision is scraping a lot of this.

[themikefest]

oQUETZALCOATLo wrote...
all characters had bigger conversations, interactions, relationship moments, and romances

I wonder if there was a scene with Samantha Traynor on the Citadel where you meet up with her like the others that may of been cut. The only time is in the Citadel dlc and not the main game. 

[dreamgazer]

Br3ad wrote...

I'm imagining the reaction that the fanbase would have to this. I think that BioWare made the right decision is scraping a lot of this.

The Virmire 2.0 situation sounds incredibly artificial, that much I can agree on.

Javik being the Catalyst has potential, but it would also make the ending and the Crucible itself seem even more contrived.

The fans would probably not react well to the VS---a romantic interest for some---actively siding against Shepard.

Modifié par dreamgazer, 23 novembre 2013 - 03:57 .

[Armass81]

I was one of the first to read the leaked script on our own group and we discussed it. I was actually the one who first pointed out the whole reason for the reapers there, and it was almost the same as we got, they were created to prevent technological singularity. Only the "starchild" was referred to as "Guardian" or "intelligence", and the script with him went a bit differently, he originally explained a bit more but not as much as in EC.

He did for instance say that the synthesis changes the reapers too, making them more organic. Which is likely why they help you rebuild, they have feelings now and are freed from the catalysts grip.

There was nothing about Dark Energy even back then. Trust me. And good riddance, I say.

Modifié par Armass81, 23 novembre 2013 - 04:01 .

[Mcfly616]

I find it ridiculous that people still spew these lies and people believe them.....



Seriously, Javik was NEVER the Catalyst. Never ever.....


I have no idea where people get this from. The original script went practically unchanged from what we got in the end. Minuscule differences.

Ieldra2 wrote...

*The relays were only destroyed in Destroy *Synthesis was described as "You may combine the synthetic and the organic." "We synthetics will become more like you, and organic life will become like us." None of that "unified DNA" nonsense. The "add your essence" bit was still in, but what followed was "The resulting chain reaction will transform both of our kind." *Control didn't mention you dying. It said "you will take control of the Reapers and continue the cycle as you see fit".

That literally sounds like vague descriptions of the endings we got. Not really different.

[Ieldra]

ruggly wrote...

Ieldra2 wrote...

*The relays were only destroyed in Destroy
*Synthesis was described as "You may combine the synthetic and the organic." "We synthetics will become more like you, and organic life will become like us." None of that "unified DNA" nonsense. The "add your essence" bit was still in, but what followed was "The resulting chain reaction will transform both of our kind."
*Control didn't mention you dying. It said "you will take control of the Reapers and continue the cycle as you see fit".


Note that there were three different versions of the script in variable states of completeness, some much older than others. Some plots varied between the versions. In one the Catalyst was called the "Guardian" and in the oldest version the third option was described as "Shepard becomes one with the Reapers".

I have to wonder what exactly it means to become one with the reapers.  Does Shepard still die, or 'die' in that scenario?

The older script which is the only one having that phrase doesn't elaborate. It lacks most details and real dialogue, as it's basically a description of missions.

[Ieldra]

Mcfly616 wrote...

Ieldra2 wrote...

*The relays were only destroyed in Destroy *Synthesis was described as "You may combine the synthetic and the organic." "We synthetics will become more like you, and organic life will become like us." None of that "unified DNA" nonsense. The "add your essence" bit was still in, but what followed was "The resulting chain reaction will transform both of our kind." *Control didn't mention you dying. It said "you will take control of the Reapers and continue the cycle as you see fit".

That literally sounds like vague descriptions of the endings we got. Not really different.

Vague is better than specific and not making sense. Take Synthesis - you can put some imagination into the old description and come up with something that makes sense, but the more specific "new...DNA" and "final evolution of life" makes no sense.

[hot_heart]

Ieldra2 wrote...
The older script which is the only one having that phrase doesn't elaborate. It lacks most details and real dialogue, as it's basically a description of missions.

That would be known as a treatment or scene-by-scene rather than an actual script. Chances are, they still stuck to that but altered certain details along the way as is the norm.

[Armass81]

There were things that were scrapped, most of them in the draft, but the most obvious ones were:

- Kai Leng encounter was simplified
- Illusive Man encounter was simplified, it was originally a maze of choices that you had to navigate carefully or you and Anderson would die.
- Eden prime mission was very different. Cerberus woke up Javik and he went on a killing spree.
- Daro'Xen betrayal was removed completely and this is a real shame as it is foreshadowed and goes nowhere now. She wanted to regain the control over geth, if you didnt kill her you eventually lose 100 points in war assets or so as she manages to escape custody and corrupt some of the geth..
- Omega was originally in and plans for it were different, in the draft you visit the cerberus research station in the galactic core through omega 4 relay also. Also Zaeed was a bodyguard for a certain cerberus officer. He was also killable.
- If you let Vido escape, Zaeed explains what happened to him. He caught up with him on some world, which came under attack by the reapers while they were in a firefight. A harvester grabbed Vido and he screamed for Zaeed to shoot him, but Zaeed just walked away coldly.
- Citadel coup had some differences, it involved Thane and Kasumi more. Udina was petitioning the council to abandon the hanar homeworld to the reapers in favor of regrouping for a counterstrike or something. Thane was the one who shot Udina in one version.
- There was a Citadel sidemission, where you go with Emily Wong and Khalisa Al Jilani to investigate and expose Terra Firma and Charles Saracino, who are on the Citadel to spread anti alien sentiments. They turn out to be manipulated by Cerberus, surprise surprise.
- Sanctuary was different. There was a new cut reaper enemy called the Pariah which tormented you with voices and hallucinations the whole time, and it had horrific scenes of people screaming in cages lowered to the dragons teeth spikes.

Modifié par Armass81, 23 novembre 2013 - 04:28 .

[dreamgazer]

It still sounds like Omega was separate from the rest of the story, so they still could have been planning for that to be DLC.

[MegaIllusiveMan]

I can see the problem here...

It was leaked. So that the sales didn't lowered, they released a completly different game

Next time, on the next ME, don't mention anything in the Internet.

Also, I can see why Javik isn't the Catalyst anymore, since buying a DLC would never give you a super advantage in a war.

Also, from what I saw in 2012 Trailers, Shepard could was wearing Cerberus Clothes on Earth on the Prologue. And could wear armor and grab a Revenant.

Also, you were fighting Cerberus in Rannoch, not Geth.(Maybe it wasn't Rannoch in the time??)

Edit: Ah, how could I forget??

Sidonis and Vido Santiago were planned to appear in the game

Sidonis would save Garrus' Family and help them off Palaven.

Modifié par MegaIllusiveMan, 23 novembre 2013 - 04:18 .

[MegaIllusiveMan]

Armass81 wrote...

- There was a Citadel sidemission, where you go with Emily Wong and Khalisa Al Jilani to investigate and expose Terra Firma and Charles Saracino, who are on the Citadel to spread anti alien sentiments. They turn out to be manipulated by Cerberus, surprise surprise.

Then we ended with Emily Wong Dead because of a twitter and Khalisa having a simple conversation on the Citadel.

They also cut Dark Energy Plot and Terra Firma's.

Edit: Twitter, not E-Mail

Modifié par MegaIllusiveMan, 23 novembre 2013 - 04:27 .

[Br3admax]

I'm not sure that any of this makes anymore sense than the current game. Some of it makes less sense.

[Mcfly616]

Ieldra2 wrote...

Mcfly616 wrote...

Ieldra2 wrote...

*The relays were only destroyed in Destroy *Synthesis was described as "You may combine the synthetic and the organic." "We synthetics will become more like you, and organic life will become like us." None of that "unified DNA" nonsense. The "add your essence" bit was still in, but what followed was "The resulting chain reaction will transform both of our kind." *Control didn't mention you dying. It said "you will take control of the Reapers and continue the cycle as you see fit".

That literally sounds like vague descriptions of the endings we got. Not really different.

Vague is better than specific and not making sense. Take Synthesis - you can put some imagination into the old description and come up with something that makes sense, but the more specific "new...DNA" and "final evolution of life" makes no sense.

I thought it made sense (as do other people), but that's irrelevant. What I'm saying is that the original script vaguely describes the endings, whereas what you're doing is taking your own imagination of what could be and applying it to vague descriptions. You're implying they were different. When in reality, they could be exactly what we got (just in the writers words)

[Armass81]

MegaIllusiveMan wrote...

Armass81 wrote...

- There was a Citadel sidemission, where you go with Emily Wong and Khalisa Al Jilani to investigate and expose Terra Firma and Charles Saracino, who are on the Citadel to spread anti alien sentiments. They turn out to be manipulated by Cerberus, surprise surprise.

Then we ended with Emily Wong Dead because of an E-mail and Khalisa having a simple conversation on the Citadel.

They also cut Dark Energy Plot and Terra Firma's.

Dark Energy plot was never in there, even in the draft.

[Mcfly616]

MegaIllusiveMan wrote...

It was leaked. So that the sales didn't lowered, they released a completly different game

no, they didn't. The game is hardly different, if not practically the same.

Also, I can see why Javik isn't the Catalyst anymore, since buying a DLC would never give you a super advantage in a war.

He was never the Catalyst. Not in the old script. Not ever.

[MegaIllusiveMan]

Well, I heard that there was a Dark Energy Plot in the game... Well, my mistake, sorry.

Also, there was meant to have a confrontation with Kai Leng on the Normandy.

ME3 Restored Content, please! ROFL

[MegaIllusiveMan]

Mcfly616 wrote...

MegaIllusiveMan wrote...

It was leaked. So that the sales didn't lowered, they released a completly different game

no, they didn't. The game is hardly different, if not practically the same.

Also, I can see why Javik isn't the Catalyst anymore, since buying a DLC would never give you a super advantage in a war.

He was never the Catalyst. Not in the old script. Not ever.

.

Well, I'm talking about what I read from the OP, not from General Knowledge since I didn't even read the original Script.

But if he wasn't, well, again, my mistake

[teh DRUMPf!!]

oQUETZALCOATLo wrote...

the endings actually mattered

lol.

It was the exact same thing as what we got, only the dialogue was different.

And the Catalyst was called "the Guardian." Still, same RGB endings (and no, it wasn't IT, either).

Modifié par HYR 2.0, 23 novembre 2013 - 04:29 .