Alaric123 wrote...
Going out on a limb here but couldn't their 'malformed' horns be a result of continued genetic splicing, at least the magical equivalent. Because if they did have the same traits as Dragons, then as the comics say, they would all be capable of greatness, just like King Calenhad.
Sandal's prophecy also said "everyone will be just like they were". With the Veil now tearing and Dragon's returning to Thedas in great numbers and strength, perhaps we could see a change in the Grey Giants?
Could be. Add to that the possibility that The Qun was assimilated by the part of the kossith population that didn't have that much draconic blood and powers and it might lead to something. At the moment we know too little about this aspect of them and we don't really know the nature of the dragon horns and spikes. We can only speculate.
They could all be reavers from what we know, but because of their attempts to inhibe the dragon part of them, the only effects on their bodies are the physical ones. The Saarebas might be a step back to their kossith heritage.
The Veil Tears might indeed amplify their powers.
DRTJR wrote...
the Qun seems to be the philosophy of bureaucracy. I am half expecting the ministry of silly walks devesion of the Qunari
Yes,they are indeed a strange bunch.
Let me show you and the rest of the ones that read this thread why I suspect the Ariqun of something fishy.
I advise everyone to read the numbers from the start to the end and not skip parts of what I'm about to say because the values are connected and you might not understand what I'm saying.
The Qunari population:The Qun is a multi-racial philosophy/religion.Most of the Qunari are grey giants. Let's say that 70% of their population is made from grey giants and 30% from humans,elves,fex and possibly a few dozens dwarves.
Triumvirate distributionWe know that The Qunari have a triumvirate organizing system - Arishok ( the soldiers - always male), Arigena ( the craftsmen - always female ) and Ariqun ( the priesthood - mixed )
Let's divide their population based on this principle - when it comes to the other races, each represent 10%.When it comes to the qunari let's divide them like this - 30% Arishok, 20 % Arigena, 20 % Ariqun ( the army get's a boost do to their war efforts )
That would mean that the Qunari are distributed like this : 40% Arishok , 30 % Arigena, 30% Ariqun.
AriqunTaking in consideration the above precenteges, the Ariqun would be made 33,34 % other races and 66,66% grey giants. I will use 30% and 70% to ease the calculations.
Ben-HassrathLet's apply the same numbers that we applied to the whole of The Ariqun to The Ben-Hassrath - 30% other races, 70% grey giants.
The wiki says that most of the Ben-Hassrath members are hornless. I believe that it refers only to the grey giant members,but I'll take them and the other races members together.
Let's also apply the 70 - 30 percentage here - 70% of the Ben-Hassrath is made from members of other races and hornless grey giants while 30% is made from horned grey giants.
We know that Qunari prefer to send members of other races in missions outside of Qun controlled lands. It's safe to assume that they make the bulk of the spies and agents.Let's say that the 70% that makes the hornless grey giants and other races members is divided like this : 40% grey giants, 30% other races.
From those 30% let's say that 20% act as spies and agents.
While the Qunari prefer their spies and agents to be from other races that doesn't mean that there are no grey giant agents.Most of them should be hornless, so that they can easier blend in.Let's say that from those 40% hornless grey giants, 10% get tasks that involves work in other lands. Let's not forget that there might be agents that are horned grey giants. They would have to be in the minority. Let's say that out of those 30% horned grey giants, 5% percent work beyond the lands controlled by The Qunari.
In the end we have this figures :
Out of all the Ben-Hassrath Qunari we have 35% working as spies and agents in foreign lands ( 20% other races, 10% hornless grey giants and 5 % horned grey giants ).
That would leave 65 % percent members of the Ben-Hassrath to work in the Qunari controlled lands to police the population, to enforce the religious law and re-educate the Qunari that don't follow the laws and the new converts ( 10% other races, 30 % hornless grey giants and 25% horned grey giants ).
Hornlessness frequencyIt is a known fact that hornless qunari are rare. We don't really know how rare. I will take it this way : 90% of the qunari have horns while 10% don't ( it might a little to much, but it make my work easier ).
If we take those numbers in consideration, it would mean that from all The Qun followers,
7% are hornless grey giants and 63% are horned. We know that the hornless grey giants are not exclusive to the Arishok, Arigena or Ariqun so,if we look back at the triumvirate and divide this values, things would be like this :
Arishok : 10% other races, 28% horned grey giants, 2% hornless grey giants
Arigena: 10% other races, 18% horned grey giants, 2% hornless grey giants
Ariqun: 10% other races,17% horned grey giants. 3% hornless grey giants ( The Ariqun gets an extra 1% because of their Ben-Hassrath policy )
Conclusion:Now, please explain me how the Ben-Hassrath doesn't sound fishy.
Only 3% of all The Ariqun members are hornless grey giants, while The Ben-Hassrath is made from
40% hornless grey giants ( 30% work in Qunari lands, 10% outside ), 30% percent other races ( 10% work in Qunari lands, 20% outisde ) and
30% horned grey giants ( 25% work in Qunari lands, 5% outside ) Why would a doctrine that is based on skills and capacities, where the way you look or what race you are doesn't matter, have such a discrepance ?
In The Qun the most beautiful lady elf to ever exist might end up as a latrine cleaner if she doesn't show herself capable of anything more while a human male that has his face so deformed that it cause instant puke to his beholders, if he's still able to see,hear and speak he might end up as a Sten or even The Arishock if he shows that he's a good warrior,strategist and leader.
Now I ask you : Why is the lack of horns so important ?
The Ben-Hassrath and The Ariqun know something that the rest of The Qunari don't. I've got the felling that they're not playing fair.
Let's say that, by absurd, The Qunari go through a civil war because of something The Aritshok learns about the priests ( I believe that the chances for this to happen are lower than 1%, but I'll play on ).
Who do you think the Qunari will follow and whom they will consider Tal-Vashoth ? The ones that are responsible with expanding their lands and protecting the population or the ones that protect The Qun ? The Qunari are a crazy bunch. These are my predicaments for such an unlikely scenario.
A few members of The Ariqun will help the The Arishok, somewhere between 1/3 and 2/3 of The Arishok members will help The Ariqun and The Arigena will almost exclusevly help The Ariqun, providing them with supplies and maybe some of its members might prove better suited for The Ben-Hassrath.
I might add that the training a low ranked Ben-Hassrath agent gets seems to outmach the one a Qunari soldier gets.
EXTRA The Qunari mage policy and dreams.Why the Qunari treat their mages like animals ? Why teach them to comit suicide if they don't have a handler ?
You might say that it is their way of dealing with possible demonic possessions. Here I agree, but I believe that there's more to it. If we look at my previous posts, we can deduce that it might be an ancient grudge against the kossith.
What I didn't take in consideration is the possibility that they might have dragon blood. Even if the presence of draconic blood has been thinned by their selective breeding program and by the possibility that the first followers of The Qun didn't have that much dragon blood in their veins as the highborn kossith's from the beginning, it should make a difference when it comes to mages.
Dragon blood is very potent and it can make a mage very powerful. Look at Aurelian Titus - dragonfire and Somniari like powers that might have been given by it . By keeping them under control they prevent them from using their full potential.
Also, take in consideration the possibility of a Saarebas that has been possesed. While he might not be able to tap into all the powers of the dragon blood, if he could at all, a demon would surely be able to. A grey giant mage abomination might be one of the most dangerouss abominations known to Thedas. Somewhere at the same rank as a Somniari Abomination.
If I had to chose the winner of a 1vs 1 fight between a Saarebas Pride Abomination and an Archdemon, I would chose the Saarebas.
Imagine if the grey giants have Somniari and if one gets possesed by a Pride Demon...
This could also be the reason why qunari don't dream. They teach themselves and are tought to conscientiously dream and to stop their dreams from the moment they start. Sten was the companion that was able to almost immediately observe that what he saw in The Fade wasn't real. Because he was trained to see this things and to stop them at once ( do to the condition of his dreaming he couldn't escape because of the Sloth Demon spell ).
Why would they train themselves in such ways ? Maybe because the dragon blood might be able to make a Saarebas a Somniari, just like we saw with Aurelian Titus in the comics. The risk of a rogue Saarebas that finds out of what he's capable of is so great that the Qunari train themselves to observe that they are dreaming and stop it as fast as possible to prevent a Somniari from using his power on them.
When Sten says that "qunari don't dream" he might say that they don't allow themselves to dream, not that they are not capable of it.
Modifié par JulianWellpit, 27 novembre 2013 - 05:51 .
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